And the Fairy Godmother waved her wand

[Observer]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

Well, the thread's been deleted now Haydn. But I don't see how you can have forgotten the post you made on it. Made me laugh anyway. Hmmm. Short term memory loss. Isn't that an early warning of Alzheimer's?

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[hlb]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

Ah. But I have friends in high places. So all has been revield!!

<hr width=100% size=1> <font color=blue>No one can force me to come here.<font color=red> I'm a volunteer!!.<font color=blue>

Haydn

 

[BarryH]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

All this cloak and dagger crap. Now I know why I stayed away from the forum for awhile. Kim wants a sterile place wrere everybody is too frightened to air their views and a few of the users get out of line with a bit of a prank and all hell breaks loose. Think I'll go back to not looking here. Its amazing what you can get done when your not wasting time on this thing!!

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[pheran]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

And there's nothing more destructive in any organisation/structure, no matter how flimsy (like this forum) than dividing the population into those who are in the know and those who are not. This seems to be a deliberate ploy here. Administration has a lesson to learn!!

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=blue>A hangover is just the Wrath of Grapes</font color=blue>

 

[BarryH]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

Ah but this forum is different. Its got to be percieved as 'respectable' because the advertising pays for it. So the powers that run it will try their damnd'est to keep it looking that way. The only way you can do that is with a bit of heavy cencoring. Other forums that I use are not run by money making organisations, so are a bit more open minded.

Now in the real world the people on here are different from the persona that they project across the boards. Whereas people on other forums are true to their real life personalities. Have a look at the Off Roaders Rant page. A highly successful forum with nil moderation, hardly any T&C's and ends up more or less self policing. Thats run by one guy who started it on an Ezeboard. Very lively and very entertaining.

I'm not saying that this forum doesn't have its place. At times it can be a good source of info and be entertaining. Just saying that every forum will have its own personality. Some are more controlled than others and allow freer speech.

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[BrendanS]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

There have always been greater and lesser amounts of moderation in all the bulletin boards and forums.

The news groups get tedious for their intolerant flaming.

Compuserve was extremely moderated before the internet came along and everyone interesting left (but they did have a wonderful 'section 0' where offending posts would be dumped, along with the ability for the offending posters to carry on in private, much to the amusement of the moderators who could also read section 0 posts)

Some small forums and groups become self policing. However, it's the smaller groups that typically self police in this way. Kim does a pretty good job of handling a whole spectrum of posters, some of which would post jokes all the time, and others who think every post should be factual and joking should be banned.


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[BarryH]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

I can see what your getting at. Not all of the self policing ones are smaller forums/boards. One of the others I use has a larger registered membership than this. Its self policing on the whole. I think that the Mods had tp step in in one instance.

As far as the jokes go. They have their place in any 'gathering'. You need the lighter side of life or you'll lose half the membership. Its the same old story. You can't please all the people all of the time.

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[whisper]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

Hear, Hear !! Though I haven't seen much in the jokey line recently. This place has only gone awry of late when the demeaning "forum rage"of a few has been directed at one person in particular - "Life's too Short "
Otherwise the forums are both interesting and entertaining, thanks to IPC and Sir Kim in particular - grovel,creep,creep[smile,laugh,frown]whoops!

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[BrendanS]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

Agree, it's not only the smaller ones that self police - that's why I put in the typically disclaimer. What these particular forums have are a huge cross section - not all tolerant of each other.

I suspect that free of the requirements of IPC's public image, you could take the moderation away, and after a slaughter or two, the forums would be self moderating to an extent, but would never be completely moderation free. Too much danger of newsgroup type flaming here, because of the mix. It does happen though..look how often Kim goes away, and rarely has to intervene. It's when things brew up that someone has to step in.

I run several groups myself, and have been moderator on even more in the past. Some are hassle free, others give me sleepless nights. It's more about the individuals posting and the mix than anything else.

As for jokes, great, I love them, but not everyone is going to agree with that, and to be honest, I'm on an email ring, which means that most that I see here, I first saw 10 years ago. I love to read the original humour of the likes of tcm and Jimi far more (as I'm incapable of thinking of a suitably humorous rebuttal until at least 72 hours later than is appropriate), but then again I sometimes cannot resist posting something that to me is a hoot!

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[hlb]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

Barry. I know I said. Friends in high places. But I only meant messages from us lot. Not from the Kmottala or such places. Please keep your underpants on!!

<hr width=100% size=1> <font color=blue>No one can force me to come here.<font color=red> I'm a volunteer!!.<font color=blue>

Haydn

 

[BarryH]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

Wasn't having a go at you personally, just a general observation. Theres be a definate downward turn in the qwality of the forums of late. A lot of people who used to come here don't. I've not looked at them as much as I used to as the 'atmmosphere' is more akin to a rough pub in the eastend.

Anyhow, I don't wear pants.....they is boxers.

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[tripleace]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

I agree with you re rough pub.

I want to go into the saloon not the public bar

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boating-ads.co.uk> Boating Website</A>

 

[byron]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>

Some are more controlled than others and allow freer speech.

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I rarely take issue with you Baz but here I do. This forum is well run and very tolerant. A certain amount of Policing is required otherwise IPC and even Posters would be open to legal action. As a Journalist Kim knows just what can and cannot be put in print. As regards fake Posters, I have no time for them. My company too has a Forum, at least once a week we have to delete something yet my lot are a hard drinking, smoking, racist, sexist bums by their own admission.


<hr width=100% size=1>http://www.alexander-advertising.co.uk

 

[kimhollamby]

Oh come on

Not fair. That's not the way it's done.

Yes, I don't see much point in people publicly ripping lumps out of each other every five minutes in terms of personal attacks and I think I represent the views of the vast majority in that. If you want that kind of entertainment on the web then go off to one of the many sites out there that specialise in exchanges of the kind that no-one would dare utter face-to-face.

I also don't like dual IDs because, being blunt, it encourages nutters to post, rocks the boat in lots of other ways and puts newcomers off.

But that's as far as it goes.

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[kimhollamby]

Conspiracy theories again

Okay, so what is it you think we are doing wrong.

For the record there is no favouritism shown to anyone here. Period.

If you think otherwise then put your cards on the table and lets clear this thing up, once and for all.

I would hope that you don't in fact think I am running this forum in favour of anyone individual or group.
<hr width=100% size=1><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by kimhollamby on 10/09/2003 15:32 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[kimhollamby]

Out of interest, some facts

I see that I have just over 2200 posts logged since we started the registration versions of these forums (over two years ago now) and many of those are answering boat or website questions.

Very few of them are interventions.

We have a total of about 500 threads in the sin bin but the reality is that many of them are inappropriately posted ads, or threads dumped at the request of original posters. And only say a half-dozen to a dozen or so each year due to legal threats or worries (although those are small pebbles that often throw out big ripples each time we remove!).

We average less than one thread banned per week for one legal or abuse reason or another across all forums, which, given that we see in excess of 11,000 posts per month now and have nearly 9,000 registered users (and growing), is a credit to the majority here, for which I say a sincere thank you.

With respect, IPC or no, I doubt we would better those stats for this size of bulletin board community, at least one that carries proper Ts and Cs and doesn't want to move Internet host every six months.

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[hlb]

Re: \'Wrong End Of The Stick\'

I see no problem here Barry. except one. /forums/images/icons/frown.gif

<hr width=100% size=1> <font color=blue>No one can force me to come here.<font color=red> I'm a volunteer!!.<font color=blue>

Haydn

 

[Guest]

Re: Fair cop

Interesting stats. IMHO, the individual who got binned yesterday got binned for dual posting with a second ID designed to provoke one individual. You can argue the rights and wrongs of banning for dual posting as a general principal till the cows come home, but I suspect that the individual's actions represented a fairly widely held frustration about the way the forum has been developing over the last few months.

Unfortunately, everyone is forced to be somewhat circumspect in talking about this, as an open and frank expression of frustration is likely to get the user banned, as is a similar exchange with the individual involved.

So, how the hell do we move this forward? Temporary banning didn't work, words from Kim didn't work, meeting up and trying to make relationships face to face only works at the time, sarcasm didn't work, barbed humour didn't work. What's left?

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[kimhollamby]

What\'s left?

You leave it to me. Not for any other reason than because it is the way it needs to work.

As for the rest, well the dual ID incident is also already dealt with. I had a site going live yesterday and a magazine going to press with tough deadlines on both and needed that thread like a hole in the head. So I dumped the thread, froze the IP address and banned the dual (but not the original) ID. The IP ban was lifted last night, once I could turn my attentions back here.

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[Guest]

Re: What\'s left?

Well, actually Kim, there are two choices - we leave it to you, or we leave. I'm not criticising here, because I suspect that you're damned if you do and damned if you don't, but the atmosphere here has certainly changed this year.

I spose in time, some will stay and some will go. I've met too many people here (and subsequently in person) to think about leaving right now, and I suspect most of the inmates feel the same way, but sooner of later people will run out of patience.

Don't envy your job...

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