macd
Well-Known Member
Who is this "us"? In other words, what part of "www" is mysterious to you?
Brexit and sailing
- Thread starter Champagne Murphy
- Start date
Who is this "us"? In other words, what part of "www" is mysterious to you?
savageseadog
Well-Known Member
We will go cruising Europe our 50ft luxury yachts but will have to watch security as hordes of destitute EU citizens try to steal anything they can eat from our boats. 10 Euros to the pound will make life cheap over there.
grumpy_o_g
Well-Known Member
I think the only safe assumption is that we would be in the same situation as USA / Australians etc today. Anything else is kind of very wishful thinking if the UK decides to give what may be seen as a two fingered salute to the rest of the EU.
To use an analogy, imagine you decided to dump your spouse / partner of 40 years, telling them bluntly that you find them unattractive, inferior, expensive to keep and you don't need them any more. So you are leaving them - and don't plan to pay any ongoing maintenance.
Ah, but "I assume I can still have nooky on Saturdays and lunch on Sunday's like before". Imagine how likely that would be to happen
That in effect is what the optimists are hoping would happen on a Brexit.
I'm guessing you have a few problems with relationships....
grumpy_o_g
Well-Known Member
Us is British people as implied by both the use of the phrase "countries that welcome British sailors" and by the fact that this is a forum hosted by a British sailing magazine...
grumpy_o_g
Well-Known Member
Red diesel should be a lot simpler in the event of Brexit. The problem with red diesel was always that the UK was breaking an EU directive. If out of the EU then the EU directive is irrelevant.
alan_d
Well-Known Member
Judging by the recent past, it seems to me the biggest threat would come not from other countries but from the UK strengthening border controls with attendant bureaucracy.
grumpy_o_g
Well-Known Member
I think that's the thing - Belgium, Greece, Portugal and even Germany have caused hassle for visiting yachtsmen and women. They're all in the EU. Turkey has caused no end of confusion with it's Kafkaesque bureauocracy and that's not in the EU. France (in the EU) tends not to cause problems whilst the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man, the Azores, and many other places also tend not cause problems but are out of the EU (I think).
The only conclusion I can draw is that it has nothing to do with the EU and everything to do with the mindset of the country's government and civil service. On the positive side any economic downside as the result of causing problems does seem to result in a pragmatic u-turn a lot of the time (regardless of the country).
grumpy_o_g
Well-Known Member
I don't think the average man or woman in the street will feel even remotely different about us - I'm sure one or two will manage to take it personally but I'm equally sure one or two will be impressed at the willingness to actually get our government to do what we want for a change (and telling a bunch of politicians to stuff it is always popular with any electorate).
If a government is stupid and petty enough to try and spite their neighbours, even to extent of damaging local economies I suspect that the locals will soon tell them what to do. This has already happened to some extent with backpedalling on taxes, etc.
Reverse the situation - if France or Germany told you they were leaving the EU would you feel any differently towards any Germans or French folk you met? Would our Government immediately think about taxing imports, controlling exports, tax embargoes, etc. The huge numbers of folk relying BMW, Mercedes, Audi, VW, etc would soon tell them to wind their necks in as would Jaguar, Landrover, NIssan, Honda and all the folks making cars here and exprting them to Germany.
PeterR
Well-Known Member
I assume we would be back to the rules that applied pre EU. For those of you who do not remember that involved completing form C1328 and posting it off pre departure. Not too much of a problem as most clubs had a box where you could drop it in. There was never a problem overseas the difficulty came when you got back to the UK.
Before you re entered UK territorial waters you had to complete the rest of C1328 (in triplicate but it did have carbons) with the details of all crew including passport and address. Details of any goods bought overseas by each crew member (specified by crew member). Doing this on the way back usually made at least half the crew seasick.
On entering port you had to shine a torch on the Q flag if you were returning at night and on berthing one person was allowed to go ashore to phone the local customs to report your arrival (no mobile phones back then). The invariable response was to say that you should wait for 2 hours. If no one from customs arrived by 2 hours the crew could go ashore and or depart home after posting the remainder of C1328. I don’t recall them turning up often if you complied with that but at the first sign of the crew heading for the club bar customs would descend mob handed and rummage the boat.
There are a lot less customs men around now but back in those days I reckon at least 50% of the time I was judged to have broken at least one of these rules to a greater or lesser extent resulting in some officious twit pontificating about my transgressions at length.
What really annoyed me was that in most cases the customs knew they were not going to come down to the boat but they would never say so. I suspect they could see the boat and at the first sign of anyone going ashore early they would be down mob handed just to make a nuisance of themselves.
The most irate I ever got was in Salcombe where having rowed ashore and traipsed around the town to find the customs man who was not in his office to answer the phone all he did was bollock us for two people rowing ashore not just one.
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sailaboutvic
Well-Known Member
Ahhhhh those where the good old days . Where fuel was 90p , NO not a litre BUT a Gallon .
awol
Well-Known Member
I hate to tell you but Time Inc is an American organisation.
Seven Spades
Well-Known Member
Arriving in Belgium: hoist the Q-flag, have ship's papers ready, passport, visa, proof of vaccination, state all intended ports of call, be prepared for checks on amount of cash carried, red diesel, alcohol on board... Hope there will be no rules outlawing the import of vegetables, meat, or other fresh food products. Clear in and clear out of every harbour, be happy that immigration, customs and police are all in the same building, but that will not be the case everywhere.
Upon returning in UK: hoist the Q-flag, be prepared for checks by customs, immigration, border patrol. Account for your whereabouts whilst abroad. Pay import duties on your stock of Belgian beer, cheese, chocolate or any other gastronomical goodies that you have bought because they are hard to find or too expensive in Blighty...
And vice versa for us, no doubt. Something to look forward to, really.
Is that how you treat boats from the Channel Islands?
My guess is that we will be treated the same way as boats from the C.I.'s are certainly by France. The French know that we are not bringing illegal immigrants to France, so a Gaelic shrug of the shoulders is all I expect. On return just call the yacht line and I think you will get a similar reaction. One day when we had nothing better to do we called the yacht line when on route from Peter Port, the person on the other end of the line could not have been more surprised that anyone had called. Found the script, asked if we have any non EU passport holders on board and declared me as cleared.
Seven Spades
Well-Known Member
The biggest problem for us is that the "booze cruise" will no longer be legal and we will be restricted to duty free allowances.
dunedin
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't bet on being treated the same as the Channel Islands - they are an oddball, who like to benefit from being part of the Uk when it suits and "independent" when that suits.
But they key thing is that they are very small, largely "below radar" on the wider European political map and therefore nobody bothers too much about the inconsistencies and exceptions - like some other oddball small offshoots of other EU countries.
But the UK is much much bigger, and therefore unlikely to be overlooked - particularly as we are currently making a major political noise in Europe - and if we decide to leave can expect the other EU countries to say "be it on your own heads" and apply the rules strictly (at least for a period)
But they key thing is that they are very small, largely "below radar" on the wider European political map and therefore nobody bothers too much about the inconsistencies and exceptions - like some other oddball small offshoots of other EU countries.
But the UK is much much bigger, and therefore unlikely to be overlooked - particularly as we are currently making a major political noise in Europe - and if we decide to leave can expect the other EU countries to say "be it on your own heads" and apply the rules strictly (at least for a period)
snowleopard
Well-Known Member
There are loads of assumptions about how things might go after Brexit. They largely centre on concessions that the rEU will allow Britain but also include what concessions Britain will be forced to make to accommodate EU rules. There is also the question of any anti-British sentiments that are stirred up by our rejection of Europe, particularly among officials, we may have to deal with when visiting the EU.
The worst-case scenario includes visas, customs searches, fines for having red diesel in the tank, etc. The best case is to continue as before. How much of an optimist are you?
The worst-case scenario includes visas, customs searches, fines for having red diesel in the tank, etc. The best case is to continue as before. How much of an optimist are you?
Garold
Well-Known Member
Will the red diesel issue not disappear?
I thought that they wanted to fine us because we don't pay the same rate of tax as the other EU members. And if we leave the union, we can set our own tax rates.
Garold
snowleopard
Well-Known Member
I recall that the Belgian customs were fining Americans with coloured diesel in their tanks, not just us.
Of course it was none of their business but when did that ever stop over-zealous officials? It is just possible that the British government might go back to duty free red diesel . Duck, here comes a low-flying pig.
brainstorm
Well-Known Member
Has anybody thought about those of us who like to cruise up to the West coast of Scotland if we vote on 23rd June for a Brexit, then Nicola calls another referendum and they go independent and join the E U? Passports required at Gretna and Customs in every Scottish Harbour?
RAI
Well-Known Member
I can see that there are a lot of ways that Brexit yachts and sailors could be treated differently by the EU, as noted in this thread. None of them seem to be an improvement.
Can an Outer provide a list of improvements to our yachting experience that Brexit would create?
Can an Outer provide a list of improvements to our yachting experience that Brexit would create?
RAI
Well-Known Member
Northern Ireland and Eire crossings should be fun too.