Bumped a rock: advice required

[Bristolfashion]

So, coming into Ardglass Harbour last night - a bit late/tired/dark - and the Admiral had, unusually, been seasick. Anyway, despite having been there before and following the buoyage, we "bumped" a rock*. We were at tick over (less than 2knots) and sort of bumped across a bit - easy reverse off.

Through the water, it looks like a little anti foul has gone from the keel edge, but possibly not the white epoxy underneath.

So, when deciding what to do, on consulting the internet, the result is probably somewhere between "I do it all the time, don't worry" and "major rebuild". Most articles / advice seem to concern modern boats coming to a devastating stop at speed.

What is the collective wisdom?

The boat is a Sadler 29 bilge keel (which I would have thought was relatively tough and meant to take the odd bump when taking the ground).

Keels are cast iron

There's no evident damage inside or out.

Weirdly, the keel bolts, which appear massive, are glassed over. No sign of anything.

So, lift for an immediate check, have a look next time we lift/take the ground or forget about it.

Thanks, as even, for reading.

* The Admiral was steering and the bump happened immediately after I'd said, "don't go too close to that mark"! For marital harmony, I may not mention this again.

 

[Bristolfashion]

To give a little more insight into the severity - we were both standing in the cockpit and didn't even sway or stagger - pretty gentle really.

 

[RivalRedwing]

Hi

'have a look next time we lift/take the ground' or unless you notice a change that could be linked to it. Forgetting completely about it can be an unwise move

 

[Bristolfashion]

Hi

'have a look next time we lift/take the ground' or unless you notice a change that could be linked to it. Forgetting completely about it can be an unwise move

Sage advice. Thank you.

 

[dunedin]

That was unfortunate, but sounds like you were fairly lucky - hitting granite even at 2 knots can do a lot of damage, including to people on board. The fact that didn’t get bowled over suggests perhaps a more glancing blow.
But might be worth informing your insurers now, in case when you do inspect it needs a more substantial repair.
PS The admiral will rightly point out that the navigator should have given instructions much sooner, as evidenced by the impact happening “immediately after” the advice!

 

[Refueler]

I have a party trick with my Sunrider 25 .... GRP bilge keels ..... 'driving boat' over obstructions - through mud etc.

One cruise in Swedish islands ... we took a shortcut through a channel and were edging way through at about 2kts ... BUMP ... stopped.

Steve went forward and reckoned he could see only rocks all around ... decision ? try reverse out - not so easy with the big prop that swings stern to port regardless of rudder ... or try go fwd ....

With Steve up forward - we drove OVER the rocks for about 10m .... then she was through and clear.

That was in 2011 ..... she has been lifted a few times since then ... and keels are still fine ...

IMHO ... Sadler 29 is not one of your later boats that I would have more concern for. I would suggest that on a drying mooring and rough weather .... hard or semi hard ground ... you could have far more force applied to the keels.

As to .... "But might be worth informing your insurers now, in case when you do inspect it needs a more substantial repair."

That is something I would NOT do .... IMHO ....

If that concerned ... why not take a sail to a drying out area and have a look ??

 

[johnalison]

The Swedes reckon that if you don’t hit a rock at least once every couple of years you aren’t trying hard enough. Personally, I am happy enough to hit mud but not rocks. With a Sadler 29 I would be one of the ‘just keep an eye on it’ camp. If there is no sign around the keel bolts and the boat looks ok next time she’s hauled out I would sleep soundly, but I am just a boat owner, not an engineer. With an encapsulated keel it might be different.

 

[Bobc]

To give a little more insight into the severity - we were both standing in the cockpit and didn't even sway or stagger - pretty gentle really.

Just forget it. The worst you will have done is scraped a bit of paint off.

 

[Daydream believer]

I did not have a chart plotter the first time I went (2012)into Ardglass so at the IALA buoy just before the final turn left I knew what to do as I was using a chart, a compass, coastal pilot book & Reeds.
The second time, 2 years later in 2014, I was using a chart plotter( useless things) as I had motored up the coast from DunLaoghaire in zero wind. I was being lazy. Did not have a compass set on deck. No Reeds to hand. No chart either. As I approached the same buoy the chart plotter went dead. It seems that there is no chart for the inside of the harbour. Panic struck . I could not even recall which way was north as I was totally disorientated for a few seconds & could not work out what side of the buoy to go as it was only 2 boat lengths away.

Why the idiot Irish decided to stick an IALA buoy in the approach channel that is marked quite adequately with port & stbd hand poles is beyond me. I expect they nicked it from somewhere & did not know what to do with it, so stuck it in the way. Look what we got

I decided to take it to stbd, but really close. This being on the assumption (& we all know the definition of assumption) that whatever side of the obstruction it was, there would be room for a boats fin.
No such luck. Like the Op, I was doing only 2 knots but I still went base over apex over the mainsheet traveller as the boat stopped dead, but I did not. Meanwhile some poncy knowit alls looked on, thinking to themselves " what a prat"
So sympathy with the Op on hitting a rock at Ardglass. Bloody place is littered with them
Was this the one the OP hit?


Can be seen in the approach channel on the right in this picture

 

[LittleSister]

I'm with Bobc: given the cast iron keels, the forces they routinely have to handle (which are fore and aft as well as lateral), and the gentleness of your bump, I think it will be absolutely fine other than the loss of a little anti-fouling.

 

[Bristolfashion]

I did not have a chart plotter the first time I went (2012)into Ardglass so at the IALA buoy just before the final turn left I knew what to do as I was using a chart, a compass, coastal pilot book & Reeds.
The second time, 2 years later in 2014, I was using a chart plotter( useless things) as I had motored up the coast from DunLaoghaire in zero wind. I was being lazy. Did not have a compass set on deck. No Reeds to hand. No chart either. As I approached the same buoy the chart plotter went dead. It seems that there is no chart for the inside of the harbour. Panic struck . I could not even recall which way was north as I was totally disorientated for a few seconds & could not work out what side of the buoy to go as it was only 2 boat lengths away.

Why the idiot Irish decided to stick an IALA buoy in the approach channel that is marked quite adequately with port & stbd hand poles is beyond me. I expect they nicked it from somewhere & did not know what to do with it, so stuck it in the way. Look what we got

I decided to take it to stbd, but really close. This being on the assumption (& we all know the definition of assumption) that whatever side of the obstruction it was, there would be room for a boats fin.
No such luck. Like the Op, I was doing only 2 knots but I still went base over apex over the mainsheet traveller as the boat stopped dead, but I did not. Meanwhile some poncy knowit alls looked on, thinking to themselves " what a prat"
So sympathy with the Op on hitting a rock at Ardglass. Bloody place is littered with them
Was this the one the OP hit?
View attachment 158035

Can be seen in the approach channel on the right in this picture
View attachment 158036

Not that one, but the one on the right in this picture looking outwards from the pontoons - at much lower tide of course, but there is a big chunk of rock to seaward under that thin post.

We also had a couple of wise observers making "helpful" comments!

Link to photo below

New

 

[Daydream believer]

We also had a couple of wise observers making "helpful" comments!

You are right. The onlookers love it
They are worse than forumites when they get going

 

[oldmanofthehills]

I did not have a chart plotter the first time I went (2012)into Ardglass so at the IALA buoy just before the final turn left I knew what to do as I was using a chart, a compass, coastal pilot book & Reeds.
The second time, 2 years later in 2014, I was using a chart plotter( useless things) as I had motored up the coast from DunLaoghaire in zero wind. I was being lazy. Did not have a compass set on deck. No Reeds to hand. No chart either. As I approached the same buoy the chart plotter went dead. It seems that there is no chart for the inside of the harbour. Panic struck . I could not even recall which way was north as I was totally disorientated for a few seconds & could not work out what side of the buoy to go as it was only 2 boat lengths away.

Why the idiot Irish decided to stick an IALA buoy in the approach channel that is marked quite adequately with port & stbd hand poles is beyond me. I expect they nicked it from somewhere & did not know what to do with it, so stuck it in the way. Look what we got

I decided to take it to stbd, but really close. This being on the assumption (& we all know the definition of assumption) that whatever side of the obstruction it was, there would be room for a boats fin.
No such luck. Like the Op, I was doing only 2 knots but I still went base over apex over the mainsheet traveller as the boat stopped dead, but I did not. Meanwhile some poncy knowit alls looked on, thinking to themselves " what a prat"
So sympathy with the Op on hitting a rock at Ardglass. Bloody place is littered with them
Was this the one the OP hit?
View attachment 158035

Can be seen in the approach channel on the right in this picture
View attachment 158036

We loved that bathing folly (and indeed the rest of ardglass,) but missed the rocks.

Unlike between Iona and Mull Bull Sound, and some other minor scottish semi-enclosed pool. Admittedly we now have a long keeler but I have caught bilges on ledges in our earlier boat trying to get into watchet early. The trick is to creep in and not charge in at 4kt as we saw someone do.

 

[Stemar]

I'm with the check it next time you dry out crowd. If you'd done any real damage, I'd expect signs of stress - cracks or crazing in the GRP near the front or back of the relevant keel, If there's no sign of that and no new leaks, I reckon there's vey little likelihood of damage beyond chipped paint.

When you're going to dry out, having the wherewithal to rub down the chips, treat rust and slap a bit of epoxy on will buy time until the next liftout.

 

[peter gibbs]

So, coming into Ardglass Harbour last night - a bit late/tired/dark - and the Admiral had, unusually, been seasick. Anyway, despite having been there before and following the buoyage, we "bumped" a rock*. We were at tick over (less than 2knots) and sort of bumped across a bit - easy reverse off.

Through the water, it looks like a little anti foul has gone from the keel edge, but possibly not the white epoxy underneath.

So, when deciding what to do, on consulting the internet, the result is probably somewhere between "I do it all the time, don't worry" and "major rebuild". Most articles / advice seem to concern modern boats coming to a devastating stop at speed.

What is the collective wisdom?

The boat is a Sadler 29 bilge keel (which I would have thought was relatively tough and meant to take the odd bump when taking the ground).

Keels are cast iron

There's no evident damage inside or out.

Weirdly, the keel bolts, which appear massive, are glassed over. No sign of anything.

So, lift for an immediate check, have a look next time we lift/take the ground or forget about it.

Thanks, as even, for reading.

* The Admiral was steering and the bump happened immediately after I'd said, "don't go too close to that mark"! For marital harmony, I may not mention this again.

3 main possibilities arise; keel dented but no upsetting of keel / hull interface or, seal disturbed or, hull weakened locally by impact. The chances of structural damage are slight on the description given, boats are made to withstand mild impacts especially glancing blows. Put her on the hard and check round. If in doubt look around other vessels on the hard for comparison- almost all will show impacts below the waterline.

 

[William_H]

Was folowing a friend in a 30fter a while back. He hit a rock very near the marker post at about 5knots. Some minor injuries to crew and skipper. What was spectacular was the way the transomn rose up about 70cms then dropped down. No damage to keel on inspection. Keel cast iron.
My keel is lead encapsulated in GRP. For 40 odd years I have regularly hit things. Seems every winter I am repairing GRP with filler etc. No real problems. Figure If I don't run aground occasionally I am not trying.(racing) My keel is a vertically dropping semi balasted with a bolt at back end to hold it down. (which usually gets bent in taking the impact) I would suggest to OP any insurance excess would exceed cost of any repairs if any. ol'will

 

[Daedelus]

Mrs D and I were at the Malo boats one year at the Southampton boat show when the builder happened to be there. He suggested we sail in Swedish waters, my comment was it's full of rocks, he said "but everybody hits them, that's why I build these boats so you can hit a rock at 6 knots and do only cosmetic damage. Then at the end of the season I put your boat under cover and repair any damage."

 

[dunedin]

Mrs D and I were at the Malo boats one year at the Southampton boat show when the builder happened to be there. He suggested we sail in Swedish waters, my comment was it's full of rocks, he said "but everybody hits them, that's why I build these boats so you can hit a rock at 6 knots and do only cosmetic damage. Then at the end of the season I put your boat under cover and repair any damage."

I think that is salesman’s talk. Yes many Scandinavian built boats have designed and built in features to reduce the consequences of hitting a rock. But hitting solid rock at 6 knots does a lot more than just cosmetic damage - people get hurt, engines can move / break mountings etc. Even our Swedish surveyor had to lift his folkboat for repair after “kissing a rock” at less than 6 knots.
But I am sure the Malo will suffer less damage than most if hit a rock gently at 2-3 knots.

 

[johnalison]

I think that is salesman’s talk. Yes many Scandinavian built boats have designed and built in features to reduce the consequences of hitting a rock. But hitting solid rock at 6 knots does a lot more than just cosmetic damage - people get hurt, engines can move / break mountings etc. Even our Swedish surveyor had to lift his folkboat for repair after “kissing a rock” at less than 6 knots.
But I am sure the Malo will suffer less damage than most if hit a rock gently at 2-3 knots.

A friend of a friend hit a rock in the Solent on the first time he took his new Malo out. As far as I remember from long ago, the keel was encapsulated and needed extensive repair, though in general I have respect for their yachts.

 

[Beelzebub]

Mask, snorkel and flippers:- go over the side and take a look for yourself. Alternatively, get somebody else to do it for you with the promise of a couple of pints.