Anchor chain jumps out the gypsy, under load.

N

NealB

Well-Known Member
Joined
19 Feb 2006
Messages
7,674
Location
Burnham on Crouch
Visit site
On our 'new' boat, the anchor chain has a nasty, dangerous, and effort wasting, habit of jumping off the gypsy of the manual windlass, when it comes under a heavyish load.

How do I check that the chain and gypsy are compatible?

(Though I have a feeling the answer might well be, "if the chain jumps off the gypsy, when under load, then they are not compatible").

Thanks for any guidance.
 
As you suspect, maybe the wrong calibration. On 8mm there's no problem but there's 2mm difference between ISO and DIN on 10mm. Easiest way to check is to remove the gypsy and put a full wrap of chain around, you'll see if it gets out of step. On a quarter turn, as is the norm when in use, it normally looks OK - I've been there!
 
The gypsy should be embossed, somewhere, with its size. You will need to take it off and have a look. The marks maybe on the face plates, or underneath. Chinese chain is seldom marked, with anything. All other chain, call it Western was marked with its grade and sometimes manufacturer (the latter might be in a code - a simple letter). If its of American origin it will almost definitely be imperially sized and their BBB, G30, G43 and G70 are all different. Metric chain, G30, G40 and G70 are all the same sized links (so all 8mm is the same - the exception is 10mm, see above).

Wire size, the diameter of the wire from which the chain is made are nominal sizes so 8mm might actually be an imperial 5/16th". I think the Rocna website, or Peter Smith has imperial links sizes and Vyv has metric sizes. Imperial links tend to be bigger than metric links - and are obviously different.

I would have thought it unlikely as you are in Essex you have an imperial chain, but it is possible. The simple wrap test, see above, should immediately indicate if its imperial rather than metric or Vice Versa (imperial will be too long for the pockets)

Is there any chance the chain has been stretched? it would be unusual - but if its old, possible.

If the windlass or chain are very old - I'm too young to know what happened in an earlier life :)

Jonathan
 
Last edited:
Had that problem and nasty it is too, the snatch loads on the deck when the chain jumps in the sprocket is tremendous. The problem was a mismatch of chain/gypsy. I had little choice but change the chain; an expensive solution but solved the problem. If you do have to change chain then consider using a smaller chain size but higher spec chain to increase rode length and/or reduce weight in the bow. But that’s another story.
 
Is the chain old and or worn. Inspection of the inside of the links is a good test for wear. Some chain has a short life. Here is Italian 10mm by 28 mm chain that was badly worn at 18 months So worn that it jumped the gypsy almost continuously

1-CCB WORN CHAIN 012.JPG.

The chain no longer matches the gypsy.
 
It could just that the the gypsy has worn, that was the case when I got my new (to me) boat, There was not a lot of wear on the teeth but just enough to cause the chain to jump under heavy load. Replaced it and has been fine since
 
I, for one, am interested in how the problem is resolved.

Replacing the chain with a smaller stronger chain will save you weight and/or space - but means buying new chain, obviously, and a new gypsy. New gypsies are not cheap. If you buy a new gypsy it then raises the question - is the old windlass worth it - should I buy a new gypsy/windlass?

And then what was a technical problem becomes an increasingly large financial issue.

There is little point in increasing chain grade from G30 to G40, G30 has been shown to be totally reliable and the increased strength of G40 really does not allow you to downsize. The only option is Peerless metric G70, available from stock in Europe, as last information was that Maggi had been placed in administration and their reputation for galvanising quality has raised questions. Maggi is the only known Italian chain maker (but there may be others) and issues other than galvanising might exist, see TQA above and earlier, in another thread, someone suggested response to queries about quality were largely ignored. If you went the G70 route is would allow you to down size from, say 10mm to 8mm.

Jonathan
 
Last edited:
TQA said:
Is the chain old and or worn. Inspection of the inside of the links is a good test for wear. Some chain has a short life. Here is Italian 10mm by 28 mm chain that was badly worn at 18 months So worn that it jumped the gypsy almost continuously

View attachment 70748.

The chain no longer matches the gypsy.
Click to expand...

That looks a LOT more like wrong size than wear. To have that much wear, it would be very thin between the links, which it is not. You need to get short pieces of several sizes and figure out which fits. I suppose it "just" worked when new.
 
Just take the gypsy off, take it to your decent nearest chandler (one with a stock of appropriate chains) and try it - not need to buy short lengths. You are going to take it off anyway - to check its size markings.

Jonathan
 
Thanks again for the knowledgeable replies.

As Neeves said, "I, for one, am interested in how the problem is resolved".

I'll let you know when I'm sure I've reached that nirvana.
 
thinwater said:
That looks a LOT more like wrong size than wear. To have that much wear, it would be very thin between the links, which it is not. You need to get short pieces of several sizes and figure out which fits. I suppose it "just" worked when new.
Click to expand...

Nope it was wear. The chain fitted the gypsy perfectly when new. I took the gypsy in to the chandler when I purchased the chain. The top end of the chain that never got used still fitted perfectly. I have another pic showing the two side by side. The worn was about 10 mm longer in 250mm. A visual inspection revealed significant thinning of the links where they touched.

I was not the only one who purchased this make of chain from the same chandler to experience rapid wear.
 
Last edited:
I took the gypsy off this morning.

I couldn't see any markings at all to show size (nor could my Mrs, who has incredibly short sight).

I tried the 'wrap round' test, and the links look, to my eye, to sit very cosily in the gypsy.

Hmmmmmm ... I sat on the foredeck for a few minutes, just looking.

Then it hit me (I'm sure it would have been blindingly obvious to many here) .....

The windlass is set at the bottom of the anchor well. The chain comes off the top of the gypsy, at an angle of about 25% (at a very rough guess), UP to the anchor.

This means that the chain is only being held in the gypsy by one link at a time (is there a technical word for the indentations in the gypsy?).

There is room to raise the windlass by about 12 cm, and still be able to close the anchor well lid.

Would mounting the windlass on a 12 cm teak block, with longer through deck bolts, be a viable solution?

Thanks!
 
Indentation in the gypsy - the term I see is - Pocket

Rather than move the windlass - is there room for another sheave/bow roller so that you can alter the direction of the feed. It might be easier than moving the windlass.

You need a new, another, roller and 2 flanges to allow it to be bolted appropriately. It does not need to be sophisticated, just strong enough. Having such devices is quite common, I see them a lot in catamarans.

I'm 'guessing' - I don't know enough about your installation.

Jonathan
 
Neeves said:
Indentation in the gypsy - the term I see is - Pocket

Rather than move the windlass - is there room for another sheave/bow roller so that you can alter the direction of the feed. It might be easier than moving the windlass.

You need a new, another, roller and 2 flanges to allow it to be bolted appropriately. It does not need to be sophisticated, just strong enough. Having such devices is quite common, I see them a lot in catamarans.

I'm 'guessing' - I don't know enough about your installation.

Jonathan
Click to expand...

I'll make sure I throw 'pocket' into my very next conversation about gypsies.

I removed the windlass with rather alarming ease, yesterday.

I always take the load off the windlass once anchored, but I shudder to think of the loads it was taking as I hauled up in a big swell that was rolling into Derrible Bay on Sark, last year. That was one of the occasions when the chain kept jumping out.

Anyway, fitting a plinth under it should be fairly quick, easy and cheap (yes, I know, I might regret those words).

Your 'diverter' suggestion certainly makes sense, but is likely to be a bit more complicated in this particular case.

I really do appreciate your replies: thanks again.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Other threads that may be of interest

Y
Quick Aries 1000 anchor windless noisy
Replies
0
Views
101
yotter
Y

Share this page

Top