Boring threads?

Neeves said:
. . . The suggestion was 'we old salts know it all'.

My response is that we have new members here, who might have joined so as to learn but also articles on MOB need constant repetition
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Also, I know evidence for it is thin on the ground, but some of us longer term members do occasionally change our views, shocking though that might seem (I know I have have on certain topics).

We also sometimes change our needs, for example getting a different type of boat, or moving to a different cruising ground, where information that might once have seemed irrelevant/boring suddenly becomes of interest.

If I find a thread boring I can just stop reading it. No need to complain about it.

Certain posters, though . . . :devilish:;)
 
Neeves said:
Both generated comments that such topics were boring and did not merit repetition. …. The suggestion was 'we old salts know it all'.
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That’s not how I recall those threads. Perhaps you are being over sensitive or misunderstanding “not really surprising” for “surely everyone knows that”. But in both those threads the headlines of the linked articles where somewhat hyperbolic - telling newbies that rope is only 1/4 of its strength after 10 years, or that half of MOBs drown is not actually that helpful, if there is a massive missing “in the particular circumstances studied” caveat.

Neeves said:
My response is that we have new members here, who might have joined so as to learn but also articles on MOB need constant repetition (I for one did not know that an MOB has a 50% chance of being retrieved alive, accepting that maybe many MOBs occur without fanfare).
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The number is nonsense and repeating it multiple times doesn’t make it more helpful.

Neeves said:
It made we wonder how sailing magazines survive considering there is so little, really, new topics on which they might conduct an investigation.
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Well, it’s remarkable that sailing magazines have survived so well because they all pretty much recycle the same content on a 3-5 yr cycle. Printed media journalism is struggling in all sectors - the demographic of sailors might have kept it alive a bit longer, and good quality images are important but you’d need to be mad to start a new magazine today in an already crowded market. Very little of that content actually relates to “investigation” though like you suggest.

Neeves said:
This then led me to wonder what, the old salts consider, are the 'so new' developments in sailing/cruising that do merit airing.

Today I can think of Lithium, but historically Dyneema, carbon (fibre), GPS,chart plotters, sail drives....... but not omitting the investigation of the propensity of some tether hooks to fail (MOB again) etc etc

Jonathan
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I think if you want “new tech” for reviews then AIS MOB devices and laser flares would fall into the obvious camp that individual yachties can’t easily test themselves. Perhaps comparison of Savvy Navvy / Orca etc on the same routes to understand how well they work. Electric outboards have already been covered in most of the mags but it’s still quite hard to translate to real world use and nuances around chargers, robustness etc - a long term trial there would be interesting. I’m surprised there hasn’t been more on Shengen Shuffle etc. even on “old tech” like ropes I don’t recall much on splicing etc (except the traditional easy stuff). I’m surprised there hasn’t been more Openplotter/PyPilot stuff in PBO.
 
Morgans Cloud is just waffle linking to other waffle these days.
The fact that rope ages in sunlight isn't news to many people.

Posts which just link to stuff without a precis of that stuff or any useful comment can be quite annoying.

The point about magazines surviving, is that a lot of them are not.
The only dead-tree periodical sailing publication I've seen this year is 'All At Sea' which is a free comic they give away outside chandlers around the Solent.
Even online magazines are suffering, Yachts and Yachting is not what it was, mostly just somewhere organisations shove their press releases.
The front page of YBW.com is another case in point. The first screenful is just advertorials

Neeves said:
I attached a link to an article in Practical Sailor on degradation on nylon rope and another on MOB. Both generated comments that such topics were boring and did not merit repetition. Previously people have commented that articles on snubbers and catenary are well aired. The suggestion was 'we old salts know it all'.

My response is that we have new members here, who might have joined so as to learn but also articles on MOB need constant repetition (I for one did not know that an MOB has a 50% chance of being retrieved alive, accepting that maybe many MOBs occur without fanfare).

It made we wonder how sailing magazines survive considering there is so little, really, new topics on which they might conduct an investigation.

This then led me to wonder what, the old salts consider, are the 'so new' developments in sailing/cruising that do merit airing.

Today I can think of Lithium, but historically Dyneema, carbon (fibre), GPS,chart plotters, sail drives....... but not omitting the investigation of the propensity of some tether hooks to fail (MOB again) etc etc

Jonathan
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One subject that merits airing (and that Neaves can report back to Practical Sailor) is NMEA. Trying to work through NMEA as an amateur is difficult. It is even harder to interpret some of the advice, often conflicting from different advisors who are not skilled teachers, just well meaning individuals.

I definitely would like to understand NMEA more, including interface solutions between different NMEA data providers.

YBW is not a learning solution, the format fails in many ways, mostly because of the the way information is presented, data is bereft of detail, facts are not verifiable and that counter facts, lies, opinions and arguments are often presented on the same subject. Even as a source of help it is limited, much for the same reason as it is a poor learning solution.
 
Same goes for how to get WIFI. I get stuck when someone mentions Router & internet in the same sentence. Throw in "computer" & I just give up. :unsure: Then talk about one of those Pie things!!- I was OK with Lyons Individual Fruit Pies. They were nice- but from thereon???:rolleyes:
Can you still get Lyons Individual Fruit Pies? I suddenly fancy an apple & raspberry.
 
Daydream believer said:
Same goes for how to get WIFI. I get stuck when someone mentions Router & internet in the same sentence. Throw in "computer" & I just give up. :unsure: Then talk about one of those Pie things!!- I was OK with Lyons Individual Fruit Pies. They were nice- but from thereon???:rolleyes:
Can you still get Lyons Individual Fruit Pies? I suddenly fancy an apple & raspberry.
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Lyons Corner House, opposite the Palace Pier, Brighton early 1960's. Apple and Black current pie and a big mug of tea 3/9d

All gone..I think Mr Kipling probably rules now...:cry: :D
 
I like a bit of flippancy and some thread drift - especially if it allows some to show their imagination.

But more seriously:

It will be interesting if the traditional media, and they do sponsor/support this site, take notice of the comments (which are hardly supportive or the sponsors - and I like ybw.com - even if I disagree at times with the Mods).

Edit, will I join Daydream in purgatory - this time I think we might be safe...... :)

RunAgroundHard said:
YBW is not a learning solution, the format fails in many ways, mostly because of the the way information is presented, data is bereft of detail, facts are not verifiable and that counter facts, lies, opinions and arguments are often presented on the same subject. Even as a source of help it is limited, much for the same reason as it is a poor learning solution.
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I'd have too agree as the absence of data (and why have a fancy phone it you cannot just its camera) undermines many a request for help or an arguement. Repetition without data is hardly convincing. But if YM, PBO, ST or PS terminate where will the neophyte source his data if YBW and CF et al are not the vehicle? My concoclusion is that balanced data will be smothered by those that shout the loudest.

An issue is that testing costs.... some of it is real hard, actual, money - some is time and commitment. Currently traditional media pays for testing. If traditional media dies - who is going to pay for the next generation of (add product, say NMEA) to be tested....I referred earlier to tether hooks, failing - (a man died) just another MOB statistic - who is going to pay in the future?

But the thread was not intended as a plea for subscriptions but a counter, rightly or wrongly, to perceived negativity to posting, whilst they are available, to educational topics or links (with a complete absence of financial benefit).

And the thought - the neophyte might support the idea of links, even without a summary of the content in the link.

But if the thread engenders a debate on what is missing from the surviving media - it can only support finance of any investigation.

Jonathan
 
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MapisM said:
I opened this thread because the title made me curious to check if it was about the most boring of all boring topics, i.e. anchors.
Darn it, I just lost a bet with myself! :ROFLMAO:
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It was certainly not meant to be about anchors :). I'm pleased to have won a virtual beer.

The two threads I initiated (and I felt might not be inconsequential to a new member) were on the 'boring' topic of cordage (specifically nylon) degradation and the second on MOBs.

I was disappointed that MOBs don't engender more comment. I was appalled on the 2:1 failure rate of MOBs - the stats might be skewed - but say if was your mother, son or niece.....

I have been slightly amused at the comment on Morgans Cloud, they make money, a number of forum members subscribe....I don't - but am on mailing list.

Jonathan
 
2Tizwoz said:
How many car owners even know that manufacturers now date stamp their tyres never mind change them?
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As far as I'm aware .... tyres have been date stamped as of manufacture date for long time .... so you can only tell when they were made.

If you are referring to 'End of Life' date stamp ... please provide more info .... as they do not have such.

Some like Bridgestone advise to change if they get over 7yrs old .... others 10yrs ... but there is no End of Life Date Stamp .... the only legal obligation is that tyres are safe condition ... regardless of age.

Do Car Tyres Have a Use By Date?.
 
Neeves said:
It was certainly not meant to be about anchors :). I'm pleased to have won a virtual beer.

The two threads I initiated (and I felt might not be inconsequential to a new member) were on the 'boring' topic of cordage (specifically nylon) degradation and the second on MOBs.

I was disappointed that MOBs don't engender more comment. I was appalled on the 2:1 failure rate of MOBs - the stats might be skewed - but say if was your mother, son or niece.....

I have been slightly amused at the comment on Morgans Cloud, they make money, a number of forum members subscribe....I don't - but am on mailing list.

Jonathan
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You do realise that the MAIB write reports when ships sink or people die?
When some pissed oldfart falls in the marina and gets fished out with no harm done, nobody tells them.
Last year, the MAIB listed very few MOB's, and just one fatality from a non-commercial yacht MOB.
https://assets.publishing.service.g...nt_data/file/1173305/MAIBAnnualReport2022.pdf

In other news, for the year 2020 in the US&A, 100% of carbon monoxide deaths were not wearing a lifejacket.
https://uscgboating.org/library/accident-statistics/Recreational-Boating-Statistics-2020.pdf

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/363331549014
 
2Tizwoz said:
How many car owners even know that manufacturers now date stamp their tyres never mind change them?
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You're right of course, but I wasn't actually meaning x years from manufacture, I was thinking hardened out and or cracking.
 
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