Big Boat - Small Boat

[HoratioHB]

Speaking as someone who does not think small is necessarily beautiful, cos I is buying a 42, my logic was that, as we intend to live on board fulltime, I wanted the biggest I could safely handle short handed. Ten years ago I would have said 35 to 39 but, these modern generation boats have been well thought out and I am quite happy to sail mine single handed. Reliable Autopilots, chart plotters, simple reeefing systems and well placed winches all mean a boat that is far easier to handle than before. And for that I get two heads, one with a walk in shower really comfy saloon massive cockpit and lots of storage - why buy smaller??

 

[Guest]

China ... already happening !!

As regards former Eastern Block - many well known names mono - cat - tri's are already built here ... often hulls sent to factorys back in N.W.Europe for fitting out ...

 

[arfa]

Having looked at the small end of the market quite recently I found that there is a fair amount of choice at the sub 25 foot end of the market. In addition to Beneteau, Etap do a 21 and 24 footer and jeanneau have smaller offerings. Even closer to home, Parker do a fine 235 where the waiting list is pretty long and few come on the market. There are also Cornish Shrimpers to add into the mix but they were a bit beyond my budget.
I would echo some of the comments above about marinas not being terribly interested in smaller boats....
However I can say that dry sailing is not a bad option (although I signed up for it before the marina was taken over by MDL....).
I eventually settled on a 3 year old first 211 which ticks all the boxes I need for coastal sailing, although the mark 1 heads is not to everyone's taste /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[jamesjermain]

Catalinas have been available in the EU for ever. Initially as rebadged yachts like the Jaguar 22 and Jaguar 27 but then more directly through agents in the UK. Catalina is, of course, a 'bulk' producer in the States but the marque has never really caught on over here. I find it hard to work out why.

Incidentally both Jeanneau and Beneteau build small, sub-30ft family cruisers though they are of the light and simple persuasion. Also, Moodys were always produced on a production line at Marine Projects until the volume of Princess Yachts forced them out.

The dearth of small cruisers such as those we cut our teeth on in the 60s and 70s is partly due to a saturated market of reasonably sound second hand boats and partly due to the economics of modern boat building. There are sources of new small boats - Select Yachts for Hunters and Cornish Crabbers, Parkers and, of course a selection off east European boats. But the numbers sold are small. The boats are there but people aren't buying them so it's tough to blame the builders. If there was a market there would be builders.

There is, of course, another reason which is that in those heady days young family were prepared to go to sea in little 22 footers; it was a new and exciting thing to do and there was the vicarious thrill of being part of the sophisticated yachty scene. I don't think young people are prepared to do that these days in sufficient numbers to support a revival of small boat building. They want more space and luxury (or at least half of them do!).

 

[jwilson]

It's been going on for years: back in the 70s Rival stopped making the 32 as the 34 cost the same to build. The same applies now - the labour in assembling a 40-footer is little different to a 30-footer, and its the labour that is expensive.

Also, few people now seem to go the dinghy/little cruiser/slightly bigger cruiser/learn as you go route. Now they go to a sailing school, learn on a Bavaria 36, and think that's a normal starter boat, and that you have to have hot water, showers, double berths, heating etc.....

 

[blackbeard]

There's always a bright side. I can still find plenty of room in my favourite anchorage - Blood Alley Lake just south of Brownsea Island in Poole Harbour - anything big enough to draw 2 metres will find it hard to get in, or having got in, to get out again until the next Spring tide /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
and I can go through the Ram's Horn without worrying.

 

[poter]

James,

yes you are right I do remember someone saying my Jag 27 was really a Catalina, she was luvly and a real joy to sail, certainly one of my better buys, sold her for what I paid for her as well.

poter

 

[arfa]

One of the many advantages of a smaller boat is shallow draft which for me means I can creep around the crowds at East Head and find a little room to anchor even if I didn't arrive at dawn at the weekend /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif If you've gone for a parker or a shrimper you can go one better and take the ground. Anyway, horses for courses as another forumite put it

 

[dk]

You may be surprised to hear that in my annual new boat directory last year there were 36 new boats from 25ft-30ft, of which 7 were RCD cat A, and av price was £52,830 on the water. There were 55 boats from 31ft-35ft LOA, of which only 4 weren't cat A, av price £95,380. This would imply that there are more smaller boats available than perhaps we realise.
Duncan

 

[georgeo]

I have been following this thread with interest. I am in the process of acquiring my first own boat-currently I have sole use of a friends Norfolk Smuggler on a lease basis- and have spent a considerable amount of time weighing up the pros and cons of bigger versus smaller. At the end of the day it came down to choosing between a 29 footer and a 35 footer from a currently little known, in the UK anyway, French manufacturer (RM) both products ticking, for me, all the right boxes. It came down to the scenario where I might be in Dielette, for instance, needing to get back to Guernsey for work or something, weather looking a bit dodgy, and SWMBO with me. Which would I rather do it in? Hence the choice for the 35 footer. Also the fact that SWMBO, for the first time, expressed considerable appreciation of the product. I can rarely get her out on the smuggler

 

[Lizzie_B]

I appreciate that catalina used to market under the name Jaguar in Europe, they also sold some under the Ancasta label for a brief spell!!!
However, I believe there was a pause while sorting out some of the RCD nonsense, and it is only fairly recently that they have been actively marketing in the EU under the Catilina name.
I think there is still one charter company in the Med that still runs a fleet of Jaguar 27's which they market as ideal for two (was a 5/6 berth boat when first introduced))!

Strangley, not too many Jaguar/Catalina 30's got sold in the UK, although there are thousands of them still giving good service in the US where I currently sail. Like the Centaur, they perform better than they look as if they ought to!! and many are raced.

 

[TheBoatman]

What I find amazing is that so many owners of "new" boats over 13.7 mtrs or 45' don't realise that they have entered the realms of the Merchant Shipping Act 1993 and as such have to comply with so many extra rules, all of which carry a fine or imprisonment clause. Most are completely unaware that they are breaking the law.

In answer to the original post IMHO the reason why so many boats are now over 45' is simply a matter of "mines bigger than yours" mind set.

If we are honest, 45'+ boats are great at sea, can stand higher wind speeds, normally come with "all" the electronic equipment to make sailing easy BUT when it comes to your average UK marina, try and find a mooring berth ~ the fingers are to small, the gaps between pontoons are to small to work in, on the East Coast the depths are not great for deep draft boats (2+ mtrs) and in general they are a real pain in the proverbial.

I've moved many boats in this range and it's always the same when entering a S.East Coast port ~ yes sir I'm 50 feet long, beam 15 feet, draft 9 foot ~ thank you sir please stand by, Yacht x can you please go to the fishermans wharf out the back of beyond and by the way you will probably touch bottom on LW.

Peter.