Advice on stern-to mooring combined with mooring buoy please.

Ship's Cat 73

Ship's Cat 73

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I hope I'm posting this in the correct section.
We've done several flotilla/bareboat charters in Greek waters in the past. This year we're heading to Croatia (west coast of Istria). While it has been standard practice to berth bows-to or stern-to and employing either anchor or lazy line, there is one place (at least) in Croatia which requires stern-to berthing combined with attaching the bow to a mooring buoy. See the photo below. There are 10 buoys laid around 30 metres from the quay and in a line parallel to the quayside
Valdibora bay Rovinj 3.jpg
The buoys are only about 6 or 7 metres from each other so there is no room for a yacht to swing . . . and yes, I do know that they are not meant to be used as swinging moorings. What concerns me is that by the time we can stop and attach a line to a buoy, any wind may have started to swing the yacht before we can regain control to go astern to the quayside in order to get the stern lines attached. As I've never encountered this kind of arrangement before I'm hoping for some helpful suggestions as to how to get the job done with the least amount of embarrassment!
I have one idea but won't know how practical it is until the manoeuvre is attempted for real - - - and that is to reverse towards the quay, initially ignoring the buoy(s), attaching the stern lines, motoring ahead at low revs against the stern lines while someone takes a long enough line (attached at one end to a bow cleat) out in the dinghy and attaches it to the buoy.
But at the moment that is only the theory in my head - - - any helpful suggestions or advice will be very welcome.
(The location is at Rovinj where, at present, there are no marina facilities -- new marina won't be open until summer 2019.)

Valdibora bay Rovinj 2.jpg
 
Thread a line thru the eye of the buoy when passing it.
Keep one end made fast to a bowcleat, and then just let the line run out. If needed you can use the line to slow down your approach to the quay.
Make sure the line is more than twice the length of the distance between the buoy and where the bow will end up when you are made fast.

Or use a buoy hook (if there is one on board). Example:
https://www.hjertmans.se/image?path=Articles/5886-80/5886-80.jpg
 
We moor to a buoy quite often in the Baltic, though the usual routine is bows-to, but not exclusively. Most Baltic sailors carry a 'Swedish Hook', which makes the job much easier. The hook is just an extended shepherd's crook, and has the advantage that you only need one length of line. There is an alternative version with a smaller hook but with a closure operated at the handle. This might be preferred if you are worried about the hook coming off, though this is not a problem if tension is kept on the line. You could rig up an alternative with a carbine hook, but this would be harder to fix or release. I would do anything to avoid having doubled lines, especially at the length of your second photo.
 
There are a number of devices for passing a line through the ring on the buoy. I have a Moorfast. As suggested you need a person at the bow (or just aft of the bow) to pas the line through the ring as you are reversing - positioning the boat to windward of the buoy.
 
I'd follow the other advice to approach carefully and pass a line through before proceeding - I find it easier to go past in reverse very slowly and swing the stern away so the bow goes towards the bouy just forward of the keel and be ready not quite at the bows but lying on the side deck ready to pass the line through. Can be a bit hit and miss but the advantage is that it's easy to power forward and try again - the only thing I find causes problems is when people are too embarassed to try again as often as it takes to get it right.

But if that is Rovinj - that's a place I wouldn't go to again as last year they cleared out all boats on their mooring buoys in the bay and the ones on the little quay at 5pm saying there was a bura coming down (the forecast and actuality was a southerly which all the cleared moorings were well protected from. So there were boats including ours in darkness phoning marinas after being turfed off the moorings. Beautiful town (we hired a car the next day and drove back to stay in a hotel) but awful port management.
 
Are you sure that you're going to run a line to the buoy? I've often seen buoys used as markers like your picture but they are supporting the end of the lazy line: you use a boat hook to pick up the lazy line as you go past the buoy rather than collecting the lazy line from the quay and walking it forward to the bow.
If that's not the case and you're meant to take a line to the buoy, I'd go with you suggested method as being least likely to cause a foul up. Might be worth having a line and crew person in the dinghy as you come in, drop the dinghy as you line up for the buoy and by the time you've got lines ashore you buoy line will have arrived at the bow. The chances of being able to get a line on the buoy as you go past aren't good even with some of the kit mentioned above.
 
Stand off, or temporarily pick up a mooring then send someone in the dinghy to investigate. It is more likely to be as Duncan99210 says; that the buoys are supporting lazy lines, the normal method of berthing in Croatia. If this is the case, I would reverse up to the buoy ( while moving in the direction of the quay), picking up the line from the cockpit and carrying it forward as the boat reverses.
 
Your first assessment of the buoys seems to be correct according to the info on the website linked below:
http://www.cruiserswiki.org/wiki/Rovinj
What I would do would be to have a line prepared on the bow cleat and brought outside everything to the stern. I would then reverse up to the buoy, with a crew on the sugarscoop ready to take the line through the ring on the buoy. This would then be tied to it in a bowline loop large enough to reach the deck. A crew on the bow would then take up the slack and keep tension on the line as the boat is reversed towards the quay. The bowline would be perfectly secure as it will be under load when in use and would obviate the need for a doubled line. Upon departure the reverse of this procedure would keep the bow under control until clear of neighbouring boats, wherupon the bowline can be quickly released. If there is a strong crosswind and the bow line of the downwind boat is worryingly close to the stern, it might be worth surging the line out and motoring past the buoy before turning back to release it.
 
We were last in Rovinj in August 2016 and I hadn't realised that the marina had closed since then, although we were anchored in the small bay on the south side of the marina mole.

That mooring system is the same as one of the alternatives at Hvar except at Hvar the rings are on a rough shore so the idea is to have the bow of the boat close to the buoy and the long line to the shore to hold the boat away from the rocks. We did it by getting the line on the buoy and holding the boat on tickover whilst a crew member nipped over in the dinghy with the line from the back before tightening everything up.

I would probably do the Rovinj one in the same way but once the shore line is on then move the boat towards the shore by loosening the bow loop at one end and moving back slowly whilst the crew member pulls in the aft line until the boat is close enough to step off.

If there was no crosswind then you could skip the dinghy and just reverse towards the quay whilst letting the bow rope run out until someone can step off.

Richard
 
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Thanks to everyone for your advice and suggestions.

duncan99210 ~~ from the information I've been able to find, the buoys appear to be meant to be used in the conventional way -- bow line to buoy, and not as a pick-up point for a lazy line. I'd be happier if they were for pick-up!

RupertW ~~ at what time of year were you in Croatia last year? We're booked for the first week of June this year, so we're hoping the Bura won't be visiting us!

RichardS wrote "Just looked on the ACI marina website and they say that the marina is due to open for the start of the 2018 season .... so that probably means May 2018 unless there is a better source of info which says 2019?" - - - Richard, that was the same info I had until I made an enquiry to Rovinj Ports Authority who informed me that the new marina is now scheduled for opening Summer 2019. It would be a good idea for them to update their website ???

 
Spirit (of Glenans) said:
Your first assessment of the buoys seems to be correct according to the info on the website linked below:
http://www.cruiserswiki.org/wiki/Rovinj
What I would do would be to have a line prepared on the bow cleat and brought outside everything to the stern. I would then reverse up to the buoy, with a crew on the sugarscoop ready to take the line through the ring on the buoy. This would then be tied to it in a bowline loop large enough to reach the deck. A crew on the bow would then take up the slack and keep tension on the line as the boat is reversed towards the quay. The bowline would be perfectly secure as it will be under load when in use and would obviate the need for a doubled line. Upon departure the reverse of this procedure would keep the bow under control until clear of neighbouring boats, wherupon the bowline can be quickly released. If there is a strong crosswind and the bow line of the downwind boat is worryingly close to the stern, it might be worth surging the line out and motoring past the buoy before turning back to release it.
Click to expand...

+1

Many mooring buoys have lines of questionable age, and some (underlining the doubts) have disappeared. Many modern yachts are simply too high to sensibly attach your own line to the buoy from the bow and the obvious method is that described by Spirit (put someone on the sugar scoop with tail of a line already attached at the bow and passing outside 'everything') - once you have the line attached it all becomes so much easier. This works well because the person attaching the line and the helmsman are next to each other - and the helm can see the buoy. The technique works well in strong wind as hanging onto a line in strong wind - when the mooring line is too short is a recipe for divorce.

In my interpretation of the scenario - once the bow line is attached, and shortened - you can then reverse into the appropriate slot - or use the dinghy to take a line to shore (though you might need a long line for this.

Jonathan
 
Re-visiting this thread now that we've been to Croatia and 'done the deed'.

In case anyone may be heading there at some time this is what we did:

The yacht we had was equipped with a drop-down swim platform rather than the sugar scoop so it was fairly easy for someone to stand on it while holding on to the push pit. There are no lazy lines here ~ the buoys ARE for attaching your own line, and although there are no small pick-up buoys, the stainless top ring is around 200mm in diameter and fairly easy to catch and pass the line through. I allowed around 20 metres of line, already attached to a bow cleat and run along the outside of the hull to the stern. A bowline was tied in the line after catching the ring and ensured that the loop was almost 2 metres - - this made it easy to untie the knot on the bow instead of having to hang off when departing. (The rings and loop in the line should be visible in the photos below.)
By the time we had tied the bowline and walked the buoy to the bow, the boat was a little squint and needed a little tweaking to get it straightened up - but not enough tweaking to get into the embarrassing league!

(A couple of yachts that came in later DID have some berthing issues after attaching to the bouy.)

We also visited Porec (well worth a visit) and as the marina there is very tight and crowded, we opted to berth on the town quay. My Imray pilot book says "mooring fees paid to the harbourmaster entitles the visitor to use the showers at the marina." While that may have been true when it was written, it's certainly not true now.
. . . and in case anyone wants to berth on the town quay but doesn't want to be bombarded by pulsating "music" until 1AM, don't park in front of the GL disco! - - - it's not obvious that it is a disco until the noise starts in the early evening.
(Go ahead ~ ask me how I know such wisdom!)

002.jpg

001.jpg
 
We've been in Croatia for 10 years now and I'm still never sure when I approach a mooring buoy whether I'm supposed to thread a line through the eye on top of it, or not.

Obviously, if there's a short line with an eye trailing from the bottom of the buoy it's a dead cert to use the line .... but if there no line does one loop a line under the buoy or use the eye on top? I've seen a number of buoys where the eye on top has twisted and broken and turned itself into a hook. If one was tied to one of those, one wouldn't be by morning. :ambivalence:

Richard
 
.
Richard,

The rings on the buoys there on Valdibora Quay, Rovinj are easily the equal of the rings set into the masonry of the quayside itself and all the yachts (including a 46 ft & a 50 ft yacht) were using the top ring on the buoys. Earlier that day we had also picked up a buoy in the bay of Otocic Sveti Andrija (island) and these buoys also had that same substantial stainless ring.

The photo below shows one of the rings on the quayside at Valdibora and they're no sturdier than the ones on the buoys.
(The top shiny one -- not the big rusty one!)
004.jpg
 
Ship's Cat 73 said:
.
Richard,

The rings on the buoys there on Valdibora Quay, Rovinj are easily the equal of the rings set into the masonry of the quayside itself and all the yachts (including a 46 ft & a 50 ft yacht) were using the top ring on the buoys. Earlier that day we had also picked up a buoy in the bay of Otocic Sveti Andrija (island) and these buoys also had that same substantial stainless ring.

The photo below shows one of the rings on the quayside at Valdibora and they're no sturdier than the ones on the buoys.
(The top shiny one -- not the big rusty one!)
View attachment 71592
Click to expand...

This was one of my "belt and braces" successes ..... the very pleasant Muline bay at the top end of Ugljan.

IMG_4176.JPG


Generally speaking, I prefer to use the ring at the bottom of the buoy but there's no chance of this buoy making a break for freedom! ;)

Richard
 
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ottow said:
Thread a line thru the eye of the buoy when passing it.
Keep one end made fast to a bowcleat, and then just let the line run out. If needed you can use the line to slow down your approach to the quay.
Make sure the line is more than twice the length of the distance between the buoy and where the bow will end up when you are made fast.

Or use a buoy hook (if there is one on board). Example:
https://www.hjertmans.se/image?path=Articles/5886-80/5886-80.jpg
Click to expand...
Hi Ottow,

How do you proceed to go out when there is a lot of lateral wind and you have no bow thruster ?

I sail in the baltic in summer, I have no bow thruster and I use the hook you gave the link.

Best regards

Fab
 
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