Blue water cruising on a AWB

Cardo

Cardo

Well-Known Member
Joined
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In a plastic tub!
www.yacht-tinkerbell.co.uk
Hi guys n gals
Just a quick question, have any of you done any blue water cruising on a modern, mass produced AWB? (ie. Beneteau, Bavaria, etc.)

I've been browsing some other forums, and there's a bunch of apparently "old school" cruisers that reckon it's not possible to do any blue water cruising on a modern, "cheap", mass produced boat, as they're apparently not up to the task.

So, anyone here disagree with them? If you have done some blue water cruising on one of these boats, would you mind stating what you've done, and on what boat?

Cheers!
 
I asked this and got the usual tosh from the heavy brigade.
I think Stingo will be along shortly to explain why his previously excellent website containing tales of derring do and blue water cruising in a totally unsuitable Benny 393 is now not running.... John?

Lynn and I fully intend to take our Jeanneau Sun Odyssey 35 away for a few years, and will be attempting to get all the away round, slowly.

Bear in mind that the boat is approx 85% of the time moored or anchored, so comfort of living space may give way to ultimate operation at sea. Its all a compromise anyway.
 
See, I'm far from an expert (more like a totally clueless noob), but I would've guessed any modern boat would be able to handle pretty much any kind of cruising, as long as the skipper/crew are competent, and the boat is suitably equipped for the task.
 
Modern boats may still be "go anywhere" boats; but not, IMHO, "go anytime" boats.

If there's no pressure, plenty of time and you pick the right time for a passage - then there's no reason I can see why you should not be all right on a modern mass production boat.
 
I guess it depends on what you mean by blue water cruising. I've chartered more AWBs than I've had hot dinners in the Med & Caribbean and done some longish squally passages up through the Windward / Leeward Islands. I find them a handful with a crew of two in a big sea vs. a good old heavy long keeler...(like wot I have now)...but once you get there living on board...no contest the AWB wins IMHO! That should fire up more than a few comments....!!
 
Course you can do it, it's just a matter of confidence. Shrimpy did it, so can you.

If you want to be secure, and comfortable, you may like to consider steel - like us.
 
I reckon an Beneteau Oceanis 40cc (centre cockpit) would do the job of blue water cruiser very well. I chartered one from Sunsail in St Vincent some years back and and it was the first boat I felt I could liveaboard.
 
[ QUOTE ]
I reckon an Beneteau Oceanis 40cc (centre cockpit) would do the job of blue water cruiser very well. I chartered one from Sunsail in St Vincent some years back and and it was the first boat I felt I could liveaboard.

[/ QUOTE ]
I checked out a 36cc yesterday, loved it. High on my list of candidates as my future boat. 40cc is just a tad out of my budget. I'd like to think that I could do the ARC on an appropriately equipped 36cc.

AWB = Average White Boat
 
Hi!

I'm looking at taking the leap into the Blue Water in the next year or so. I've been getting the house ready for sale, once sold we rent a place while we get used to sailing the new boat we purchase, plan the trip, sell our remaining possessions and current boat then we (Me, missus and 2 kids) will be leaving Britain for adventures afloat.

We start with the ARC and from their we'll see what happens, probably take our time around the islands and then head back to the med before the hurricane season starts.

Then we'll do it all again ! :-)

I have seen all the "Can't be done unless..." comments, I got the distinct impression that many of the chaps who have those opinions would slag anything off you set sail in unless it was their own boat (of course!).

Take a look at the ARC entry lists more than a few AWBs in there and more than a few people enjoying sailing further afield in their AWBs from what I've read on the sites and in the mags.

I'm looking to buy an AWB and for our purposes the no. 1 contender at the moment is the Benny Oceanis 473, I like the new Jenn 49ds however, that may not happen unless my bonus at the end of the year is a good 'un /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

IMO if I don't do it now (age 35) things may conspire against me later on, I have the chance to cruise further afield and by god I'm going to take it.
 
It is possible to cruise on an AWB, but some passages will be less comfortable, and in my experience (of having cruised a long way in company with AWBs and others), you will get more gear failure and maintenance may be harder.
Cruising between the Antilles can be bumpy, but it isn't on these trips that the difference will be greatest. Leaving the US East Coast for 5 days to Bermuda in November is a trip that is hard to time perfectly and it doesn't take much rough weather to sort out the AWB's from the rest. Admittedly this is accentuated by some of their owners choosing such a trip for their first journey at night or out of sight of land, so cossetting is the US East Coast. The Red Sea is another stretch where the AWBs were tested, but so to were well found cruising boats with experienced crews.
It isn't just that these boats are lighter, but they are not as resistant to leaks, and deck fittings and rigging are not as strong as on other boats. I'll never forget the owner of a Benny 440 discovering, on arriving in Bermuda, that his anchor locker (which had been underwater for about half the trip) had been leaking into the accommodation, so three quarters of the vessel had been invaded by salt water for several days.
Service access can also be a problem if accommodation has been maximised. On a Hunter (Legend) 450 the earth was attached to the bottom of the engine block by a stud that could only be tightened by the use of two tools from opposite sides of the engine. When this came out, the entire wiring loom had a 'meltdown', necessitating the removal of the whole galley to replace it.
Construction standards are improving all the time but in recent years this has led to the boats getting cheaper rather than more suited to bluewater cruising.
Rally Veteran
 
Hi RallyVeteran,

Thanks for the response.

I do accept that whilst conditions will strain an AWB I'm of the generation that's only ever sailed AWBs and as a result I expect failure, I expect the boat to be tested, I'm used to tucking in a reef as soon as it starts to gust F5.

As a result my expectation level is set and common sense applied e.g. I don't try sailing to Bermuda in November. I ensure my fittings are the best I can get, I check the structure after a long sail/hard beat. This is all stuff I do now.

My problem is that there isn't a lot else to choose from boats wise that I know of for the price e.g. 150k for me 50k for Cardo that gets the "certified for blue" stamp of approval.

As I mentioned earlier I've had so many responses like what you've posted but crucially those that warn against AWB use hardly ever issue advice on what to look for i.e. the models to choose etc. etc.

From what I've seen so far most of the yachts that are in the price bracket I'm looking at to hold a family are either the AWB (lots of space, missus friendly and a substantial size) or some of the older yachts that to be honest look either proper knackered or so old you have to question as to how much it's going to cost to refit the lot and is it worth the expense?

This is why the lure of the AWB is strong. It has a good size, looks like it will do the job and most important of all reasonably priced.

In your experience what makes of other boat are better than the Bens, Jenns, Hunters etc. of this world and that are affordable to the man on the street?

What separates the true blue cruiser from the AWB?
 
Cardo...

Check out the Sunsail 'for sale' ads. They occasionally have a 40cc on the list.

The 40 cc is not worked anywhere near as hard as the standard multi-cabin many berth boats because they are relatively expensive to charter due to the higher purchase cost and small number of berths.

I know a guy with one from 2001 just coming out of the Sunsail fleet in the BVI. There are others available in the BVI from $99k
 
I have, on a Bavaria 390 (1991) and a Sweden 38....I've also sailed Twisters and Rival 38's a bit too as a comparison.

The lightweight plastics are fine, but looking at the current crop (2000-now) The size of fittings on some models has been compromised to save costs. I might not sleep quite as well when being knocked flat whilst hove to in a new Bav as my old one.

They do break but so do all boats if treated badly or put in the wrong place. Learn your meteorology and be gentle on the boat and crew.

In truth I'd sail tans ocean in a bilge keel centaur (Ok they were well made) but I'd treat it differently to a Rival 38. I would be less happy on a new plastic fantastic 50K brand new 36, but may still go.

For my next boat I'll be buying one that has just returned from a long trip, as generally the problems have all been sorted and a lived on boat is often the best maintained boat.
 
[ QUOTE ]
crop

In truth I'd sail trans ocean in a bilge keel centaur (Ok they were well made)


[/ QUOTE ]

They also had a reputation for losing keels! and were snered at in their day by traditionalaist Yachties as floating caravans. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
At risk of appearing 'old school' I would like to put in my 2p worth.

There is no reason why AWB, of inexpensive build, should not sail around the world.

Personally I would be scared of the unprotected rudder hitting something one dark night or day -

I met a 'new' Bav 45 in the Red Sea that had come up from Australia. The family were having a great time and enjoying the experience and comfort of the boat. When I went to 'tea' I was aware that it was already looking 'shabby'. They were experienced and knowageable sailors who maintaind the boat to the higest standard. The interior finish was simply not up to 24/7 by 18 months of family liveaboard.

In smaller AWB they are less comfortable in heavy seas as they get thrown around more than heavier construction and possibly tend to slam more. None of that is fatal and 80% of the time is spent parked - when they are very comfortable.

If you mean to cruise the Med/Atlantic/Caribbean circuit then why not? Mainly there are marina's and lots of boat friendly places and other than the normal wear of constant living aboard, not much worse than cruising the UK channel waters.

When you venture further afield - and relatively few do - you start to encounter concrete wharfs, nasty bits of metal and wear to the hull and superstructure that a more heavily laid up boat will withstand better.

In the end it is economics - have a look at a 6 - 7 year old ex-Moorings - Sunsail charter boat that has gone on to other charter companies - probably only used 6 months of the year and even with constant maintenance they are pretty tired. - That equates to 3 or 4 years liveaboard. Then look at a more expensive - better laid up and finished boat of 20 - 25 years old and many still look excellent if old fashioned.

Sometimes all that glitters and is perfect for say an Atlantic circuit may not be such a good financial investment over a longer period.

It is always the 'person' not the boat!

Michael
 
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