Boat builder wants to end red diesel!

Re: 25 knots at a third the fuel

Henry,

I hope you do not abandon us but stay lurking and come back soon. You may feel picked on but you absolutely left yourself open to this. I do not use Red Diesel, and if it went then the cost of boats may drop which means I can buy a bigger boat etc! Wanting that would be insular of me because if the Industry goes into decline, the engine manufacturers and Mobo manufacturers and parts manufacturers stop R&D. Then in 5 years we have a crap industry with crap products that no one wants.

I do applaud you for coming on here but please return and answer Gludys questions. I get Cats and have always liked them; I just do not like your attitude. I wander if the other shareholders or financial backers or employees agree with your forthright opinion? I think not....

Paul
 
Victor,

I agree with you. I fear that market forces will alter the industry soon.....and that is why I love the freemarket economy! I will always need my boat fix, however I choose to get it. I have been forced off one area of cruising and I may be forced away from another.

BTW Gludy, I liked your points, just thought they were directed at the wrong person.

Paul
 
Bollox to you

i think your views are up the wall.


Even if cats do 3x the range for the fuel money - your savings are completely wiped out when you stop in a marina overnight.

You need two pontoon berths side by side. So in my marina to berth the ugly son of a gun costs you double! when you travel away you will be obliged to book years in advance to get the tandem mooring.
 
SWMBO quite likes the idea of a cat, more interior space, less rolling etc. Pleasing SWMBO is a moderately vital part of boating:-) EA and marina owners might like them too, mooring and licence fees shoot up, so how much of the reduced fuel costs would be swallowed there? By the time the calculations take into account a possible vast rise in fuel price the sums stop adding up at all.

The chances of my going down the cat route may now be counted on the fingers of
one foot.
 
Re: 25 knots at a third the fuel

why do you think the price of boats will drop? I bet you in a years time (assuming red goes) that all the nice new shiny boats at LIBS will be the same price, if not more than they are now. People having to pay £3000 more a year for fuel is not going to affect the price of boats, or erm maybe they'll all come down by £3000.
 
Sent the company the email below: (I don't expect a reply....)

Well I can confidently predict that your opinions on red diesel for boaters will ensure you are universally despised by the majority of the powerboat world. Try looking at the web sites if you want to see what people think of you. There are numerous other reasons which you don't think to raise which completely contradict your arguements- which just shows the hypocritical bias in your report.

Well done! Great bit of marketing.
 
Re: Bollox to you

Marina fees - many cats are no wider than a standard mono. I strongly object to marinas printing in their literature that cats should pay higher moorings. It is unfair trade description when many monos are wider beamed. People automatically think cats are wider - it is simply not the case. I have never paid any extra mooring for my cat and in fact pay less annually than my old Princess 33. On the continent I beleive they charge on area which is a fairer system.
 
Re: 25 knots at a third the fuel

Sorry,

I was considering Second Hand Boats rather than new boats. I think the higher diesel premium will be reduced (not disappear) in the second hand market because of Supply and Deman.

Paul
 
I am not attacking Victor at all - in fact I agreed that if we could have the same road tax as Europe it would be OK to see Red go - he made that point and I agreed.

I exapnded on his points by pointing in the recovery the market would recover to a smaller size.

So no w attack from me Vistor's way at all.
 
Re: 25 knots at a third the fuel

But if the price/value of new boats isn't affected then why should secondhand boats be affected. Ok, I admit that at the Petrol Vs Diesel cross over point (30ft ish) then the diesel advantage will be lost but not entirely.
 
Re: 25 knots at a third the fuel

[ QUOTE ]
Current tax policy is a big problem. Big monohulls are incredibly cheap to run because diesel tax is 5p a litre instead of 47p.

[/ QUOTE ]

Really?? wouldn't have said big mono hulls were cheap to run.
 
Re: 25 knots at a third the fuel

Be fair - Henry is not stating they are cheap to run, you mis-quote him - he is going all the way and claiming they are "incredibly cheap to run" .

I never knew that either, I alway thought they were very expensive to run - Henry must be very wealthy chap. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
Re: continental berthing

much med berthing is on beam: look at big marinas like antibes and the office lists all the berths with heading like "6m" meaning 6metres wide. The berths are charged a standard price, and you can put a narrower boat in but still pay 6m price.

Others mite vary but i have never even come across one that charges by area: the only people doing this is boat tranporters on ships.

I have seen surcharges between 50% and 100%, although not looked very hard i admit. Thee agin, on a cat, one would spend morte time at anchor. Unless er it was a narrower cat and bobbed about...
 
Re: continental berthing

I must admit I find it slightly annoying when the arguments for get conviently mixed.........
ie. greater deck space for any given hull length is often mentioned (not necessarily by Victor) but for this you will need a greater beam - and are then into berthing availability and price issues.
Even if they were only 10% wider MDL/Premier would pretty soon catch on and you would be paying 10% more!

I'm certainly keeping an eye on developments and a 26 x 10 with a single diesel and 4 berths could get me booking a water test.............
 
Re: continental berthing

Ok beam. Seems fairer to me in med. Monos should be charged like cats where there is excessive beam involved. Still yet to pay more for my cat in any marina - why should I? as my cat is no wider than many monos?
 
Re: Email exchange with the MD

Thank you Henry for joining the forum and being open to debate.

Many well known builders started with small petrol o/b models including Broom and Sunseeker.

As these companies became successful they grew into Diesel models.

I note your 2006 designs are getting larger and also have diesel options, if red does go you could be left without a market for your larger boats and there will be so many cheap diesel bargains around who will want to spend on an open cat when they can afford a Gin Palace for the same price ?
Most leisure boats don't clock up enough hours in a year to worry about the cost of a gallon of fuel, and having bought a gin palace you could have a petrol tender for the odd trip round the bay which is all your current designs are useful for.
 
[ QUOTE ]
now more importantly when are you getting the boat to Poole? Saw what I took to be the Sunseeker LIBS boats passing the Needles early afternoon Sunday and it reminded me you are heading our way soon...........


[/ QUOTE ]

Trader are currently beavering away at the boat adding all the bits and pieces ready to commision her in say about 4 weeks. After that I head to Poole for a week to have the Wistabsto heating system installed - then back to Emsworth.

So in Poole about this time next month - I hope.

Sunseeker boats left LIBS at 6 am Monday morning lock out after the show so the boat you saw could not have been the LIBS boat.

The lock out of LIBS costs £1000 per go so only three lock outs were allowed - if you did not make those three on Monday you had a £1k bill to pay .... it was a fair incentive to get out!
 
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