Bl**%y teak decks again

B

bromleybysea

Well-Known Member
Joined
10 Nov 2007
Messages
677
Location
Not Bromley anymore, yippee!!
Visit site
The old perennial again I’m afraid. An old teak deck that is through-fastened and so leaks. Can’t afford to replace with new teak and don’t like the look of any of the synthetic substitutes. Probably possible to repair/refurbish but marginal in terms of benefit and logevity, so I was wondering about getting rid of it altogether. Problem is that the teak sits in a recess in the deck/coachroof moulding rather than simply being plonked on top. Most of the Swedish builders also seem to do this, so if you ripped the teak off you would be left with a recess to fill to flush-up the deck. I was wondering about the practicality of using ply & epoxy and covering with epoxy and mat. Has anyone any experience of this sort of solution or other suggestions? Please, I love the boat and don’t want to get rid of her.
 
Fair bet that when you get the teak off, the structure underneath will be a cosmetic mess, so will need to be made good in some way whatever you do. When I did it (without the problem of a recess) I considered various possibilities although I plumped for real teak in the end. The boatyard did think it could put a new gel coat surface on, but wasn't very convincing when it came to 'moulding' non-slip on top of it. Cheapest alternative was gel and deck paint, which I didn't fancy because the deck would have needed repainting every so often. Favourite alternative was gel coat topped by Treadmaster but in the end total cost was close to re-teaking.

My worry with your solution is the ply element. Ply does have a reputation for absorbing moisture and de-laminating. I know there are solutions to this, but I'm not sure I'd want to trust ply long-term, and it's not a job you'd want to do again.
 
Last edited:
Alternative to ply is to use closed cell foam and then cover with eopxy glass. Don't use mat (not compatible with epoxy) but glass cloth. You can then have either a textured finish or use peel ply to get smooth and paint.

Might be worth talking to Wessex Resins.
 
this is from someone who loathes fake teak, but at SBS I saw flexiteak (I think), and in their demo samples, at least, it was very very good. Whether its that good when laid, I dont know, but this was far better than any one I ve seen before.
 
Last edited:
Yes. Ply pads bonded to the substrate and foam would be needed.

Ply all over would work and if epoxy encapsulated would not pose a rot problem. However, foam would be lighter and easier to bond to the substrate. I assume if you are building up depth to replace the teak you are talking about 9-12mm which in ply would be very difficult to form to any curve without fastening! Also suspect much more expensive and you might find overall cost similar to using teak!
 
Consider the Epoxy and Deck Paint Method

I am facing a deck issue with the diamond checked deck covering - Treadmark, or something like that. Its a similar problem but not as extensive.

My plan is to remove the covering. Prepare the deck, block off some old fitting holes, fix any surface issues and then lay over the old area glass cloth and epoxy.

To keep it neat I will attached small battens about 3 mm thick along the edge of the old footprint and glass into the well created by the battens.

Once that's finished I intend to fare off and paint. An identical boat that never had any coating but does have a painted deck from new, 22 years old, looks really good. The boat is a sail training boat and heavily used. The deck paint has anti slip properties, sorry I cant remember the name, but the owner stated that the deck paint lasts for many years. Its wellies and oilskins that wear out!

I have not finalised my plans but I think the removal, repair and surface preparation with glass / epoxy and final fairing, followed by paint will be a relatively cost effective way to get a good deck again. Fairing epoxy on flat surfaces with guides can produce very good results by DIY.

A previous post advises West System web site, below is the link: -

http://www.westsystem.com

They have a forum for epoxy builders, are friendly and helpful. It would not surprise me if they have come across this problem.

The well that your teak sits in might not have to be filled to the top. Could you cut a channel to allow water run off at low points? So just prepare the base of the well to make a deck surface, fair up, and paint, but make some cunning gutters to drain off water. Could be a good cheap solution?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Bl+*dy teak decks

Thanks for the helpful replys so far. I think the "well" that the teak sits in would have to be filled as I can't see a practical way to drain it. It would also look rather odd. I would also be concerned that the teak stiffens the deck and without it the sub-deck, which is solid GRP, would be too thin and flexible, so I would be happier with some sort of overlay. I probably know the answer to this- but is it totally out of the question to cover the teak with epoxy and cloth? I accept that it would need to be dry and sanded/filled. I imagine that the answer would be that subsequent movement in the teak would crack the covering, but I do recall that there was a system for sheathing wooden hulls called Cascover or similar?
 
Cascover is great stuff! My boat's hull was sheathed from new in 1963 and is as good as new. However not only is it very tricky stuff to do properly, but I don't think it is available any more. It was supplied by one of the predecessor firms to Wessex Resins. It was not so successful on decks as it wears and can crack. I looked at a boat recently from the same builder as mine that had its decks sheathed in Cascover - it was a mess as once you get a crack water seeps underneath.

It is unlikely that your teak adds any strength to the deck - or rather the deck will be plenty strong enough without it. If you do go down the route of building up with a core then make sure you seal all the holes for fastenings with epoxy then use a bedding compound - I prefer Polysulphide but Sika seems to be popular if you never want to get the fitting off!
 
I think the problem is that no form of coating, be it on teak, foam or ply, can be guaranteed to stay watertight for ever and as soon as you have a crack.

If you are also worried about the rigidity then you could consider replacing the teak with a laminated decking - Robbins do one called "Elite" Decking - and leaving that exposed. That is essentially a veneer of teak laminated to marine ply.
 
Saw a Twister the other day with fake teak called Tek Dek (or similar) used on the cockpit seats/locker lids. Very hard to distinguish from the real thing. I think covering with ply and epoxy will be similar cost and not look half as good,also may affect resale value at a later date.
 
bedouin said:
I think the problem is that no form of coating, be it on teak, foam or ply, can be guaranteed to stay watertight for ever and as soon as you have a crack.

If you are also worried about the rigidity then you could consider replacing the teak with a laminated decking - Robbins do one called "Elite" Decking - and leaving that exposed. That is essentially a veneer of teak laminated to marine ply.
Click to expand...

This product is as expensive material wise per sq M as solid 12mm teak decking. It does not of course need the same labour for laying and caulking. However, it is difficult to bond successfully to grp, particularly if you have curves. The thinnest is 6mm which might work if you vacuum bag, but try bending 12mm and holding in place while the adhesive cures (voice of experience here). Also the "strips" are in a straight line so you cannot get a swept effect - and the wearing veneer is only 1.4 mm thick. Then if you do manage to lay it securely you still have the exposed edges to deal with.

Another alternative if you can accept straight strips is to use Robbins 2.6mm Teak veneers which I have done successfully. However this will not meet the OPs requirement as he has to fill the recess where the current teak is laid.

Never a simple answer!
 
Tranona said:
Yes. Ply pads bonded to the substrate and foam would be needed.

Ply all over would work and if epoxy encapsulated would not pose a rot problem. However, foam would be lighter and easier to bond to the substrate. I assume if you are building up depth to replace the teak you are talking about 9-12mm which in ply would be very difficult to form to any curve without fastening! Also suspect much more expensive and you might find overall cost similar to using teak!
Click to expand...


I presume if you were to use foam that you would lay up with cloth and epoxy on the underside before its laid. Otherwise it would be a pain to do overhead. The foam would not bend quite so easy.

I often wonder about some of the teak decked yachts I see for sale with I suspect worn down decks. Could the teak be filled and smoothed off and epoxy and cloth laid straight over the top?
 
If the reason for not replacing the deck with teak is cost why not use quarter sawn douglas fir, goes a nice grey colour and wears well. Would seem to me to be easier and quicker to get a good looking deck. but then i'd lay it myself, and don't have much success with all this new fangled epoxy.
 
fishermantwo said:
I presume if you were to use foam that you would lay up with cloth and epoxy on the underside before its laid. Otherwise it would be a pain to do overhead. The foam would not bend quite so easy.

I often wonder about some of the teak decked yachts I see for sale with I suspect worn down decks. Could the teak be filled and smoothed off and epoxy and cloth laid straight over the top?
Click to expand...
Well could you? I suspect that movement of the teak would inevitably crack the epoxy/cloth but would be interested to hear from anyone who has done this.
 
Glue the teak...??

bromleybysea said:
The old perennial again I’m afraid. An old teak deck that is through-fastened and so leaks. Can’t afford to replace with new teak and don’t like the look of any of the synthetic substitutes. Probably possible to repair/refurbish but marginal in terms of benefit and logevity, so I was wondering about getting rid of it altogether. Problem is that the teak sits in a recess in the deck/coachroof moulding rather than simply being plonked on top. Most of the Swedish builders also seem to do this, so if you ripped the teak off you would be left with a recess to fill to flush-up the deck. I was wondering about the practicality of using ply & epoxy and covering with epoxy and mat. Has anyone any experience of this sort of solution or other suggestions? Please, I love the boat and don’t want to get rid of her.
Click to expand...

I'm just about to purchase a trawler yacht that may have this problem on one of her decks ( yes I've factored it into the buying price!) My plan was to unscrew all the teak planks fill the screw holes in the GRP then epoxy the teak strips back onto the deck without screws and caulk with sikaflex or similar... sand the whole lot and bobs your uncle... well thats the theory anyway!! I've never actually done it. I've seen detail of doing this to create a teak deck somewhere either on WEST's website or Robbins timber so assuming my teak has enough substance left don't see why I can't do the same with the existing teak strips. Would that be any good for your situation..??? good luck.. Iain
 
I did consider doing just that as one possibility, as what's left of the deck is still more than on a lot of modern boats and would see me out. I think that sticking the teak down with Sikaflex would probably be better than epoxy as it would be more flexible.
 
bromleybysea said:
I did consider doing just that as one possibility, as what's left of the deck is still more than on a lot of modern boats and would see me out. I think that sticking the teak down with Sikaflex would probably be better than epoxy as it would be more flexible.
Click to expand...

I've just found the book I read it in.. its the west system "fibreglass boat repair and Maintenance" the refer to installation of a new teak deck but as far as I can see re-installation will be just the same if your teak strips have some substance left. They talk about two methods. The first refers to teak strips 3mm thick bonded and caulked at the same time by epoxy coloured black with graphite. They then also talk about teak strips 19mm thick with which they do refer to movement of the wood being more at the top than the bottom so with wood that thick they recomend bonding to the deck with epoxy but caulking with an appropriate compound to allow for the movement. In both methods they talk about calmping the strips down with sheet metal screws temporarily between the strips which also act as spacers. With the re-installation I am thinking I will probably use the original screws to clamp the strips during bonding but once cured remove them, fill the holes with epoxy and replace the teak plugs. My strips are( bearing in mind I don't yet have the boat!) 8-10mm so I would probably go with the poxy gluedown with caulking filler. I shared your concern over wood movement but the West people seem to know their stuff ( as I guess they should!!) so thats my plan. I would again stress that I've never actually done it but have worked quite a bit with epoxy. If you want any further detail of what it says in the book please give me a shout... good luck Iain
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top