Bayliner vs Sealine

[CX54WEK]

Yes, but there is a real thrill and a real difference doing some high speed coastal trips that is different to the Thames, and you can always throttle back to Thames speed if you must. Every Thames boat should be allowed to exercise its engines every now and again! Go on, find out what "WOT" means"

My "Binliner" off the Needles

Poole Bay

Southampton Water on Sunday

Osbourne Bay

Southampton water (we are on the outside)

Don't get me wrong, you will see us on the Thames occasionally for its own experience.

We use our boat properly too

Setting off from Lincoln and heading to Southwold and the Broads on Sunday. I personally dont see the point in buying a sea boat if it wont ever get to stretch its legs and see the salty stuff.

 

[EugeneR]

Are there any increased cost implications related to insuring either boat? We are looking at differing lengths from 28ft to 32ft and with diesel twins and petrol singles.

Insurance increases with value, so insurance for a Bayliner at less than half the price of the equivalent sized Sealine is likely to cost a lot less too. We have the same boat as Sulley, a Bayliner 285, and our insurance is about £210 per year.

As a newbie, but with age on his side, how much more difficult is it to pilot a twin against a single?

Twins is more manueverable than single. However, single with bowthruster (add £3k-ish) is even easier and saves the extra servicing and/or potential for additional engine repairs - especially if you're looking at older Sealines.

Also servicing costs issues, are they hugely increased with a twin...sound obvious but perhaps two engines do it easier than one, so less wear, more reliable?

Servicing is per engine so twins is about double. Twins double the chance of repairs but half the chance of getting stuck at sea. The latter is maybe less of a factor if you are planning to be on the river compared to the sea.

Engines are the most expensive parts of the boat - so a single allows more capital for a bigger boat.

Older engines may have more problems with parts availability in future.

The Sealine seems to be very well finished with good quality fittings....i.e. the door locks don't look as though they will snap at the first sign in change of temperature. Do the Bayliners have the same quality? We are looking at Boats from 1997 onwards.

Sealine quality is better than Bayliner. I believe I would be objective in saying it's like Volkswagen versus Ford, although Sealine owners are in the majority here and may feel differently.

For me, the extra quality on the Sealine does not make a big difference to my enjoyment of the boat, so I don't see the value in paying double the price for the same enjoyment but more ongoing costs / risks.

For the price of a 1997 Sealine you can get a 2007 Bayliner. Whether you want a 1997 Volkswagen above a 2007 Ford is a personal decision. My view is that Bayliner gives the best value for money, by far. That said, I drive an expensive car (which I bought 5 years old but with 5000 miles only, at 1/4 the cost of new)

I have been on / used several Bayliners but have never seen or heard about issues with door locks. Given the shared parent, I would not be surprised if many parts are shared between the brands e.g. door locks all made by Perko...

The other issue is on board heating, dehumidifying......We would like to protect our investment ( we may spend as much as £45,000, a large amount for us) so what are the best methods to allow us to perhaps use the boat up to the late autumn, then to put her to bed over the winter and come back in the spring to a fresh and welcoming cabin

Unless you take her out of the water and remove all water including from the engine, you will have to heat her throughout winter. A tubular heater in the engine bay on a thermostatic switch should do the trick at about £50 total.

A dehumidifier is a must and will ensure that everything stays fresh ... a must, in my view.

It's a shame that there are so many people calling Bayliner names, just like sailboat owners saing Bavaria keels fall off, etc. Same people who argue that an identical but imported boat is half the price of an officially imported one. The funny bit is when someone complains that his expensive boat is too small / does not have XYZ features, when for half the money he can get all those and a much newer boat... albeit a cheaper brand. Again, just like cars...

In the end, it's about what is important to you and how much you want in exchange for how much you want to afford.

Good luck!

 

[CX54WEK]

Reliability doesnt necessarily decrease with age. A well maintained boat at 10 years old may well be more relaible than a poorly maintained boats at a couple of years old.

The age of boats becomes pretty irrelevant at the age of boats the OP is considering. Condition and maintenance mean much more.

 

[No Regrets]

To the OP:-

Do not buy a boat on looks and sex appeal.

We did, and wished we hadn't. Once the truth is revealed, you realise how hollow the decision was!!

 

[russ]

We also bought a Bayliner as our first boat with the view to use it on river and at sea and so far have not regretted it.
Yes handling is not as easy as with a displacement boat but I am slowly learning how to handle her at river speed.
Strong cross winds can also make mooring interesting.
I looked at so many boats before hand but really liked the larger cabin windows that Bayliner offer and light cabin.
For our money we have a on the limit trailable, 5 year old boat with a full history file.
If your around Bray marina your more than welcome aboard for a nose around.

 

[Downsize]

Sex Appeal....

No regrets....unfortunately as a young man when out on the pull I'd go by the adage " Go ugly early" As a man of more mature years although infatuated by looks I can now stand back and with pencil and paper work out the pro and cons. But definitely great advice
Russ...Thanks for that. We may take you up on that as Bray is our preferred place of purchase and mooring. We had a lot of good advice from Dominic

 

[Downsize]

Great advice

EugeneR I'm grateful for the comprehensive answers to my query.....it's been really helpful in my search

 

[Elessar]

I'm not sure if this is the right area to post this query but we are looking to buy a boat for the Thames.

We have seen a beautiful Sealine S28 as well as some lovely Bayliners. I have some questions for you experienced fellas.

Are there any increased cost implications related to insuring either boat? We are looking at differing lengths from 28ft to 32ft and with diesel twins and petrol singles. As a newbie, but with age on his side, how much more difficult is it to pilot a twin against a single? Also servicing costs issues, are they hugely increased with a twin...sound obvious but perhaps two engines do it easier than one, so less wear, more reliable?

The Sealine seems to be very well finished with good quality fittings....i.e. the door locks don't look as though they will snap at the first sign in change of temperature. Do the Bayliners have the same quality? We are looking at Boats from 1997 onwards.

The other issue is on board heating, dehumidifying......We would like to protect our investment ( we may spend as much as £45,000, a large amount for us) so what are the best methods to allow us to perhaps use the boat up to the late autumn, then to put her to bed over the winter and come back in the spring to a fresh and welcoming cabin

A lot of questions....hope it's not too much
Thanks
Lee

I've had 2 bayliners and a sealine on the thames. I did winter on the thames and summer on the coast every year until the cost of the licence increased as much as the winter lock closures did, so I stopped bothering to come back........

Anyway, the bayliner has the same engines as all other fast boats. The GRP is layed up in factory controlled conditions so is as good as any and better than many lower volume boats.

The sealine has far better quality minor fittings, from hinges to door locks, switches and breakers. This can all be seen when you buy it, and you will get more bayliner for your money for this reason. You pays your money.......

One exception to the good hull statement on the bayliner - the hull deck joint is sikaflexed and bolted. The sealine is glassed over inside and can't leak.

Thus check very carefully for rain leaks on a bayliner and look out for sealant on the rub rail. Externally applied sealant will work for a while but split on the first wave you hit. The only fix is to completely remove the rail and reseal properly. Budget £1k for this.

Sealine on Thames

Bayliner on Thames

Sealine at needles

Bayliner at needles

 

[oldgit]

Enjoy your search,there will no doubt be quite a few up and downs as you go along ,but nothing is quite ever as bad or as good as it at first seems.
Avoid horrid petrol engines in any boat over 10ft long if you possibly can.You will not be able to unload of the thing when it comes time to sell.Marinas are full of unsold petrol boats and with good reason.

 

[CX54WEK]

Enjoy your search,there will no doubt be quite a few up and downs as you go along ,but nothing is quite ever as bad or as good as it at first seems.
Avoid horrid petrol engines in any boat over 10ft long if you possibly can.You will not be able to unload of the thing when it comes time to sell.Marinas are full of unsold petrol boats and with good reason.

And on that note dont let the broker suck you in with tales of blinding fuel economy and ease of refueling petrol boats waterside. Its usually a load of cock and bull. Brokers prey on first time buyers to try and offload their unsold petrol boat stock onto them. You may manage fine on the non tidal river, after all petrol stations are to be found in most towns nowadays, but start to get more adventurous and have visions of heading onto the salty stuff and petrol avaliability becomes much more of an issue.

 

[lovezoo]

I see this thread has deteriorated into the usual "the only boat worth buying is the one that is exactly the same as mine". The only thing I am surprised about is that nobody has mentioned that a petrol boat will inevitably explode (if the chocolate outdrives haven't melted and sunk the boat first).

On a more serious note to the OP beware of people telling you how much the boat will cost to service if they haven't bothered to find out first what make and model the engines and outdrives are. They do differ enormously.

There is a S28 around for £44,000 with Yamaha engines - if that is the one the OP is looking at, I would do some research on those engines/outdrives before committing to a survey, but overall the S28 is a great boat.

 

[Richard Shead]

And on that note dont let the broker suck you in with tales of blinding fuel economy and ease of refueling petrol boats waterside. Its usually a load of cock and bull. Brokers prey on first time buyers to try and offload their unsold petrol boat stock onto them. You may manage fine on the non tidal river, after all petrol stations are to be found in most towns nowadays, but start to get more adventurous and have visions of heading onto the salty stuff and petrol avaliability becomes much more of an issue.

Thats a pretty harsh and unfair comment on all accounts.

 

[CX54WEK]

Thats a pretty harsh and unfair comment on all accounts.

Not really no. How many brokers really tell their potential clients the true costs of running a boat, the truth about petrol avaliability, and the truth why a particular boat has been sat around in their yard for the last 12 months (in some cases much more.)

 

[CX54WEK]

I see this thread has deteriorated into the usual "the only boat worth buying is the one that is exactly the same as mine". The only thing I am surprised about is that nobody has mentioned that a petrol boat will inevitably explode (if the chocolate outdrives haven't melted and sunk the boat first).

On a more serious note to the OP beware of people telling you how much the boat will cost to service if they haven't bothered to find out first what make and model the engines and outdrives are. They do differ enormously.

There is a S28 around for £44,000 with Yamaha engines - if that is the one the OP is looking at, I would do some research on those engines/outdrives before committing to a survey, but overall the S28 is a great boat.

It hasnt degraded into anything. The OP has been given som sterling advice, not least to actually think about what he will use the boat for. No point buying thoroughbred to plod along country lanes.

Good point about the servicing costs though. That will vary greatly depending on the engines, how they are used and how much work the OP is willing to put in themselves.

Point to the OP. People expect (rightly or wrongly) to see Volvo Penta engines in Sealines. Anything out of the ordinary and people get wary. This could explain the bargain basement pricing of that particular boat.

 

[Richard Shead]

Not really no. How many brokers really tell their potential clients the true costs of running a boat, the truth about petrol avaliability, and the truth why a particular boat has been sat around in their yard for the last 12 months (in some cases much more.)

Pretty much every broker I know.

 

[Downsize]

Wisdom

Lovely stuff Elessar So jealous that the summer is almost upon us and I'm still undecided.....looking at you and your family enjoying the river / sea makes me want to get on the phone and press the buy button now......but yes hold on all you other fellas....I'm listening and taking my time.

You know what Old Git and CX54WEK the salesman last weekend, when I asked about fuel costs said there was no difference nowadays....and so I walk around the corner to the riverbank in the marina,and from memory, it was something like....petrol £1.65 diesel £1.15. My confidence in his spiel fell straight through the floor I must say.

So that's settled, diesel it is....now to find something with a single stern drive or a bow thruster

 

[CX54WEK]

Pretty much every broker I know.

Really. They must have a different breed of them where you are then because when we were looking for our boat, admittedly its three years ago now, which included looking at brokerages on the Thames, we were issued with some right bull****e stories. Luckily we were wise enough to see through them and avoided a purchase we would later regret.

The broker we eventually bought through was one of the better ones for being truthful but even so some of their figures were still well off the mark.

 

[Richard Shead]

Petrol will be more expensive to run than Diesel they are hard facts.

 

[Downsize]

S28

The boat we were looking at has twin Mercruiser 4.5L petrols with sterndrives.

 

[CX54WEK]

The boat we were looking at has twin Mercruiser 4.5L petrols with sterndrives.

That would explain the price. There are not many petrol powered S28's around the diesels were much more popular.

A S28 with a single big diesel has just sold at our marina, asking price was £51k, dont know what they bought it for but they have said they got a good deal on the asking price so it could well have fallen within your budget.

Best advice, just keep looking and shopping around. Something will crop up. Dont rush into anything though just because it is summer and you want the sunshine. Far better to find the right boat the first time around.