America's Cup - bringing sailing into disrepute?

[Thistle]

I'm getting a bit fed up of the current America's Cup wrangling. It's too reminiscent of a pair of rich, spoilt brats who are determined not to agree on anything and who go crying to mummy when they can't get their own way.

It's this kind of thing, rather than the kind of sailing the majority of us on here do, that seems to reach the national press. It gives the public a very poor impression of sailing and sailors and, to my mind, brings the sport into disrepute.

If they can't get on and sail in a sportsman-like way, why don't they go back to what they seem to be good at (making millions, apparently!) and let real sailors have a go?

Anyone else feel this way?

 

[jamesjermain]

Here! Here!

This is what happens when the lunatics take over the asylum. Perhaps what we need now is the establishment of a controling body independent of the competitors/owners that everyone can accept as custodian of the rules and arbiter of disputes and with enough clout to bang heads together.

 

[bbg]

Yes, to a degree. But I also think the first 10 minutes of the first race in February are going to be spectacular. Actually, the whole match will be gripping, because it is possible that a 5-knot difference in wind speed could make a huge difference to the boats. It could put one boat into her optimum range and drop the other out of it.

And there is always the chance that either of the boats could break, even up to the finish line. Imagine one boat with a clear speed advantage, up 1-0 on the final leg towards victory in race 2 (best of 3) and pop goes something vital.

I'll try to catch the racing somehow.

 

[bbg]

Perhaps what we need now is the establishment of a controling body independent of the competitors/owners that everyone can accept as custodian of the rules and arbiter of disputes and with enough clout to bang heads together.

Sorry James, but as you may know that is legally impossible. The cup holder is always bound by the Deed of Gift. There has been a convention for challengers and defenders to reach an agreement to depart from the DoG, but if they can't reach an agreement the DoG applies. And the DoG cannot be changed.

Even if "everyone" accepts an independent controlling body, all it takes is for someone outside the "everyone" to issue a valid challenge according to the original DoG, and it all goes back to the courts.

 

[jamesjermain]

Yes. I agree with you too, bbg. The racing is always fascinating - I was glued to every minute of the last one and no doubt will be to this one. It's the childish, if hugely expensive, wrangling that goes on in between that leaves me cold.

 

[Ubergeekian]

Yes. I agree with you too, bbg. The racing is always fascinating - I was glued to every minute of the last one and no doubt will be to this one. It's the childish, if hugely expensive, wrangling that goes on in between that leaves me cold.

As an avowed cruising sailor, though, it seems to me to be wholly within the spirit of racing. The only difference seems to be that the America's Cup people do their protracted legal wrangling before the race, whereas most racers do their protracted protests afterwards.

 

[flaming]

The wrangling has been extreme, and extremely distasteful.

The racing will be amazing. And to me it will all be worth it IF they let the boats out to play after the cup is over. Imagine the good PR the winning team could get if they embarked on a world tour with their boat, taking in the RTI and all the other very large races of that type.

But they won't.

 

[dylanwinter]

more interesting

I had hoped that change of boats would improve things

and I have been racing more years than I have been cruising so I love watching yacht races

but the pre-race rubbish is just as silly as it ever was

and I agree, in the minds of some members of the public it demeans us all

Dylan

 

[Oceanis]

I'm getting a bit fed up of the current America's Cup wrangling. It's too reminiscent of a pair of rich, spoilt brats who are determined not to agree on anything and who go crying to mummy when they can't get their own way.

It's this kind of thing, rather than the kind of sailing the majority of us on here do, that seems to reach the national press. It gives the public a very poor impression of sailing and sailors and, to my mind, brings the sport into disrepute.

If they can't get on and sail in a sportsman-like way, why don't they go back to what they seem to be good at (making millions, apparently!) and let real sailors have a go?

Anyone else feel this way?

IMHO this is what happens when money becomes the biggest driver.....both the spending and the earning thereof. It has spoilt many other sporting events and it is spoiling the AC but I am still looking forward to the racing.

 

[michael_w]

I don't care about the legal stuff. That wing rig is something else....

 

[Alfie168]

The Americas cup has always been dogged by dirty doings on and off the water which demean it really. A lot of us watch F1, but I sometimes wonder why as the local club racing is closer and more fun. Ditto with boats

I think we are all taken in by the money and the hype and to some extent by the technology. Most of them need a good slap.

It should be sailed in Optimists with mumsy and dadsy shouting abuse from the touchline. The tactics are just the same.

Tim

 

[jamesjermain]

The wrangling has been extreme, and extremely distasteful.

The racing will be amazing. And to me it will all be worth it IF they let the boats out to play after the cup is over. Imagine the good PR the winning team could get if they embarked on a world tour with their boat, taking in the RTI and all the other very large races of that type.

But they won't.

Agreed. Trouble is they sound as fragile as the last lot; racing will be cancelled - even on long offshore race - if wind speed excedes 15 knots and wave height 1m. So an entry in the RTI is likely to be withdrawn as would be a Fastnet entry.

Demo races around the world would be good though.

 

[lyc]

I never thought I would see the day that the two boats were out on the same bit of water in Valencia!!

HERE

Maybe they will race on the water and not in the court rooms after all?

 

[flaming]

Agreed. Trouble is they sound as fragile as the last lot; racing will be cancelled - even on long offshore race - if wind speed excedes 15 knots and wave height 1m. So an entry in the RTI is likely to be withdrawn as would be a Fastnet entry.

Demo races around the world would be good though.

Well that's the limit put on the racing by Alinghi, as below those limits they believe their boat to be the faster. It's likely that the boats could actually handle a bit more breeze, especially the American boat in softsail configuration.
A fastnet would be out of the question, but a RTI ought to be within their capabilities, and you'd have to bet on a record if they got decent conditions.

 

[BlueChip]

I'm betting this all this legal stuff is just posturing to get a psychological advantage and we will see them on the water next month. I hope so, because my ticket is booked to Valencia.
The last AC at Valencia was a superb spectacle and I'm guessing this one will be as well.
Anyone else planning to go out for the races?

 

[st599]

Agreed. Trouble is they sound as fragile as the last lot; racing will be cancelled - even on long offshore race - if wind speed excedes 15 knots and wave height 1m. So an entry in the RTI is likely to be withdrawn as would be a Fastnet entry.

Demo races around the world would be good though.

That 15 knot at 60m above sea level rule is only in there because the defender has built a boat that's s*** above that figure. Russell Coutts has requested redress from the International Jury on this one (as he points out, Optimist's race in a bigger breeze)

Anyone know if it'll be on telly?

 

[bbg]

Anyone know if it'll be on telly?

According to this site there is no TV contract in place now, and not even any guarantee it will be carried live on the internet.

I find the latter hard to believe. After all the money these two teams have spent, it shouldn't be beyond their means to stream their own video to the internet, if they wanted to.

The legal wrangling is so distasteful, but the consequence is that the two most technologically advanced yachts ever built will face off head-to-head. I can't wait.

 

[Seah0rse]

Legal Wrangling

Thing is, it's not about sailing, it's ego.

 

[duncan_m]

My boat is bigger than yours...

Saw this thread and it (along with boredom) spurred me this morning to find out which spoilt brat had the best boat.

Not sure if all the details are exactly perfect but should be close enough...

 

[Perry]

The Americas cup has always been dogged by dirty doings on and off the water which demean it really. A lot of us watch F1, but I sometimes wonder why as the local club racing is closer and more fun. Ditto with boats

I think we are all taken in by the money and the hype and to some extent by the technology. Most of them need a good slap.

It should be sailed in Optimists with mumsy and dadsy shouting abuse from the touchline. The tactics are just the same.

Tim

Quite a disgrace to the sport they way they have been behaving and I bet that Valencia
are getting a bit fed up with them tying up their port as they must be loosing out on revenue with all the uncertainty of when, if and how they are going to race.

On the other hand technically these boars are superb bits of kit, if you have seen the vid of the American boat going up wind at 29 knots in only 8 knots of wind they are quite mind blowing, imagine them crossing tacks at that speed, I hope they all have brown trousers on.

I am going to the F1 test at Valencia next week so will be staying an extra day so I can go down to the race village to see the boats in their flesh, hopefully the races will be shown online and I really hope that Alinghi win 2.0