Advices on new boatsez

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mikec

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Hey all, hello from the Land of Oz.

There seems to be a wealth of knowledge and experience here so I thought I'd jump on, say hi, and ask a few questions.

After a few years break I'm getting a boat again! However I am taking a step up (or three) and am looking at cruisers around 28'.
Shortlisted are Bayliner Ciera 2655/2855, Sea Ray Sundancer 270/275, and Mustang 2800 (Mustang are an Aussie company).
Boats in Australia cost a little bit more than a fast luxury car and a little bit less than a space shuttle. Hence, I am looking at boats up to 12 years of age.

So, might I ask some questions of the brains trust?

My questions mainly relate to engines. Boats I've looked at in my price range are below:
  • 1998-2002 Bayliner 2855. 7.4L Mercruiser MPI with Bravo II/II leg. 320hp
  • 2000-2002 Bayliner 2655, 5.0 or 5.7L Mercruiser MPI, around 200-220hp?.
  • 1998-2000 Sea Ray Sundancer 270, Mercruiser 7.4L MPI (320hp) with Bravo III OR 2x4.3L EFI (2x210hp) with Alpha.
  • 2002-2005 Mustang 2800, 5.0 or 5.7L Volvo Penta.

Questions:
  • I can get a newer Mustang than a Bayliner/Sea Ray for the same price. But is the engine under powered for a 28' boat? They claim 270hp...
  • The twin 4.3's on the Sea Ray is surely going to have the most power, but obviously chews up more fuel too. Is it overkill?
  • Assuming proper maintenance, am I going to have issues with 10 year old engines? I'm no mechanic so I don't want to be stuck out there drifting. Part of me says get the twin so you have a spare. But this is a rarity in this type of boat - the only one I've seen does need a bit of work (service, anti-foul, clean etc).
  • If an engine like those above gives up, can they be rebuilt?
  • If I have twin engines, and one dies, do I need to replace/rebuild both?
  • How does Volvo compare with Mercruiser in general?
  • How many questions is too many?
  • Is this too many?
  • How about now?

Cheers,

Mike.
 
Let me try to give my humble thoughts before the full army arrives ;-)

The boats you mention are all very common small cruisers,
The Say Ray’s have a reputation being stronger and better build then Bayliners
but Bayliner are very good boats for the price.
Mustang, never heard anything wrong with them, only positive comments, (apart from the state of the company, but that’s not important for such type of second hand boats)
Choice depends also what you want to do,
f.e Occasional trips along the beach, or long trips far in open sea. How much you want to use her,
then I am not sure about fuel availability and prices down under, but here in euroland, diesel engines are more popular in 28ft+ boats
So petrol engine boats are cheaper, but harder to resale. (again, I don’t know in your region)

the twin 4.3 EFI, I would certainly consider. The 4.3 is a good engine and fuel consumption is OK, (own experience) at least a lot better (economicallly) then an twin 8 cylinder. But I prefer diesel.
Nothing wrong with a single engine boat, but I prefer a twin, just for the extra fun driving and manouvring the boat, and yes a little bit for safety reason.
Yes you will have issues with a ten year old engine, at least with the sterndrive, so regular and good maintenance is mandatory (and a good survey when buying)
The 4.3 usually have Raw water cooling, (at least here) no heat exchanger. These engines then need new exhaust risers every 5 to.. years,
and they might have more internal corrosion.
I prefer a over powered boat instead of under powered, very boaring when the boat goes slowly on the plane or not, Nice to have a little bit extra headroom of power when you want it.
Mercruiser and Volvo spare parts availability is very good.
Not that much difference in quality between Volvo and Merc petrol engines (are based on the same GM baseblock). Quality differences are mainly in the drive, opinions on this are different, but the most important thing is that maintenance on the drive has always’s been OK.
The type of engines you mention can easily be rebuild, second hand engines and parts are generally available, many different sources. Merc is more common then Volvo .
Here you can asc as many questions as you like, but don’t be overwhelmed by the wave of answers you might get, sometimes contradictory, but you’re allowed to make your own mind ;-)
A acknowledged and friendly forummate (AndyMac) from down there will be along soon
Welcome to the forum,
 
Firstly, welcome.

Secondly, don't expect your first boat to answer all your needs.

My experience was

22 ft Sea Ray Cuddy, 4 months
25ft Sunbird Cruiser, 2 years
33 ft Sunline Cruiser, feels about right for us.

I don't believe this is a unique history (although I'm sure there will be others on here who have owned 1 boat from new for 10,000 years. Come to think of it, I haven't heard from Noah for a while.................)

So my coaching is to buy a boat that will be easy to sell on, as you might want to do this.

In which case buy the best condidion boat, for the smallest ammount of money. You might even make a couple of $$ in the process.

You will enjoy any on your list, as long as they are reliable. I don't think you will have any problems with spares, but you might be able to source local parts for the GM based V6 or V8, as Holden probably built them at some time.
 
Mike

You will probably find the 2800 Mustang will not be as big a boat as the Bayliner nad the Sea Ray.
This is a quote from Bill Barry-Cotter, the Maritimo director who recently brought the Mustang brand and moulds........"The 28 footer that we brought from the Mustang sale was actually 26 feet long which included the swim platform, so it was really a 24 foot boat"....

They are also narrower than the US 28' options, so a small block V8 will power her ok.

Find yourself a reliable and trustworthy mechanic, and keep up the maintenance.

With our dollar on parity (or close) with US, there is going to be a fair swag of US selections on our doorstep very soon, a great time to be shopping!

Good luck and happy hunting..:)
 
Well i spent the weekend looking at boats.
As AndieMac says, the Mustang 2800 is much smaller than the other 27-28 footers.
So it is down to the Sea Ray or the Bayliner. The Sea Rays are definitely well built and they have a reputation for being of a slightly better quality finish than the Bayliner. But so far, the Bayliner is the favourite.
Mainly because the Bayliner 2855 is just that little but bigger than the Sea Ray 270 - about 20cm extra in the beam, but it really makes a difference to the layout down below. Also, the Bayliner has more, and bigger, windows, and this results in a more open feeling in the cabin. I took my girlfriend with me and she felt "less claustrophobic" in the Bayliner than the others. It has a dual burner stove whereas the others only have a single. The aft cabin actually has a proper door and closet space The dinette is bigger. All these little things add up, and we think we'll be a lot more comfortable in the Bayliner. Having the girlfriend's tick of approval is somewhat important, even if it really is a boy's toy!

The dealers weren't able to take me for a test run on the weekend due to being extremely busy, so I will be going out during the week to trial both the Sea Ray and the Bayliner.
The Sea Ray has the Mercruiser 7.4L MPI engine.
The best Bayliner I've seen has a Mercruiser 7.4L Horizon engine, which is not the standard engine. The dealer says it produces 385hp (the std 7.4L MPI produces 320). Does anyone know about this engine? I can't find much info on it, it doesn't seem to be very common. It isn't the MAG version. I have attached a pic below. When I go out this week I'll get the serial number and some more details.

74lhorizon.jpg
 
Mike

To get the big block from 320 HP to 380 HP, I assume they either bore or stroke the 7.4 litre to 8.2 litre.
Afaik, Horizon is the fresh water cooling protected reference, which is now referred to as Sea-Core, although the latter more seriously modified against corrosion.
 
Last edited:
Interesting...
Maybe he is wrong. He said he looked up the specs on the 7.4L Horizon and came up with 385hp... maybe it is the standard 7.4L with the water cooling option.
In my Google searching I did find references to 7.4L Horizons with 380hp (e.g. on other boats for sale), but they are few and far between.
I'm going out tomorrow for a closer look, and will get as much as I can from the service logs. I'll get the serial number too, which should translate into a model number.
 
Hmm, I remember typing a great long post the other day about my sea trials and my pick of the two boats I'd short-listed. But it has not gone up - I'm a know-it-all IT type guy so it can't have been my fault it didn't get posted...

Anyhoo! So I settled on the Bayliner 2855. The one I looked at was in better condition and generally a better boat overall. It seemed to handle better too, it just seemed more planted on the water and was easier to come about in at speed. In the Sea Ray it seemed like I was often reaching for the trim tabs, where the bayliner just sat there happily.
The Bayliner has had everything done recently that is required if a boat this age, so it really is "ready to go".
So I made an offer and they accepted it. Survey this Wednesday. All going well I'll be on my new toy by the coming weekend!
 
There are berths available in front of my apartment at Balmain, hopefully I can negotiate a good price on one of those. I reckon the convenience of having it right there at my doorstep will ensure that I get lots of use out of it!
 
Isn't Scotland Island in that neck of the woods?
There is a legend of a 3 legged pot buried there full of dollars!
Oh yeh, they reckon Pittwater is where Mc Cullam got the idea of 'Skippy' from!!!
 
Kawasaki said:
Isn't Scotland Island in that neck of the woods?
There is a legend of a 3 legged pot buried there full of dollars!
Oh yeh, they reckon Pittwater is where Mc Cullam got the idea of 'Skippy' from!!!
Click to expand...

It is Kwacka, Scotland Island is right up where all the boats moor.
Standing on the shore at Church Point looking across the water, all you see is a mass of masts....raggie heaven! :eek:

Skippy was based at Ku Ring Gai Chase national park, just to the west of Pittwater. It's pretty much the countries second busiest recreational boating area, next to the Gold Coast (Queensland).
 
Survey and mechanical check complete, passed with flying colours.
So by this weekend I should be the proud new owner!

No berths in front of my house available right now, I'll have to settle for across the way at Birkenhead Point (2 minutes drive across Iron Cove bridge).

Overall I'm very happy with my purchase. Summer and good times ahead!
 
mikec said:
Yep - looking forward to doing just that!
The Hawkesbury is a great place to get lost a couple of days...
Click to expand...

Say hi to Cottage Point and Coal and Candle Creek.

I've spent hours exploring and fishing the area.

Unfortunately my brother has quit his Neutral Bay apartment and has sold his boat, deciding that he is happier on his property nestled amongst our relatives around Gulgong.

Good luck with your boat and and enjoy those fantastic days on the harbour.
 
Kawasaki said:
Isn't Scotland Island in that neck of the woods?
There is a legend of a 3 legged pot buried there full of dollars!
Oh yeh, they reckon Pittwater is where Mc Cullam got the idea of 'Skippy' from!!!
Click to expand...

He can sail his boat through the heads and around Barrenjoey and into Pittwater, copping a look at the Home and Away cast as they ham it up on Palm Beach. :(

When I first went to OZ in the early 80's Scotland Island and the Church Point area was a lovely quiet backwater. It is a bit too busy now.

The Hawksbury isn't exactly quiet these days but there are plenty of places to hide away.
 
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