Biscay: The inshore route - recommendations?

We did this last year, leaving Belfast start of July. All the way down to La Rochelle was very busy but good facilites (though my partner was not entranced by all the showers available - she has v high standards). We then went down to Capbreton in one sail, and then a short hop over to San Sebastian and day sailed along to A Coruna. I am glad I did it, but there was a lot of swell coming down and not much wind in that corner so a lot of the time we were motoring with a swell on the beam. Bilbao and Santander were quite expensive marinas (50 and 55 Euros a night respectively for an 11m boat - both Real clubs) and we weren't too keen on Santander - most of the shops my partner was looking for were out of town. Gijon is a lovely town. The negative for us was the northerly swell which seemed to be constant and kept us out of interesting harbours and meant that the motoring was for longish distances. We had planned on going around beyond A Coruna but the price in the Real marina was so good and the town had everything we wanted that we decided to leave the boat there for the winter.

Very pleased we did the trip and didn't just do across Biscay, but not sure I would want to do it regularly. Almost no-one, by the way, speaks English.

I was disappointed by the Gulf of Morbihan - my only contact with it had been George Millar's post-war book. It was packed with moorings. We decided not to go to Vannes to get away from the crowds, but a friend there at the same time as us did and said it was worthwhile.

Nicest place of all was San Sebastian and even though I made more than my share of errors there, it was really lovely anchored in the bay (with a week's worth of nightly high performance fireworks).
 
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Tomahawk said:
Santander is a lovely place, but there in only one marina in the bay and that's mile from the city accessible only by bus.
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Why would you want a marina when there is such an idilic anchorage that is only a 15/20 min walk to town?

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LadyInBed said:
Why would you want a marina when there is such an idilic anchorage that is only a 15/20 min walk to town?
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Too true. But in Santander the Spanish weather people had a weather warning out (neither Windy nor XCWeather seemed to think there was a problem) and I thought better tied up. Nothing came of it so I was a bit miffed.

We anchored just at that spot, too, and heard a crackling sound from all over the hull. Feeding shrimps or something.
 
dgadee said:
We did this last year, leaving Belfast start of July. All the way down to La Rochelle was very busy but good facilites (though my partner was not entranced by all the showers available - she has v high standards). We then went down to Capbreton in one sail, and then a short hop over to San Sebastian .......
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Thanks for all that. Good advice!
 
dgadee said:
Too true. But in Santander the Spanish weather people had a weather warning out (neither Windy nor XCWeather seemed to think there was a problem) and I thought better tied up. Nothing came of it so I
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The eastern half of Northern Spain is home to a local weather phenomenon which can be quite dangerous for small vessels, essentially a violent sudden squall lasting a few hours, usually during the early afternoon of very hot days.
Local weather info/forecast can be very useful, being rather difficult to forecast it simply from synoptics, gfs and the like.
Google "galerna" for more info, (or youtube for videos) :)
 
Roberto said:
The eastern half of Northern Spain is home to a local weather phenomenon which can be quite dangerous for small vessels, essentially a violent sudden squall lasting a few hours, usually during the early afternoon of very hot days.
Local weather info/forecast can be very useful, being rather difficult to forecast it simply from synoptics, gfs and the like.
Google "galerna" for more info, (or youtube for videos) :)
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We had been advised by a sailor from somewhere in the eastern "corner" that we could be stuck there a while waiting for weather, his advice was not to go there unless we had time to spare. Have done LR to La Coruna once, Gijon twice and prefer that route, some good anchorages and places to see along the coast.
 
Roberto said:
The eastern half of Northern Spain is home to a local weather phenomenon which can be quite dangerous for small vessels, essentially a violent sudden squall lasting a few hours, usually during the early afternoon of very hot days.
Local weather info/forecast can be very useful, being rather difficult to forecast it simply from synoptics, gfs and the like.
Google "galerna" for more info, (or youtube for videos) :)
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Yes, we were told about this when in Bilbao and were toddling along not far - 2 miles - from Santander with full sail up. Within a minute it had gone to about F7. I had to take the wheel - 'first mate' (she calls herself) couldn't hold it - and so dropped the main entirely. As we got to the entrace it went calm. First mate still thinks I should have forecast it coming in after the Bilbao warning. All my fault, in other words.
 
northcave said:
Ok so after a summer in Norway last year we were meant to sail south and cross the Atlantic last December but we didn't. So we are now planning to head south on April 1st instead. This means we have time to enjoy the coastal waters of Biscay and all that it offers. I know very little of this area.

Has anyone got specific recommendations of areas, harbours, anchorages and inland adventures? I'll make a list of everything recommended mark them off in my charts to visit :)

Edit: setting off from Plymouth.
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You might (or might not) find http://weather.mailasail.com/Franks-Weather/Crossing-Biscay-Meteorologists-Advice to be useful. Apologies if I am teaching grannies to suck eggs.
 
http://weather.mailasail.com/Franks-Weather/N-Spain-W-France may also give some ideas. In previous years, we also visited St Jean de Luc and several other N Spanish ports such as Ribadeo, Ribadesella.

I have not read through all the comments above but, particularly along the N Spanish coast beware of the swell. Some ports well documented in pilots can be lethal. If in doubt, stay out. Safe entries we found were San Sebastian, Bilbao, Santander, Gijon (a little iffy) it may be better to use Aviles - we entered in a F7/8, the swell cut off as we passed the end of the training wall. Call traffic control on Ch12. Further west Viveiro is safe, we ran in with a N 7/8. Very safe deep in the ria.
 
Roberto said:
The eastern half of Northern Spain is home to a local weather phenomenon which can be quite dangerous for small vessels, essentially a violent sudden squall lasting a few hours, usually during the early afternoon of very hot days.
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I read an article about this. Apparently a large block of cool air can slip over the edge of the plateau and it is not unknown to lead to 100mph winds very quickly.

I have no personal experience of this.
 
northcave said:
Ok so after a summer in Norway last year we were meant to sail south and cross the Atlantic last December but we didn't. So we are now planning to head south on April 1st instead. This means we have time to enjoy the coastal waters of Biscay and all that it offers. I know very little of this area.

Has anyone got specific recommendations of areas, harbours, anchorages and inland adventures? I'll make a list of everything recommended mark them off in my charts to visit :)

Edit: setting off from Plymouth.
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Next June I plan to return to the west coast of France in my Westerly 33 (draft 1.4m, bilge keels) for a couple of weeks. We will probably head to Camaret-sur-Mer then, hopefully, Belle Ile. Are there any suggestions for places to visit on the way back up the coast. Interesting towns, villages, anchorages and the odd marina are what we would like. Last year we went to Camaret, Ile de Groix, Concarneau, Audierne and L'Aber-Ildut. This year we would to visit different places.
Allan
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Here is a post I made at the end of August.

Sourhern Brittany as far as Morbihan (long post)

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Some things that I enjoy (in response to a pm ): (a few details updated)

In general, the islands of Brittany are worth seeing if only for the fact that the number of French people there are limited by the ferries!

Ushant, Molène and Sein (especially Sein with its narrow streets and Breton speaking population) but pay special attention to tides and currents which are very strong. Keep an eye out for the resident population of large dolphins and possibly for seals – probably the only place in Brittany to see them.

Brest: a visit to Océanopolis is well worth while. The town itself is nothing special. There may be interesting boats in the old port which you would see on the way in.

Aulne River. Depending on your draft you can go up as far as Châteaulin which is about 15 miles up-stream and then there is one lock to pass. I went up with 1m70 draft but you should check the sailing directions. Keep to the outside of bends.

Camaret : is a junction port for boats heading north and south. If shopping is required it’s easier to cross the harbour in a dinghy; otherwise it’s a long walk.

Heading south, the southern part of Point de la Chèvre has some picturesque little bays which are worth a swim stop in good weather. Keep an eye out though for buoyed fishing nets. Morgat is a useful if somewhat featureless port. The resort about half a mile away has some good restaurants. Douarnenez is interesting especially visiting the floating boat museum which, incidentally, nearly bankrupted the town…

Leaving Douarnenez, I would visit Sein (see above) then Audierne. I always moored in the outside harbor and so cannot comment on the approach to the inner harbor which is tide dependent I think.

Leaving Audierne and rounding Pen Marc'h the first significant port is Le Guilvinic which traditionally is one of the main fishing ports and not that welcoming to pleasure craft – although I had no problems.

From there I would tend to head to the Glénan islands where you have a ring of islands surrounding a lagoon which is one the few areas in Europe to have coral sand beaches (W. Ireland also have some). There are buoys at St Nicholas but elsewhere there is not much problem anchoring. St Nicholas has two restaurants, a seafood one where you have to reserve at lunch-time for the evening and the previous evening for lunch-time. They have a large vivarium behind with an impressive collection of lobsters. There is another bar-restaurant with a basic but reasonable selection. On St Nicholas, there is a fenced-off area where there is a type of narcissus which only occurs on that spot. As the day ferries only land at St Nicholas, I prefer other parts especially the SW corner of Penfret. Great places for walks.

From the Glénan I would then visit Loctudy (if you need a port but otherwise so-so) and then Bénodet and opposite, Sainte Marine. Bénodet is one of the favourite places for my kids because it has a lively atmosphere, even a casino. There are usually some beautiful boats here.

The Odet River : not to be missed. Steep wooded banks and twisting curves. Near the top and just before it opens out to a wide open bit, there is a turning off to starboard; it’s very narrow but inside it opens out into a lovely tree-surrounded pool (Anse an Toulven). Keep well to left of entrance; it may be prudent for you to wait for half-tide rising before entering though I have only lightly touched once at low tide. The centre of the anse is deep enough and mud-bottomed so no great risk. After the Bénodet area you can head to Port La-Forêt where several large racing boats are based. It’s a very good place if things need repairing. There is a golf course within (long) walking distance.

From Port-la-Forêt, go next to Concarneau. It’s not particularly practicable for shopping but well worth a visit. Visit "la Ville Close" a walled town on an island within the harbour.

Our favourite restaurants :

• Le Croquervol : 3 rue Alfred Le Ray just opposite the marina.
• La Coquille : In the inner harbour on the right bank. The owner is the former chef of the Tour d’Argent at Paris, one of Paris’ best restaurants.
• L'Auberge St Laurent on the road between Concarneau and Port La Forêt
* Restaurant de l'Hôtel des Sables Blancs around the corniche at Concarneau
* L'Amiral - just opposite the entrance to la Ville Close

After Concarneau there are several little ports along the way, Doelan, Port Mane’ch where, depending on your draft, you can go up the Aven as far as Pont Aven a very picturesque town for painters where Paul Gauguin was based before heading off to warmer places. Excellent restaurant at l'Hôtel des Ajoncs d'Or - where Gauguin used to stay. You will have to dry out against a wall at low tide. Alternatively you can explore the Belon estuary just opposite Port Mane’ch.

From there I would visit the Ile de Groix. Port Tudy is a picturesque little port and there are very good walks around the island. In settled weather and a westerly régime you can moor off the beaches to the east.

From there you can visit the Rade de Lorient where you have the choice of 5 or 6 marinas. My home base is Locmiquélic which is excellent. I read in the visitors’ book that some consider it to be the best on the west coast of France.

Two restaurants on the port : Le Cargo Sentimental (owned until recently by a circus clown) where the fare is good but has become a little pricey (the cabaret act?) and l'Escale o' Port. A small supermarket in the town centre (1 km) or Intermarché, Lidl and a new Leclerc at the other side of the town.

The Tabarly sailing centre at the old submarine pens (Lorient) is worth a visit and is the base for the Banque Populaire trimaran amongst others.

You can also moor virtually in the town centre if crowds and noise are your thing.

Port Louis marina has recently been enlarged and is just past the Citadelle at the entrance.

The Blavet is navigable as far as Hennebont.

From Lorient we usually would head for Belle Ile ignoring the Etel estuary where onshore winds can render the bar difficult. The usual arrival port is Sauzon which has to be among the prettiest ports in Brittany. There is an inner harbour which dries out with a flat sandy bottom and an outer harbour where you raft to buoys. Outside this harbour, buoys are also in place. In northerly winds however it can be uncomfortable. In port, try the Bistro du Port (grilled sardines or côte de boeuf grilled on an open fire in front of you). There is another excellent restaurant to the right hand side of the church going up the hill. I forget its name. (Restaurant Roz Avel : thank you Google Earth - it was open out of season when I last visited))

Another place not to miss is Ster Wenn (pronounced Venn) which is an anchorage behind cliffs in the NW corner of Belle Ile. You enter Ster Vraz and then do a right angle to Ster Wenn. You anchor in the middle and take lines to the left bank. There is a golf green on the cliffs at Ster Vraz (9 hole course).

From there you can visit Le Palais, the main port on the island, and its Citadelle by Vauban.

From Belle Ile you either visit Port Haliguen and La Trinité (aka in France as the mecca of yachting) or the islands of Houat (“wot”) and Hoëdic (“eddick”) where you have a superb restaurant at the hotel. We also had an excellent grilled bass (bar grillé) “Chez Paul”. Houat has better anchorages than Hoëdic, and all around the island depending on the winds. Excellent walks on both islands.

Le Crouësty is a well appointed and friendly port but slightly soul destroying. It is a good stop-over point for visiting the Golfe de Morbihan; I prefer mooring to the east of Ile d’Arz but it’s not good holding ground. Better to use a buoy if possible. The island as well as the Ile aux Moines are picturesque and worth visiting.

That’s all for now folks….

Read more at http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?293717-Southern-Brittany#tet6WjbXiEwlOsAb.99

As others have said I would not go any farther than La Rochelle and would then head off towards NW Spain.
 
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Port Medoc is an OK alternative if Royan full. Short walk to ferry to Royan.
I hated Archachon. The marina is full, the waiting quay is full of local boats and if you make the mistake of contacting them in advance to ask for a berth they say no, so if you must go, just turn up and fight for a place. They also charged a high rate (€60 ten years ago) for the first night with the second night "free". Facilities not brilliant.
The range is supposed to answer you if you call up to ask about firing - they didn't.
Cap Breton (for Biarritz) was great. The only drawback is the really dangerous entry in swell/big waves. Take careful note of warnings in pilot books and almanac.
Zumaya is an ok alternative.
Loved La Coruna - we were in town marina by yacht club.
 
We love the corner and Spanish N coast. My website - montgomery-smith.org - describes many of the places that we visited in 2 voyages, one on each direction.

Several harbours have been usefully improved in the last few years:

Pasajes has a pontoon you can moor on.

San Sebastian now has visitors' berths in the N basin of the inner harbour.

Laredo has a (rather pricey) marina.

Gijon has the Marina de Yates.

Aviles has visitors' berths

In Ribadasella you can lie to the E side of the marina walkway. And if you come out of season you may get a booking to see the cave paintings. This may be the only caves with prehistoric paintings left where ordinary tourists are allowed in.

It's a coast for those who enjoy anchoring or tying to harbour walls rather than marinas. And it helps to speak a little Spanish - but we didn't on our first visit and managed ok.

TonyMS
Razzmatazz
 
I really wish we'd gone to San Sebastian. I think we actually used your website a bit when we were doing it, but getting right down into that corner probably would have meant an extra month to get out of there! Our old overladen HT doesn't do super well going into the wind.
 
Sybarite said:
As others have said I would not go any farther than La Rochelle and would then head off towards NW Spain.
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Clearly, we all have our own views and experiences. We have “done Biscay” all ways. They were all interesting/enjoyable. In my opinion, if you miss the area south of Royan to, say, Viveiro as seems to be suggested here, then you miss a great deal of interest. The Guggenheim at Bilbao is worth a day of anyone’s time. True the coast south of Royan was drawn by god with a ruler and boring. We preferred to do it at night. Arcachon is worth a visit, as is Cap Breton. Hondarribia is fascinating.

From Bilbao you can get a bus to Guernica, best known to us for Picasso’s depiction of the event, and see what the Spanish Civil war was about. Get a feel for the first use of aircraft to put fear into the civilian population. The exhibition highlights the fact that the bombing was one matter; it was the aftermath that was so terrible. The outside moving staircases at Hondarribia and Getaria were an eye-opener . Here you see the statue of Magellan’s navigator - the man who really was the first to circumnavigate. Magellan died en route.

All fascinating. All quite different from the rest of Spain. Often a bit wild in the Basque Country.

But, whatever you do or how you do it, it will be an adventure.
 
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Re post #21;

"We had planned on going around beyond A Coruna but the price in the Real marina was so good and the town had everything we wanted that we decided to leave the boat there for the winter."

We are looking at doing something similar this summer. How did leaving your boat in A Coruna work out ? Was the boat in the water all winter or lifted out ? Any issues ??
 
Personally I would suggest that you just go and explore, dependant upon what wind/weather you get: You can do the whole trip in 50 mile max legs. Anywhere you find will be as if, you have are the first person to get there. Use Google earth to plan, you can see what is where and either avoid or go to large marinas/ or quiet anchorages. Inside the corner is quieter and very nice.
 
I am the Allan for whom Sybarite posted his detailed information(#32). I can thoroughly recommend everything said on this thread and the other one he refers to. I did the trip planned for the following June and I've since done another, getting as far as lle D'oleron. I've still got a printout of the other thread somewhere.
One small thing I would add, if you want to get beyond the Raz in one go, the Ile Seine is a good choice if you boat and conditions are suitable. I've dried out in the harbour when I had bilge keels and anchored just north west of the entrance with a fin. It was a fantastic place to start the Breton experience when heading from Newlyn. I quite like Camaret but it's a bit of a gluepot and a surprisingly long detour. If you do use Ile Seine, on no account should you leave without going ashore as it's a fantastic place.
Allan
 
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