Bay Speed Limit

Should there be an enforcable speed limit within the confines of Cardiff Bay?

  • Yes

    Votes: 33 58.9%

  • No

    Votes: 21 37.5%

  • Don't know

    Votes: 2 3.6%
  • Total voters
    56
Sneds

Sneds

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A lot has been said about the dangers of speeding power boats in the Bay and I am amazed that there is not a speed limit.
With the number of unpowered craft and children using the bay is it not time a speed limit was introduced before someone is killed?
 
Big lake - Lake Windermere = Speed limit

Tiny pond - Cardiff Bay = No speed limit

Crazy, of course there should be a limit. If you want to go charging about, there is a whole big sea outside of the gates.
 
It is quite odd, it feels like there should be. But Saturday I headed over to MQ from the barage, following about 5 boat lengths behind the harbour master launch at 18 knots or so. My thoughts being if anyone knows the limit he should.
 
Leave as it is. They put a speed limit in place when there is an event. It is great to have burn in the winter inside the barrage as no one is around.
 
I agree there's a lot of fun to be had at speed in flat water IF no-one is around. But you only need one irresponsible or unskilled person with an urge for going fast near other users, and the potential for a serious accident is substantial.

Perhaps the CBA needs to identify days or areas where there could be no limit ? A loose agreement might work better than close restrictions perhaps ?


I am not going to bring in the environmental issues such as noise or wash damage.

In any case CBA is aware of user feelings on both sides and the HM has been asked to keep the position under review. Their legal people also have taken a risk position, I understand.
 
Too much legislation now, so leave it be. How many people have been killed by a fast boat even before the barrage ???
Swmbo is welsh squad canoe instructor but is not allowed to paddle in the harbour but they let the kids take opies out and capsize!!!! (apparently due to water quality)
She never goes over so why not ban the dinghys as well as kayaks?
The worst wake is from the ferry type boats and harbour authority vessels anyway.
If i shoot over to Mermaid Quay i make sure i keep clear of other vessels and keep my crew safe at 70 knts.
Any objections please make sure you drive at 10 mph on route to your boat as your more likely to get killed driving on the road than speeding in a boat .
 
CSAIL - you are trained and competent for high-speed work. Would you let a complete beginner with no experience out in charge of your boat at 70 kts ?

You cannot judge other people's abilities to be equal to or approach your own extraordinary abilities, training and experience. By assuming that speed is safe you do not take into account the sheer stupidity, reactive incompetence, and inherent inability to assess a dangerous situation that is the hallmark of many people who buy and run a fast boat without training.

It is dangerous to assume that everyone is as good as you - and that is not intended as a sarcastic comment. You are good with speed; others are not.
 
True, i must admit there are lots of idiots with speed boats and even more with jet skis. I suppose most of them just buy one and go straight off without any sort of training.
 
I think it is typical that a stupid few spoil things for the majority. If all the fast boaters, and their boats, could be trusted I would have no problem with the lack of speed limit. Unfortunately we have all seen stupid and inconsiderate things done in the bay. There are also loads of badly maintained boats and we only need one steering failure or stuck throttle and, due to the close proximity of vulnerable boats, there WILL be a serious accident. I spoke to a representative from the bay authority earlier this year and he gave me the impression that they must have very good insurance and some way around the corporate responsibility legislation.
Allan
 
I'm sorry, but 70kts in the bay, when it is open for general navigation, is irresponsible at best and bloody stupid at worst.
You might be competant but what about the kids out sailing?
Attitude like that makes me more sure that more legisation is needed.
 
Well legislate it then..... we normally sail at about 6 knts.if we take the power boat and its quiet then we open it up. Its the patrol boats and those yellow ribs that annoy me.
Sneddon, talking of speed how fast do you drive on the moyorway when your only a few foot from the car your overtaking? In open water there is a tadge more space!
 
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sneddon said:
I'm sorry, but 70kts in the bay, when it is open for general navigation, is irresponsible at best and bloody stupid at worst.
You might be competant but what about the kids out sailing?
Attitude like that makes me more sure that more legisation is needed.
Click to expand...

Obviously anyone doing 70 knots across the Bay when it's being used by more or less anyone else, particularly a fleet of kids out in oppys is beyond irresponsible - but then I'm confident that even Andy wouldn't be considering that sort of speed given those conditions. But when the bay is deserted it's another matter

The point about Windermere is not quite correct either - there are speed restrictions on Windermere but only because of erosion, and they only apply to certain areas of the lake, where erosion was a problem. Full throttle speeding is still permitted in particular areas, as is waterskiing (I was there in July).

I saw the comments in the mobo racing thread first, and posted there, so have copied the following across:-

What's needed is a response from the harbour patrol boat when some idiot goes ripping through the fleet of dinghies at 30 knots. They need to be reprimanded for their dangerous driving. Speed is safe if the conditions are right.

On one day when the Bay is deserted (say a weekday morning) it is perfectly safe to do 30 knots across the Bay. But to do it on a sunny weekend day when the Bay is crowded is inexcusable. Common sense is all that's needed.

Cardiff Bay Bylaw 5B (at least I think that's the number) reads along the lines of 'It is an offence to operate a vessel in a manner that causes concern to other water users' - enforce this and there is no problem! And no need for any stupid legislation. Let's keep our boating free from the big brother rules and regulations that dog the other areas of our lives.

How many of us have been sat on a long straight stretch of motorway without another car in sight, perhaps in the early hours of the morning, and not been tempted to creep over 70 (or 50 anywhere near Cardiff). It's about using the appropriate speed, not conforming to what some member of the H&S brigade deem to be safe for the worse case scenario.
 
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Agree absolutely with the above, speed is safe when it is deemed safe to do so.

............... and I never exceed the speed limit in the car! ;-)
 
Speed

To answer those that say its OK to speed across the Bay when theres noone about ,how do you know theres isnt someone rowing out to a yacht at CYC or CBYC moorings or someone just transferring out of a dinghy? A fall into the water at this time of year is likely to be fatal for anyone who isnt young and fit.

If you want to go fast then lock out into the Channel and fill your boots.
 
It a commonly observed phenomenon that wake magnitude is not necessarily related to speed. What is directly related to speed is the kinetic energy of the boat. As the square of the speed.

So at 70 kts, your boat has 100 times the energy it has at 7 kts.


Watch the pilot of this powerboat take a look at the sky in his last moments of life:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOeQloe8rJs

and look at the damage to the boat in the last sequence.


No apologies for posting the link; it's life in the optional fast lane. Now imagine a similar loss of control in the Bay area, and tell me whether risk in the recreational area of the Bay is currently under adequate control.
 
I'd prefer it if folk did their speeding outside of the barrage, but I realise that is not always practical. Don't really want to see a speed limit, but maybe if genuinely irresponsible boating were policed better it would solve the problem?

I'm sure if the same boat/skipper were complained against multiple times, it would be possible to 'sin bin' them in some way? Ban them from using the bay apart from crossing to/from the locks for a few months or something?

It does seem amazing to me, on days when the bay seems alive with boats, that there are not more accidents.
 
sarabande said:
It a commonly observed phenomenon that wake magnitude is not necessarily related to speed. What is directly related to speed is the kinetic energy of the boat. As the square of the speed.

So at 70 kts, your boat has 100 times the energy it has at 7 kts.


Watch the pilot of this powerboat take a look at the sky in his last moments of life:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOeQloe8rJs




and look at the damage to the boat in the last sequence.




No apologies for posting the link; it's life in the optional fast lane. Now imagine a similar loss of control in the Bay area, and tell me whether risk in the recreational area of the Bay is currently under adequate control.
Click to expand...

That amazed me..... why did the other race boats still carry on?
 
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