best bang for buck, raymarine vs garmin

[adhdan]

replacing old from the 90's with new. looking at either Garmin fantom 18x radar & 1223 touchscreen or Raymarine quantum2 with 12"axiom+ touchscreen. Will be upgrading autopilot to go with whichever as well.

Interested with feedback from anyone who owns or has used either.

thanks in advance
Dan

 

[trevorr]

so pretty much which ever is cheaper then

Raymarine have just started an offer. Trade in your old gear and get 20% off the new stuff. Might help!

 

[PaulRainbow]

Raymarine have just started an offer. Trade in your old gear and get 20% off the new stuff. Might help!

Garmin beat Raymarine, hands down.

I have just ordered a replacement for a MFD that costs £2500 normally, replacement, £412 including collection and return post.

 

[PaulRainbow]

replacing old from the 90's with new. looking at either Garmin fantom 18x radar & 1223 touchscreen or Raymarine quantum2 with 12"axiom+ touchscreen. Will be upgrading autopilot to go with whichever as well.

Interested with feedback from anyone who owns or has used either.

thanks in advance
Dan

Garmin, no question as far as i am concerned.

I personally have the GPSMAP 1223XSV, excellent. I also have the Fantom 124 open array radar, not had chance to use it in anger yet, only just fitted it, but everything looks very good so far.

In my experience, Garmin customer support is the best.

 

[vas]

check how "open" the system you want to fit is, in the sense of using standard protocols so you can mix and match devices later on (as in an AIS, more displays, sensors, etc)
No idea on where the axiom stands re NMEA2000 and their slightly more proprietary older NMEA NG system, but if you have to start paying over the top prices for compatibility cables/adapters, I'd be out!
That may also apply to A/P pump you probably have and how it can be integrated in a new system without having to rip everything off!

V.

 

[Greg2]

Garmin beat Raymarine, hands down.

I have just ordered a replacement for a MFD that costs £2500 normally, replacement, £412 including collection and return post.

Well I am firmly in the Raymarine camp and never got on with Garmin!

Really like our Axioms and the Quantum radar is great - had the Doppler version on the last boat and thought it was very good but not enough to warrant shelling out a bit extra on this boat.

Forums eh?!
.

 

[adhdan]

check how "open" the system you want to fit is, in the sense of using standard protocols so you can mix and match devices later on (as in an AIS, more displays, sensors, etc)
No idea on where the axiom stands re NMEA2000 and their slightly more proprietary older NMEA NG system, but if you have to start paying over the top prices for compatibility cables/adapters, I'd be out!
That may also apply to A/P pump you probably have and how it can be integrated in a new system without having to rip everything off!

V.

thats a good point & something to look into


Also, can anyone explain why a 9" screen is £1200 but the 12" is £2400. Other then a slightly bigger screen what exactly is that £1200 getting me 'more'?

 

[PaulRainbow]

thats a good point & something to look into


Also, can anyone explain why a 9" screen is £1200 but the 12" is £2400. Other then a slightly bigger screen what exactly is that £1200 getting me 'more'?

All of the Garmin stuff is N2K. They make a specific auto pilot core pack that works with 3rd party drives/pumps.

The Axiom is standard N2K, everything else is STNG. So if you buy a brand new plotter and auto pilot you need to use an adapter cable to interconnect them.

 

[vas]

Also, can anyone explain why a 9" screen is £1200 but the 12" is £2400. Other then a slightly bigger screen what exactly is that £1200 getting me 'more'?

12in is not slightly bigger than a 9in in real estate terms!

A 12in laptop or tablet has much more tech than a plotter, two things that are tricky and cost is waterproofing (if it works, not always does!) and sun visibility (that is an issue and a costly one).
Try getting a sun visible computer screen, make it water/splash proof and see what you end up paying. Processingwise, you can stick a raspberry pi and a suitable addon board for less than 60-70quid as the "engine" of the thing. The main costs is the display related ones.

Other than that it's difficult to justify even the 9in 1200 tbh so I guess they simply price them to whatever level they can get away with

 

[PaulRainbow]

12in is not slightly bigger than a 9in in real estate terms!

A 12in laptop or tablet has much more tech than a plotter, two things that are tricky and cost is waterproofing (if it works, not always does!) and sun visibility (that is an issue and a costly one).
Try getting a sun visible computer screen, make it water/splash proof and see what you end up paying. Processingwise, you can stick a raspberry pi and a suitable addon board for less than 60-70quid as the "engine" of the thing. The main costs is the display related ones.

Other than that it's difficult to justify even the 9in 1200 tbh so I guess they simply price them to whatever level they can get away with

I have a 9" and 12" on the flybridge, there is a big difference in size

 

[jakew009]

Also, can anyone explain why a 9" screen is £1200 but the 12" is £2400. Other then a slightly bigger screen what exactly is that £1200 getting me 'more'?

Nothing. They are priced based on what people are prepared to pay not what they cost to build.

 

[westernman]

I though B&G were the bees knees for sailing boats.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I though B&G were the bees knees for sailing boats.

Think again.

 

[TonyR123]

I have gone from Raymarine to Garmin. Garmin tech is probably ahead. As stand alone plotters then for me Garmin is probably better/easier in terms of use - not that I had any issue using the Raymarine, but I get that others maybe used to Raymarine and so prefer that.

Garmin does integrate with other tech - for example watches (not that I have one) and the garmin activecaptain which is a must have for me now. Even the fusion audio is now garmin. A new boat with volvo engines and for me Garmin would be a no brainer.

 

[jfm]

I would/do choose Garmin over Raymarine, 100%.

Lots of reasons but (a) much higher technical spec, (b) better customer support, and (c) Raymarine lost me as a long standing customer when they put their own custom STNG connectors on generic N2K cabling, which was a profiteering attempt by them but gave absolutely nothing but hassle for the customer.

Garmin, in contrast, use generic n2k connectors, though I notice they just started using custom connectors for their gigabit ethernet ("BlueNet") which I'm told is because of the inherent weakness/clumsiness of RJ45 connectors in marine environment. That's highly plausible, but I'll see how it goes this season.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I would/do choose Garmin over Raymarine, 100%.

Lots of reasons but (a) much higher technical spec, (b) better customer support, and (c) Raymarine lost me as a long standing customer when they put their own custom STNG connectors on generic N2K cabling, which was a profiteering attempt by them but gave absolutely nothing but hassle for the customer.

Garmin, in contrast, use generic n2k connectors, though I notice they just started using custom connectors for their gigabit ethernet ("BlueNet") which I'm told is because of the inherent weakness/clumsiness of RJ45 connectors in marine environment. That's highly plausible, but I'll see how it goes this season.

Ref the ethernet connectors J, to be fair, the RJ45 connectors were somewhat generic, if you wanted to keep them waterproof, I've recently fitted some equipment with the "Blunet" connectors and they seem a little less clumsy than the old RJ45 ones.

 

[jakew009]

I would/do choose Garmin over Raymarine, 100%.

Lots of reasons but (a) much higher technical spec, (b) better customer support, and (c) Raymarine lost me as a long standing customer when they put their own custom STNG connectors on generic N2K cabling, which was a profiteering attempt by them but gave absolutely nothing but hassle for the customer.

Garmin, in contrast, use generic n2k connectors, though I notice they just started using custom connectors for their gigabit ethernet ("BlueNet") which I'm told is because of the inherent weakness/clumsiness of RJ45 connectors in marine environment. That's highly plausible, but I'll see how it goes this season.

It’s interesting, because in principle I agree with you, but technically the Raymarine connectors are actually pretty nice.

They are much smaller in diameter so far easier to thread through a boat. The connector doesn’t get caught in anything as you pull it. And the backbone wire / drop wires being different colours / connectors makes it much harder for someone to get it wrong.

It’s also nice the backbone wires have thicker gauge wires for the 12v bus minimising voltage drop (ala the larger Devicenet connectors sometimes seen on larger vessels.

But alas even Raymarine have mostly abandoned it on their new products and they now have a weird half way house of adapter cables with Devicenet on one end and SeatalkNG on the other.

 

[harvey38]

I have a 9" and 12" on the flybridge, there is a big difference in size

I thought size was everything so got a 16" chart plotter, it's too big really

 

[PaulRainbow]

It’s interesting, because in principle I agree with you, but technically the Raymarine connectors are actually pretty nice.

They are much smaller in diameter so far easier to thread through a boat. The connector doesn’t get caught in anything as you pull it. And the backbone wire / drop wires being different colours / connectors makes it much harder for someone to get it wrong.

It’s also nice the backbone wires have thicker gauge wires for the 12v bus minimising voltage drop (ala the larger Devicenet connectors sometimes seen on larger vessels.

But alas even Raymarine have mostly abandoned it on their new products and they now have a weird half way house of adapter cables with Devicenet on one end and SeatalkNG on the other.

This isn't a new thing, plotters have been standard N2K for several years, presumably to make them N2K compliant. Adapter cables, separate backbone and spur cables have been necessary for all of those years, which has been a pain.

You say "Raymarine have mostly abandoned it on their new products" what products have they abandoned it on ? As far as i am aware, they use standard N2K on very few devices.

 

[jakew009]

This isn't a new thing, plotters have been standard N2K for several years, presumably to make them N2K compliant. Adapter cables, separate backbone and spur cables have been necessary for all of those years, which has been a pain.

You say "Raymarine have mostly abandoned it on their new products" what products have they abandoned it on ? As far as i am aware, they use standard N2K on very few devices.

Their products are all ‘standard N2K’ but some just use their own slimline connectors. You can easily chop their connector off and stick a devicenet micro connector on.

Off the top of my head

- all their current chart plotters (Axiom / Element) use devicenet connectors
- their AIS 700 and 4000 unit uses devicenet (but not the old AIS 350 which is SeatalkNG)
- their flagship Ray90/91 VHF is devicenet (but their Ray53/63 is SeatalkNG)

And their Autopilots use a euroblock style terminal just to mix it up a bit. It’s a mess.