Boot Düsseldorf 2019

henryf said:
Particularly in the Med with stern to mooring along a busy quayside fore deck seating affords you a bit of privacy in the harbour.
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Well, if they wish to sell the thing in the Med, they must be targeting boaters who don't mind being unable to moor her properly: the stern cleats placement is possibly the worst I've ever seen, for Med mooring.
I guess the idea is to use the other ones on the cheeks above the swim platform, but considering their position, I wouldn't trust them to withstand any serious snatch pull - which can and does happen, in many marinas.

I'm not sure to see the point of that Pininfarina job, either. Is there a settee inside that moulding, or what?

Nice report indeed, though. Thanks for sharing the experience!
 
We have got a brand new 50 opposite and a couple of places down , arrived Sept so I was watching the comings and going’s .They are tall in the water ,then no taller than the current S/Sky .How ever compared to the similar boats around there’s a trend to look disproportionate, I guess that” new shape “ look will take time to soak into the psyche?
One wonders about windage ? Not just marina manoeuvres bit getting on in a headwind or 1/4 ing bow wind .
Seems ironic the Pininfarina link ,as normally in the car world they pen sleek designs with an eye on aerodynamics but that gone out of the window.
@ MapisM yup that rear spoiler cum radar arch is a seat back ( well is on my neighbors) .

From the pics two points
View attachment 75643
If the black is the line route ? Then the red lines are areas where the gel coat will star crack and the blue areas where any seal will be lost ...... due to flexing of that metal assembly exacerbated in a Med mooring .
Looking at the other pics if the quay is lower ( normally is on a boat this size ) you have to wrap the line round the roller fairlead approaching from the outside .A more direct route would be easier.
Gel coat repair lads have been twice .

My guy phaffs with two little lines as temps direct ( well wife try’s ) he’s got rear cockpit controls and a walkabout remote )
Once theses temps are tied he then walks one of the two slim lines fwd and temp ties that , then he returns and phaffs with the real docklines threading them through that hole , he,s got electric winches too .
Them he goes Fwds again with the second bow line , secures both properly.Then phaffs in the cockpit twixt his gadget and his remote box and his now two real lines ,there’s a slight reverse as he pulls the bow and tightens the sterns one by one .Anyhow that whole metal structure flexes the surrounding gel coat as a result.
You ( priny ) can,t really blame “ inappropriately used by the punter “ because that’s how the average punter will trash it .
More like “ inappropriate design “ I think !

You can hear some strange creaking noises ?
Btw his x springs ( puts on when he leaves ) rub on top of his tender on his B platform as these seperate cleats are low - see the pic and in my view almost horizontal so again susceptible to gel coat damage as the forces are pulling them almost perpendicular to the plastic .Ok they will be backed , behind but I,ll give it 2 seasons over the winter , before Princess send another team of gel coat lads .

Second thing ,
View attachment 75644
Ought to be electric - touch of a button ,it isn’t.
So you have to unclip what looks like 4 clamps and force that table down .Its not clear if the squibs needs tipping and where do you store the infill ? Finally when it’s a table not a bed ,does it rock about when someone puts elbows on the table spilling tea on the sprawled out Sunday Times .

I have to say the Fr have taken to Princess in the 45-65 range .A few days ago in La Nap ( HQ to Piriny .Fr ) there was a new S60 and V 45 and another FB 50 something awaiting delivery,

Good write up .
 
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Excellent write up and Pix H - great stuff and not before long! The link to the MBY shots earlier was welcome too.

Its a leap from the P43 and galley aft seems to be the norn now and I guess will grow on me eventually.

Question - do you prefer it to the P50 you have today?
 
I have no specific experience of med mooring obviously but can only say that the lower stern cleats on our Princess 50 flybridge located on the shoulders of the hull where it wraps round to the swim platform are extremely sturdy, we use them a lot. I would have thought they would be ideal for stern to med mooring but I totally bow to your superior knowledge. When you say a brand new 50 has arrived is that a Princess? They stopped the Princess 50 flybridge in around 2013 from memory replacing it with the 52. They introduced a 49 with IPS engines which has just become or is just about to become the new 50 (I think !!).

As to the "point" of the Pininfarina radar arch design, I guess it's to look good?

Henry :)
 
Oh, and the table in the saloon doesn't convert to a bed as far as I'm aware but I didn't specifically ask the question so stand to be corrected. I assumed the height alteration was to change from coffee table to dining table. In the past Princess have offered a number of options including free standing furniture, manually adjustable or electronically adjustable fixed table. It will come down to the choice of the first owner and their specification.

I thought the teak boxing around the flybridge stairs added a feeling of quality.

H.
 
Princess V60.

At each boat show we have a look at the sports boats to see if we might be tempted away from flybridges, re-live our youth as it were. The V60 is a very attractive boat and seems cohesive in terms of linking all the elements together.



Steps lead up both sides of the garage from the bathing platform into the cockpit area creating a sense of grandeur and making it seem more like a 70 footer rather than 60ft. The aft galley features a full sized fridge freezer and also a dinette on the starboard side. Combined with the cockpit this covers all eating eventualities and weather. At anchor the back of the boat is going to be down wind so you will be well protected.











3 decent cabins with a lovely owners full beam master cover sleeping arrangements and I do like the thought of having a garage. There’s an assumption that you’ll be buying a Williams tender which for us wouldn’t necessarily be first choice. I still love an aluminium hull rib with an outboard which if all else fails you can chuck away and replace in less than an hour including the time it takes to boil a kettle. Leaving £35k’s worth of tender lying on a beach whilst you go exploring also worries me a bit. Ideally I’d have a tender and a jet ski for blasting around when the mood takes rather than a sort of all in one solution. Maybe I need to feel the Williams love at some point and scare myself out on the water. The question is do you buy a V60 or an S60 ?

 
Princess Y85

The last boat we had wander round whilst with Princess was their new Y85. Rather sweetly no one from Princess even suggested I might not be able to afford one, they just let us have a wander. The benefits of having bought a couple of boats from them in the past, they just chuck you the keys… This is another boat that Pininfarina have got their teeth into and it does add an extra sense of style, but just like the F45 the core boat was still practical and Princess.



There was some debate amongst the forum regulars gathered in Princess hospitality that the teak capping on the flybridge sides and the teak flooring which flowed out over the edge of the flybridge might be a bit of a sod to keep clean, I don’t care - it looked stunning and besides what else are the staff going to do when you’re not there ? Speaking of staff it did take a while to realise we weren’t in the main accommodation when looking round the crew quarters. In my next life I want to be crew on a Y85.









The teak work in general in the Y85 is exemplary. Cappings and curves make this something to judge other craft by, real super yacht stuff.



 






How Princess treat the wall that faces you as you descend to the accommodation deck has always been something to keep an eye on in their 80 something foot boats. We’ve seen various back lit creations but this time a stroke of genius. They have put a full height glass wall to one side of the walkway that leads from the helm station to the dining area. It creates a very striking visual and I love it.















Ultimately I can only dream but you do often find stuff drifting down the range so it bodes well for the future when we next look to change.
 
Ferretti 550.



This was one of the most significant boats of the show for me. We have a Princess 50 flybridge, think the Princess F55 flybridge is the best mid 50 foot flybridge production boat in the world but I’m not familiar with what people like Ferretti bring to the table. They are after all a very well respected player and there is a strong brand following on here. We were shown round by Richard Inwards of Inwards Marine who was both knowledgeable and generous with his time. Externally there was nothing to immediately put me off. Possibly a bit more angular than the Princess 55 and I was concerned that mooring cleats weren’t immediately to hand, you had to feed ropes through enclosed fairleads rather than being able to quickly tie off.






The hull finish was excellent and Richard explained how Ferretti avoid visible joints where moulded components meet. Walking inside things once again felt angular rather than curved as we have come to expect from Princess. I appreciate style is very much an acquired taste and I have been conditioned through 12 years of Princess ownership. The whole reason for visiting Dusseldorf was to get out of my comfort zone so I tried to view with an open mind. As I looked at the refrigeration arrangement on the aft galley - they all have aft galleys now, I was presented with side by side under counter fridge freezers. Princess do that on the F45 but by 55 feet I expect not to have to stoop down to grab a diet coke or rummage round for lunch. At 6 foot 2 inches the ground is a long way down!






The edging on the leather cushions seemed very crude, it was a design choice, I have no doubt the factory can produce soft flush panel edges given Italy is the world capital of sofa production but I didn’t like it. I also struggled with the vertical mounting of the steering wheel. This felt more 9 knot trawler than 30 knot sports flybridge and the boxed in single helm position felt more like a Norfolk Broads cruiser. We like to sit 2 up when helming from down below.



 
The 3 cabin 2 bathroom layout followed a traditional pattern with full beam owners suite, forward VIP and 3rd cabin to port. Headroom was all ok throughout, a slight box to the rear of the bed both nothing that would ever bother you.







 
The tube showers aren’t as big as the full walk in showers on a Princess 55 fly but they do keep the bathroom dry and make cleaning up easy.





Step through seating on the forward deck - the current must have for 2019 was good to see but I did feel the stainless side rails along the gunwale were low and there was no hand rail to keep hold of. We double crew as a husband and wife so that’s a real miss point, sorry to be boring and safety conscious.







Up on the flybridge there was plenty of seating but once again the steering wheel was in Ferretti’s trademark vertical position and not selling me the concept of speed. The biggest failure up top however was how far back the helm was set from the wind dodge or screen. This was a common failure on a lot of the boats we saw at the show. You end up with a helm station more suited to a rib and indeed in some cases there were pull up clear perspex panels to try and protect the helm but what about everyone else? We currently enjoy protection from the wind and spray on our flybridge and I’m not sure I want to trade that.








I had a very quick poke round in the engine room to try and look behinds the scenes. Judge a restaurant by it’s toilets, just a boat builder by its engine room. The first thing that struck me was the battery box made of what looked like plywood and a brace where they had screwed into the end grain. I would have expected a bespoke moulded battery tray given the quality of the hull glass work.



I’m afraid I walked away from the Ferretti 550 still thinking the Princess F55 is the best production mid 50 foot flybridge in the world. I shall retreat to my bunker and await comments to the contrary….
 
Great stuff H. I too was hoping to be wowed by the Ferretti, and Richard was generous with his time. However I too came away a little disappointed, and assume Ferretti's sweet spot is further up the size scale. The Prinny 85 was a true Wow, again James Barkes time was extremely generous.
Will having Pininfarina on the boot lid make any difference to the Princess values? I'm not sure. They have styled some epic cars, the A40, and Morris Oxford being a couple of obvious stars. Fortunately they were smart enough to leave the Marina to Ital!
 
Cheers Henry, I really enjoyed your write ups and photo's. I can't believe that as fellow Haslar Berthholders we've never met!!
 
Riva 66 Ribelle.



I’ve already mentioned that Richard Inwards form Inwards Marine was generous with his time, that extended to insisting we took a quick peek at the Riva. OK, it’s crazy, utter madness. I mean circa 4 million Euros for a 3 cabin full beam master, forward VIP, port side 3rd cabin galley down boat. But there’s the clue, galley down. This isn’t bought by people like me who eat fish finger sandwiches, it’s bought by someone who’s main boat is measured in hundreds of feet with staff and who bought this because he though bugger me that looks good and he had the spare change in his wallet. Like me he also probably thought the air vent above the helm position was an air brake. Oh, and it will be a he, this has über high quality gentleman’s club written all over it.













It’s boats like this that make you realise just how crap life is, that money can play any part in your boat buying decision process. At £25k everyone in the country would have one even if they lived in Wolverhampton and had to keep it on the canal. Being inside makes you feel like a player, the fact it would take someone half a day to clean the mirrored surfaces in the kitchen is reassuringly decadent. Everything you touch feel smell or lick is gorgeous. It’s the Bentley Sports car of the high seas.







 
rafiki_ said:
Great stuff H. I too was hoping to be wowed by the Ferretti, and Richard was generous with his time. However I too came away a little disappointed, and assume Ferretti's sweet spot is further up the size scale. The Prinny 85 was a true Wow, again James Barkes time was extremely generous.
Will having Pininfarina on the boot lid make any difference to the Princess values? I'm not sure. They have styled some epic cars, the A40, and Morris Oxford being a couple of obvious stars. Fortunately they were smart enough to leave the Marina to Ital!
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I'm just hoping that as per their motoring heritage it doesn't mean that the electrics will all start going to sh1t :)

Its an interesting marriage though. Princess are quite conservative in a world where extravagance knows no bounds and for me all the better for it but they have been tweaking the dial a bit. The newer boats look.... well newer. The basic foundations are all still there but with a bit more zing to suit style gods with their finger on the pulse like you & I.
 
Switch said:
Cheers Henry, I really enjoyed your write ups and photo's. I can't believe that as fellow Haslar Berthholders we've never met!!
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It's funny that how people quickly close their doors or draw their curtains when I walk down the pontoon.

If I was a more sensitive flower.....

Henry :)
 
henryf said:
I'm just hoping that as per their motoring heritage it doesn't mean that the electrics will all start going to sh1t :)

Its an interesting marriage though. Princess have been quite conservative in a world where extravagance knows no bounds and for me all the better for it but they have been tweaking the dial a bit. The newer boats look.... well newer. The basic foundations are all still there but with a bit more zing to suit style gods with their finger on the pulse like you & I.
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I agree, Prinny has been reassuringly staid in their styling, but with a solidity that makes sense in a weird world of excess. They are clearly making a public statement about Pinin styling. I'm not sure if people really care about the styling brand? Interesting to us geeks and to journo's, but to most buyers? Not sure.
 
H it’s a fifty something? That new Princess ,the guys a serial Prinny man .
Interestingly I stood and looke hard @ the S 60 the other day and indeed it exudes quality and function at the rear 1/2 for a Med boat .
Take your point about the teak lately on new Prinnys , it’s looks better quality and thicker then competitors.
There was a Galleon and S/ Sker hat fifty something think 52 ( would that be correct latest shaper ? ) nearby also .
Agree with the cushion edges comments on the F 55 , I don,t understand it either .Its either some designer lastest and expensive fashion or just a very cheap sub out job whereby the price of the guy who gained the soft furnishings contract is peanuts / item .
Piping and not folded edges and a seperate piece of material for each facet would be nicer along with not a single stitch in sight would be better .

Seems arse about tit that French owned Princess ( built in Plymouth) have commissioned Pininfarina to go through there boats with great results , while Ferretti are stuck with “ Norfolk broads “ helm stations , and grandmas home spun seat covers :)

It just that Luca Montezemolo ex Ferrari boss when he retired he took a seat on the Ferretti group board and I think bought a few % of stock (5/7 ? ) so what’s happening with LMZ and Pininfarina?

Fallen out , not speaking ??

I would have thought he would have banged a few Italian heads together .

Odd really very odd .......... to Princesses benefit a direct competitor.

Or the Chinese ( Ferretti grp owners ) just don,t get it ?? ———- dunno ?
 
rafiki_ said:
I agree, Prinny has been reassuringly staid in their styling, but with a solidity that makes sense in a weird world of excess. They are clearly making a public statement about Pinin styling. I'm not sure if people really care about the styling brand? Interesting to us geeks and to journo's, but to most buyers? Not sure.
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I've always thought that what something looks like is far more important than the name of the design house, and there's no denying that Princess (X Class aside) and others are knocking out some beautiful boats.

Still, I guess some people might think these things give them bragging rights.
 
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