Broken Mast Spreader, Repair or Replace???

[The Real Flipper]

Funny I thought I'd asked this question here but guess not- only on the Westerly forums. Anyway-

So when I was packing my mast for transport I discovered a broken spreader (top port side), cracked around one of the bolt holes.
It's turned out to be a real challenge to find a used one, which would be preferable due to surprising costs for this seemingly simple piece of metal.
And I tried a metal shop and a rigging shop and neither wanted to weld it.
The rigging shop guy said he could cut the broken bit off (32mm) and drill new holes and do both spreaders to match for an hour's labor, which seems pretty reasonable.

Scoured the internet and finally found a Seldan regional rep who if I ship him the old one has 'templates' in stock and can use mine to drill holes in a new one then ship both back for 326 Euros plus shipping, so I figure 370 Euros or so all done.

First I told the Seldan rep about 2 cm and he saild 'no problem' it would be fine to cut it.
After measuring it at 32 mm I got back to him. BTW 32mm would mean just barely cutting off both holes.
Seldan rep said that 32mm could be cut off and it should be OK, but 32mm is 'at the limit' of what could be done.

So I'm wondering what do you folks think? I'm on a tight budget. But I don't want to cut corners that will actually weaken the boat as I do plan to eventually sail on The North Sea and I want her strong. Then again if it doesn't really matter, I could use the 300 Euros saved by just cutting it for any one of about a hundred other things.

Also I bought JB Marine Weld as the strength sound pretty incredible. But the rigging shop guy didn't recommend it. Not sure why. As I understand the spreader is only for compression support.

As always, any suggestions appreciated

 

[srm]

Personally, I would replace with new as loosing the mast in the North Sea will really spoil your day.

Also, I would want to know how and why the existing spreader suffered that damage.

 

[Bobc]

Replace. It's not worth the risk.

 

[LadyInBed]

Assuming that the crack is on the top face, it looks like it has been subjected to downward pressure, so whatever your remedy, check the alignment.
I'm not a welder, but if it can be welded, I would also look to reinforcing the area.

 

[Boathook]

Whats the mast like by the spreader brackets. It seems that the spreader was damaged whilst fixed in place.

 

[Refueler]

Spreaders are there to apply near mid height of mast - transverse support to resist mast bowing to one side or other when stays / shrouds tensioned. They also alter the angle of cap shroud to masthead to resist upper section from bending.

Personally I agree with the Selden Guy - cut and refit. They will provide same service.

The question as another has asked - WHY did the spreader crack like that ? I would be more concerned to find out why ... and to check spreader mount points on mast.

 

[michael_w]

Replace as a pair. Check the spreader bars for damage too.

 

[penfold]

Whats the mast like by the spreader brackets. It seems that the spreader was damaged whilst fixed in place.

It looks more like damage from yard mishandling than failure from sailing induced loads; what if any damage has the socket got and has the mast extrusion been distorted?

 

[Stemar]

It looks more like damage from yard mishandling than failure from sailing induced loads; what if any damage has the socket got and has the mast extrusion been distorted?

I'm inclined to agree with this. The stress on a spreader should only be in compression. If that's the top, it looks as if the spreader has been forced downwards.

 

[RJJ]

Advice to check alignment and damage to the mast is sound, however don't rule out wear and tear.

We had something very similar (after four Atlantic crossings) and both a rigger and sparcraft told us it was a "known" wear and tear matter. You can see from the enlargement of the hole (aside from the break) that the clevis pin is doing work as the spreader tries to rotate fore and aft. It doesn't take much (imperceptible) movement of steel against aluminium to expand and weaken the hole.

When we received a replacement set from Sparcraft it came with a reinforcing jacket around the clevis holes extending five inches or so along the spreader, riveted in place. Effectively about 3x the thickness of aluminium (and required a new clevis pin). So that's their response....as in, this was not the first time they see it.

I would be wary of shortening the spreader (If I understand you correctly).

You could consider a weld repair plus a machined and riveted reinforcing jacket, then keep under observation. That was the proposal from my rigger when we initially thought Sparcraft couldn't come up with the replacement. But a weld repair alone in aluminium won't hack it in my opinion. As it was explained to me, spot welding inevitably creates a bit somewhere that exceeds the heat at which it destabilises (weakens) but doesn't reach the heat at which it forms new mechanical bonds with itself. In short, a problem, which is why riggers are reluctant to do it. Good luck

 

[The Real Flipper]

Whats the mast like by the spreader brackets. It seems that the spreader was damaged whilst fixed in place.

It looks more like damage from yard mishandling than failure from sailing induced loads; what if any damage has the socket got and has the mast extrusion been distorted?

I agree. Anyone who has seen my thread on the 'shoddy mast support repair' they did at the old marina in Zeeland where the mast was taken down for said repair, has seen the mess they left behind. I didn't mention it as it won't help anything but the rusty bits they didn't bother to even sweep away were left all over my floor and they apparently marched back and forth with their boots and yeah- basically they well 'ruined' is a big word but definitely 'worsened' my teak floors- substantially. A casual glance into the cost of new teak floors it's not an exaggeration to say they did more harm than good!

Also as mentioned in another thread same shop who had traded me not putting the mast back up and refitting the rigging which was part of the mast repair job, in exchange for crane loading on a truck (I just wanted to get her out of there!) reneged on the deal. When the truck was arriving shortly they basically extorted me to pay the crane fee or they would not release the boat from their yard. I repeated that we clearly had a deal and shop manager's response was- well you're shipping the boat so you don't need the mast back up. Yeah. Really. Talk about sleaze. Now I had to pay the crane fee in Zeeland, and mast crane and rigging fee in new marina, and old shop pockets money they never earned.

There is nothing particularly unusual about this kind of treatment as an immigrant in The Netherlands. And it's worse in the smaller villages which this was.
Anyway I only mention all this now as I find a somewhat high degree of liklihood that this spreader damage was caused by the jachthaven shop.

Remember (again as noted in other threads) I also wasted my entire summer after buying the boat in the first week of May with a promise of a two week waiting period, waiting for this shop to do the agreed mast support repair, while they put Dutch person after Dutch person to the front of the line ahead of me. Two weeks promised wait became two and a half months. Nothing to see here. Business as usual...

Whether they damaged the spreader or not, and whether willfully or through the usual flagrant negligence for the less-than-premium customer I really don't care at this point. But there's a good chance with their track record of 'care' that they did it.
Now you all know why I just wanted to get my boat out of there and not need that shop for anything.
And not give them another Euro cent. On principal.

Anyway, I'm just glad to have the boat near home and under my control and to *finally* be making some progress.
If I seem a little frustrated or in a rush sometimes I had the idea from vendor and surveyor that I'd be sailing in mid May!
So uh, yeah. Just trying to suck it up and roll with the punches as best I can.
Most things worth while require a little sacrifice so I'll just write it off as that.
And try to remember that in the end I've got a Westerly Storm

Moving forward, I'll check the mast and spreader support bracket as best I can.
When I pulled the spreader off I didn't notice any obvious damage. We'll see.

Thanks again for all the suggestions.

 

[William_H]

I think this is a top spreader. Presumably not a main spreader. You might consider just shortening the spreader by cutting off damaged area and drilling new holes. Do the same to the other side. Or alternatively weld repair with reinforcing on the inside. I might suspect damge by handling not in service. ol'will

 

[dankilb]

The rig is one area where ‘make do and mend’ doesn’t do it for me. We just re-stepped our mast after a complete ‘rivet and pin’ restoration so I have the wallet dent to show for this, but…

Considering new standing rigging would easily be 15x the new spreader cost and a new mast would be well into the five digits - saving a few hundred euros doesn’t seem worth it.

Plus the OP is lucky Selden could supply a new one, IMO. With our (1989 Francespar) mast you’d have no chance. What if the repaired one cracks again in a few years, by which time Sod’s law says they’re no longer available?!

 

[Chiara’s slave]

Cut the 32mm. That’s 5% of the length, it will be fine.

 

[DownWest]

Think I would cut it just above the crack and redrill using a jig ( The slope means the drill needs location) What's left of the hole would not matter and it reduces the length by less.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I would go for new ie €250 more than having the two spreaders shortened but that is just me, cutting and re drilling is perfectly OK.
If I had to guess I would say that someone stood on the spreader when climbing the mast as the most likely way it was damaged.
I guess that your desire to get the boat afloat and sailing for a couple of months is driving this but I will repeat you will be far better off spending the next 8 months gradually working your way through the boat and its problems and starting off with something that is right in all respects. IMO what you are thinking of will encourage you into the bad habit of rushing repairs and developing a make do and mend mentality with the mend bit being optional.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

You have to do what seems right fir the boat of course. She isn’t a highly stressed racing machine, and there’ll be loads of safety margin in that rig. But all the same, she’s flipper’s new pride and joy, and if perfection upstairs makes him happier, then new spreaders are the way to go.

 

[geem]

That's a really easy weld. Find a new welder. I had some excellent aluminium welding done on my mizzen mast. Far more complex than that tiny repair. Since then we have done lots of miles and a Transat.

 

[bignick]

If Selden say it’s OK to remove 32mm then I‘d go with that approach. They will know the safety factors they designed it to, and if they say it will be Ok then it will be Ok.

To me it looks like the spreader has been levered forward, which wouldn’t be possible if the aft bolt had been securely fastened. The hole also looks slightly elongated, which suggests either stress or wear. What does the aft hole attach to on the mast? It looks like the aft edge of the spreader is solid, or is there another hole in the root of the spreader just out of the picture?

This sort of damage could also have been caused during unstopping the mast; it’s fairly common to put a strop around the mast just below the upper spreaders and lift with a crane.

 

[srm]

Anyone who has seen my thread on the 'shoddy mast support repair' they did at the old marina in Zeeland where the mast was taken down for said repair, has seen the mess they left behind.

Sorry to hear about your experience.
I had something similar when buying my first boat, ashore in a yard in the Solent area. It was probably the cheapest boat in the yard and I was going to sail away as soon as launched so they had no incentive to look after me. They refused to launch the boat any time near when I wanted to as they would have to move another bigger boat belonging to a family member that was blocking the slip.
Since then I have written terms for things like launching times in to any offer I made for a boat that was ashore, thus making it the seller's responsibility to have any work done on time in order to complete the sale.