Bulbs as Heaters

[ghostlymoron]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

The only advantage of a bulb is the price. I may be thick but would go for a tube heater, its probably cheaper in the long run.

 

[Ian_Rob]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

The only advantage of a bulb is the price. I may be thick but would go for a tube heater, its probably cheaper in the long run.

Your right! I will look at 2 x 60w tube heaters.

 

[dom]

It's not only the engine cooling circuit. Living in the south of England, I'm fairly relaxed about the engine - the freshwater cooling circuit is protected with antifreeze and its exceedingly unlikely that the raw water side will ever freeze. My concern is more the drinking water supply to the boat - that could freeze and burst pipes.

I was really just making a lighthearted response to Paul who is arguing against the need for any kind of heat source.

It is true that seawater is somewhat safer here in the Southern UK, but even that freezes at circa -2C and it was minus 8C in Oxford earlier this week. In fact my Surrey garden has been white since Tuesday morning! I would nevertheless take the point that the large thermal mass of an engine block insulated within a boat is not that exposed to seawater freezing during just the odd nasty night.

And as you say the calorifier, drinking water pipework, pumps, (bilge and freshwater) are all arguably more exposed to freezing. That's got to make a couple of those thermostatically controlled tube heaters worth their weight in
......well at least titanium

 

[maby]

....

It is true that seawater is somewhat safer here in the Southern UK, but even that freezes at circa -2C and it was minus 8C in Oxford earlier this week. In fact my Surrey garden has been white since Tuesday morning! I would nevertheless take the point that the large thermal mass of an engine block insulated within a boat is not that exposed to seawater freezing during just the odd nasty night.

...:

ah, but Oxford is a long way from the sea - your minus 8 probably translates to more like zero in Southampton for a boat floating in the marina. I have remote monitoring in the boat and the temperature in the totally unheated cabin has not dropped below 5 degrees even in the middle of the night this week. The engine compartment, deep down and more or less surrounded by sea water, will not be any colder than that and probably a degree or two higher.

 

[dom]

ah, but Oxford is a long way from the sea - your minus 8 probably translates to more like zero in Southampton for a boat floating in the marina. I have remote monitoring in the boat and the temperature in the totally unheated cabin has not dropped below 5 degrees even in the middle of the night this week. The engine compartment, deep down and more or less surrounded by sea water, will not be any colder than that and probably a degree or two higher.

For a boat in the water there's no argument; it sits in a great big 5-10C thermal bath.

Re the Southampton weather details: according to the met the lowest temp last night was -4.2C and -3.8C the night before. The station low was -8,2C on 10/1/09.
http://www.southamptonweather.co.uk/hilowavg.php

A few days out of the water in those kind of conditions could easily cause problems. At least for me the risk reward for a couple of tube heaters remains skewed well to the upside.

 

[No Regrets]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

Probably not as thick as thinking a tube heater in the engine compartment will somehow protect my engine from whatever the left over seawater is doing to my already 35 year old engine. Doh!

One would assume that unless you are a complete retard, you would have thrown some antifreeze into your raw water system and run your 35 year old chunks of steel for ten seconds before walking away...:ambivalence:

 

[No Regrets]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

There is indeed a big difference between boats winterised OUT of the water and IN the water!

While the water itself is unlikely to approach any nasty degrees, one has to consider the possibility of damage from above.

While your engine may be protected by Antifreeze, there will almost certainly be bits that are not.

Domestic systems cannot, or at least should not be ignored, unless you want to power up your water pump in March, and listen to your pump chittering away while the taps are still turned firmly off.....

Surely it's less of a risk (And thats how boating people work isn't it?) to just pay a bit of money and leave heating on throughout winter, ensuring there should be no risk of any problems, any of which would cost more to fix than the paltry 'levy bill.

I pay around £100 per Winter to heat my Fore cabin and Aft-cabin (Which fortunately encircle my engine bay completely!) which endure both cabins are relatively warm and dry, hence protected from extremes, whilst protecting the big Green turds which masquerade as Engines for the Summer months.

Its cheaper to heat them than to fully Winterise them! Whats more I have a warm toasty boat every time I come aboard!

Small change.... :encouragement:

 

[blackbeard]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

Let's just ask: has anyone with a boat moored in salt water around the UK ever had the engine water freeze? or, for that matter, had the domestic water supply freeze?
I acknowledge that boats ashore are a different matter entirely.
Despite which, my boat, still afloat, has a tube heater which is (I trust) keeping the temperature up a little - not so much to keep the boat warm, as to ensure everything stays dry so I don't get mildew (though, again, that seems a much bigger risk if the boat is ashore).

 

[maby]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

One would assume that unless you are a complete retard, you would have thrown some antifreeze into your raw water system and run your 35 year old chunks of steel for ten seconds before walking away...:ambivalence:

The really intelligent solution is to recognise that some of the best sailing is between December and March when the water is almost empty and you can go out in crisp days under a cloudless blue sky - keep that boat in the water and use it! It is still costing you money out in the boatyard, and it's much more vulnerable to frost and storm damage!

 

[maby]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

Let's just ask: has anyone with a boat moored in salt water around the UK ever had the engine water freeze? or, for that matter, had the domestic water supply freeze?
I acknowledge that boats ashore are a different matter entirely.
Despite which, my boat, still afloat, has a tube heater which is (I trust) keeping the temperature up a little - not so much to keep the boat warm, as to ensure everything stays dry so I don't get mildew (though, again, that seems a much bigger risk if the boat is ashore).

It depends very much on where you are located - there have been reports on this forum of boats afloat in the north suffering engine damage, but I've never heard any report of a boat along the south coast having problems.

 

[No Regrets]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

The really intelligent solution is to recognise that some of the best sailing is between December and March when the water is almost empty and you can go out in crisp days under a cloudless blue sky - keep that boat in the water and use it! It is still costing you money out in the boatyard, and it's much more vulnerable to frost and storm damage!

Mine is in, but it's not entirely safe, so heaters are on. Cheap insurance...

 

[ghostlymoron]

One or two of these would do. I think they have built in frost stat but at 60 w it doesn't really matter. http://cpc.farnell.com/eterna/th1/tubular-heater-60w-1ft/dp/HG00258

 

[Ian_Rob]

One or two of these would do. I think they have built in frost stat but at 60 w it doesn't really matter. http://cpc.farnell.com/eterna/th1/tubular-heater-60w-1ft/dp/HG00258

Thanks very much.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

One would assume that unless you are a complete retard, you would have thrown some antifreeze into your raw water system and run your 35 year old chunks of steel for ten seconds before walking away...:ambivalence:

No, i must be a complete retard because i didn't do any of that.

I have monitored the temp onboard and it hasn't dropped below 5C though. Oh, the marina hasn't frozen either. I have never, ever, felt the need to put antifreeze in my raw water circuit and it has never frozen. I do drain the potable water system just in case, so maybe i'm not a complete retard.

Either way, retard or not, at least i'm not rude for no reason.

 

[Joker]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

Most winters I leave the boat in eastern Germany, when the temperature can fall to -10 or -20C. There is no heater. In fact, there are not nearly enough electric points for all the boats that are ashore. No one leaves the heater on.

 

[William_H]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

It is the high temp of the bulb in a concentrated point that might make the bulb a slight danger as compared to heat tpae or heat tubes that have a larger area and though of the same wattage have a lower temperature. So safer.
I understood that the sea is generally no where near as cold as the air on land so tending to keep the boat warm or at least not frozen. But then what would I know with lowest winter air temp 3 degrees and current min around 15 to 18 degrees. Did a night race last night in just a tee shirt. Just to rub it in olewill

 

[rosssavage]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

This can go round and round - frankly the idea of a light bulb seems a bit odd to me, but each to their own.

My own set up consists of permanently installed tube heaters - two in the engine room, (one directly under each engine) and one in the lazarette between the fresh water tank and pump. They are left on all the time, but run through frost stats set to 5c. I run a dehumdifier 24/7 (set to about 50%) and have a 500w oil filled rad in the fwd cabin.

Probably not the cheapest way of doing it, but I boat on a budget and cannot afford to repair busted engines or replace mouldy interiors.

The boat stays lovely and dry all winter, and my big green (very) expensive lumps stay un-wrecked

 

[Seashoreman]

Re: Bulbs as Heater

There are a number of working fishing boats, wood and fibreglass, which are hauled onto the shingle beaches along the East Anglian coast all the year round. Most of them have large elderly diesels cooled by seawater. I have in the past asked the fishermen about cleaning/flushing etc and they don't do anything about it in the winter. I have on my own boat but sometimes skip a year.

 

[ghostlymoron]

Just a comment is that an electrical engineer once told me that bulbs are planted in your garden, devices that give light are called lamps.

 

[Momac]

Just a comment is that an electrical engineer once told me that bulbs are planted in your garden, devices that give light are called lamps.

If you go to Goolge images and search for light bulbs , then search for lamps , you will see what everyone thinks these words mean. Also if you search on google for 'lamp definition' it says the term lamp refers to a device for giving of light including a light bulb its holder and shade.
Language in common use does , of course ,change over time.