Wansworth
Well-Known Member
How complicated is it to change from an Austrian Flag(in this case) to British Flagging.?
austrian flagged boat
- Thread starter Wansworth
- Start date
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Depends on your own personal situation. If you are UK resident (not necessarily citizen) then you just register on the SSR. All done over the web and £25. However, not available for non-residents. The Part 1 register is more open and does allow non-residents to register. However, there are greater checks on both the boat which needs to be measured and proof of ownership as the register identifies the owner. Go onto the MCA site small ships register and it is all there.
I think from your posts you are a Spanish resident in which case you will need to register it in Spain. If, however you keep the boat in the UK (that is do not visit any foreign countries ) you do not need to register at all. RYA site has all the information on taking a boat abroad.
Don't know the details of Austrian register, but expect it will be the responsibility of the vendor to deal with removal from the register..
Hope this helps.
I think from your posts you are a Spanish resident in which case you will need to register it in Spain. If, however you keep the boat in the UK (that is do not visit any foreign countries ) you do not need to register at all. RYA site has all the information on taking a boat abroad.
Don't know the details of Austrian register, but expect it will be the responsibility of the vendor to deal with removal from the register..
Hope this helps.
andygc
Well-Known Member
How can you have an Austrian flagged ship? There are no Austrian seaports for a ship to sail from.
DownWest
Well-Known Member
Few lakes tho. And National pride.
Bambola has some recently updated stuff on registering in Spain. Seems you need to do it if resident.
German friend reg his previously GB flagged into a an offshore co. in Gib. So retained the British reg. in part 1 as a non resident non national. Extra yearly costs of course. Made sense for him.
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Bambola has some recently updated stuff on registering in Spain. Seems you need to do it if resident.
German friend reg his previously GB flagged into a an offshore co. in Gib. So retained the British reg. in part 1 as a non resident non national. Extra yearly costs of course. Made sense for him.
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BurnitBlue
Well-Known Member
I remember the joke in Brussels during a European summit meeting. The French complained that the Swiss sent a delegate who was Minister of the Swiss Navy. The German delegate replied that if Great Britain could send a Finance Minister the Swiss could send a Navy Minister.
DownWest
Well-Known Member
That is the best thing I've heard all day.
The worst is that the truth hurts.....
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The worst is that the truth hurts.....
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Wansworth
Well-Known Member
Your right,I found a britsh built boat in Portugal,but it has aan Austrian Flag.It occured to me that it would be easier to reg under British flag then register again under the Spanish Flag at a later date but if its basically the same fandango with the papers I wont bother,the best bet is buy a Spanish flagged boat but they seem to think their boats are worth ay least double the uk price....back to the drawing board!
Ubergeekian
Well-Known Member
Who needs a seaport? One of the busiest waterways in the world flows through Vienna, and it carries a huge amount of international traffic.
JasonClark
N/A
PMSL.....Just about true, and yes i was there then too
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Why don't you just register it straight in Spain? You can't have a UK registration easily. My boat was Greek registered and the vendor removed it from the Greek register and i registered in UK. If the boat is a good buy, then even allowing for the hassle - which you will have to do even if you bought a UK boat get it registered in your country of residence.
BrianH
Well-Known Member
As another has commented, the Danube is/was navigable up to and beyond Vienna. The NATO bombardment of Serbia did bring one of the bridges down but no doubt the waterway is again open.
But it is also historical. The Austro-Hungarian empire extended well down into the Adriatic and even now is a sailing ground for many Austrian yachtspeople.
An analogous situation exists with Switzerland, with Basel on the Rhine being the Swiss port of registry.
The Austrian flag serves as something of a 'flag of convenience' for yachts - I too registered my yacht with Austria. Despite being a British expatriate working abroad I was disallowed from British registry because I was not UK resident. Sometimes the law is an ass.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Not when you look at the history of the SSR. Registration in UK is not compulsory for small leisure craft. The only purpose of registration is to provide evidence that the boat is from UK when it travels abroad. The SSR was designed as a low cost way of doing that following pressure from other governments (principally France) so that British boats would have evidence that they did not have to comply with local registration requirements. It therefore makes sense to have residence rather than citizenship as the normal requirement.
BrianH
Well-Known Member
So "it makes sense" for every blue-water cruiser who has sold up their home to fulfill a dream is proscribed from renewing their SSR registration?
Does "it makes sense" for those like myself, a British subject with the right of abode in the UK, who were sent abroad by their company, not to be able to register their boat on the part III registration and have to seek a "flag of convenience" because part I is just not practicable?
I think not. There is a large number of expatriates and liveaboards abroad who commit an offense, and have to ask others to abet them in doing so, by falsifying their SSR application by furnishing a UK address. That ordinary, decent, otherwise law-abiding people should have to do that does not "make sense".
Tranona
Well-Known Member
You are right of course in what you say that some people are "left out". However, the option of Part 1 does exist and the objective of the SSR was a minimum low cost alternative that does not do the same thing as Part 1 (in terms of registering title) but does allow a large number of people to take their boat abroad who would not otherwise be able to, because they could not meet the requirements of Part 1.
Compromise is always thus!
Compromise is always thus!
BrianH
Well-Known Member
So, let me get this clear, "the option of Part 1 does exist" but there are "a large number of people" who can "not meet the requirements of Part 1."
Such as myself. Proving every ownership on an older boat can be well-nigh impossible, not to mention the survey cost - all to obtain a piece of paper in order to satisfy some foreign harbour master.
A further problem can exist in even finding how to register abroad and with whom. I have been told to register under the flag of the country of residence but in many cases only nationals of that country are eligible. Also, all other documentation may have to be complied with, new examinations in the local language, for example.
All it needs is to modify the act to allow genuine British applicants abroad to register under Part III - no big deal. As a British subject cruising abroad with all my British qualifications and documentation, why should I be forced to fly a Ruritanian flag because some minor civil servant couldn't imagine the potential difficulties when the act was being drafted?
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DownWest
Well-Known Member
Barnicle,
The Belgians happily accept registration from anybody, no residency required. My boat is French registered as I reside here. Google ' pavillion belge' and you will find out about it. The french accept Belgian reg for residents (and nationals) here. Also quite a few French nationals use SSR here. Sounds illegal but nobody cares. (cors, if an incident....)
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The Belgians happily accept registration from anybody, no residency required. My boat is French registered as I reside here. Google ' pavillion belge' and you will find out about it. The french accept Belgian reg for residents (and nationals) here. Also quite a few French nationals use SSR here. Sounds illegal but nobody cares. (cors, if an incident....)
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Tranona
Well-Known Member
So, let me get this clear, "the option of Part 1 does exist" but there are "a large number of people" who can "not meet the requirements of Part 1."
Such as myself. Proving every ownership on an older boat can be well-nigh impossible, not to mention the survey cost - all to obtain a piece of paper in order to satisfy some foreign harbour master.
?
Thou doth protest too much. The ownership requirement has been relaxed as you do not now (as I understand it) go back right to build date. The survey cost is not huge - assuming you can find a qualified surveyor locally. I was quoted about £400 to have my survey done in Greece. Small beer compared with the £1000 I had to pay to put it on the Greek charter register when it was new and 1000 Euros to remove it when I stopped chartering.
I did not actually bother with Part 1 as my wife and I own the boat outright and have the Bill of Sale. So went for the SSR for £25 and 5 days to receipt of document. Equally irrational that I should be able to do this when the boat was built in Germany and has spent all its life in Greece!
As I said compromises throw up anomolies. Suggest you lobby RYA and government to get it changed if you feel strongly about it. Otherwise accept that maybe it really does not make any difference to the way you enjoy your boat!
BrianH
Well-Known Member
Really? I just abhor unfair inconsistencies, especially when created by incompetence, which I believe this is.
I am reliably informed that senior management of the MCA agree that an anomaly exists and are sympathetic to those trapped in the situation and have even unofficially recommended them to use a UK address. However, there are those of us who are uncomfortable with making a false declaration and even more uncomfortable in asking others to assist us in doing so.
As a life-long member of the RYA I did so many years ago - and got nowhere. The change needs parliamentary time and no politician wants to be seen as providing succour to a rich and decadent group such as yacht owners
And as a disenfranchised expatriate, I have no recourse to any government representative. Case closed.
BrianH
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the tip. However, if I am hailed by a fellow Austrian-flagged boat I can at least respond in German, even if the distinctive, lilting accent is absent. With a Belgian flag I would be hard-pressed to summon up enough French and even less Dutch/Flemish. At least my wife was born and raised in Vienna but she is rarely aboard. And she lost her Viennese accent long ago.
It is ironic that the Mediterranean is full of ships, especially mega-yachts, flying red ensigns with no one on board speaking English.
Birvidik_Bob
Well-Known Member
I heard that in the 1970's as Idi Amin mocking the Swiss ambassador for having a minister of the Swiss Navy. The reply was "I don't see why not - after all, you have a minister of justice".
