Advice for a couple of new Day Skippers

[LadyInBed]

The big questions is what would people advise as the next step

Just get out and do some sailing, no matter where!

 

[LittleSister]

I'd heartily recommend you do a flotilla, for reasons including those already given, and also recommend Sailing Holiday and the Ionian if you're taking kids.

The important point to remember with a flotilla is that engaging with the other people in the flotilla, and joining in group activities is entirely optional!

Normally, the only expectation with a flotilla is you end up at the same port as the others at the end of the day, and attend a briefing in the morning to get info about where you're going that night, and some advice on the options in choosing your route to get there. Even going to the same port may not be required (see below)!

Meanwhile, you have all the advantages of someone to ask for advice, to be there to take lines when you arrive if you want, to come and fix the boat if anything goes wrong, to come and retrieve your anchor if it gets tangled up with others', and to give you all the info you need or want about your likely ports and anchorages. You also have other people around to compare/share experiences with should you want to, and a whole gang of other kids that yours may well want to join in with.

On the latter point, remember that even a big boat is a small place for a family, and can get a bit claustrophobic after a while, especially if things get a bit stressed or weather's not too good. It is great for kids (or others!) to be able to escape and be with other people for a while from time to time.

I have been several times with Sailing Holidays over the years, and each time have been allowed to go off on my own once the flotilla leader was satisfied I was reasonably competent (i.e. from the second day of the flotilla) - I just had to radio in each evening to let them know where I was, and get to the finishing port by the end of the last full day. other went off for 2 or 3 days.

My experience of Sailing Holidays, its staff and organisation varied from really good to truly excellent (though that was some years ago).

Even just in the booking process booking I've had excellent advice and help on several occasions. On one occasion I was pointed to an option or discount that hadn't yet been put on the website. On another occasion, I had been tempted by a late booking discount for the first week of the season, but when I told Barry (for it was he) that I was taking a couple of kids (my then girlfriend's) who'd not sailed before, he advised against taking them to Croatia, as I'd intended, at that time of year due to the potential for strong winds or other adverse weather. He suggested instead that we go to the Ionian, and noting that the prices for that were dearer than for the Croatia special I'd rung up about, he said he'd do an Ionian boat the same week for the same price. I booked. It was even a slightly bigger boat - 30' instead of 29' IIRC! When the booking details arrived the boat listed was bigger again, 32' IIRC. I didn't complain. A few days before leaving I had a phone call. Unfortunately my intended boat had been accidentally damaged during launching, and would I mind having a 36' boat instead? I didn't!

 

[ronsurf]

I don't know if any one has mentioned it, but I found all Greek charters required an ICC, the RYA qualifications are not recognised.

Not a bad thing really, the ICC assessment is pretty good. Ask to have a go at stern-to mooring, you'll need that in Greece, and it tales smoe practice and a bit of confidence to reverse towards a wall forcing yourself between a couple of bigger boats!

 

[laika]

I don't know if any one has mentioned it, but I found all Greek charters required an ICC, the RYA qualifications are not recognised.

You may have found something different to a lot of the rest of us. I don't have a link to an "official" statement but all of the charter companies seem to be saying dayskipper or the US ASA 104 (as well as ASA 101) are fine. I recall some recent questions around dayskipper and night sailing but I would question the blanket statement about RYA qualifications. I've never had an ICC and I haven't had my RYA qualifications turned down.

E.g:
Accepted Qualifications

 

[ronsurf]

You may have found something different to a lot of the rest of us. I don't have a link to an "official" statement but all of the charter companies seem to be saying dayskipper or the US ASA 104 (as well as ASA 101) are fine. I recall some recent questions around dayskipper and night sailing but I would question the blanket statement about RYA qualifications. I've never had an ICC and I haven't had my RYA qualifications turned down.

E.g:
Accepted Qualifications

I note that the Dayskipper is a recent addition to the list 'following complaints', so it must be a recent inclusion. Top of your list is the ICC. When we chartered in Greece, an ICC and a Yachtmaster only were accepted.

The ICC seemed to me the most useful ticket to have for chartering abroad. I'm unlikely to charter in the UK as I have my own boat, which is just as well as the ICC isn't accepted here for some reason. I guess the RYA have something to do with that, though the ICC is the more useful qualification to have, it's accepted internationally.

This is the guidance I was given: International Certificate of Competence (ICC)

 

[jordanbasset]

If you have a Day Skipper practical you can get the ICC from the RYA, when I did it it was free for RYA members and around £40 for non-members

 

[laika]

I note that the Dayskipper is a recent addition to the list 'following complaints', so it must be a recent inclusion.

It was accepted for years (it’s all I was ever asked for) but a couple of years ago there was an issue with port police somewhere questioning it on the grounds that it only covered daylight hours. Clearly that’s now been officially clarified as being acceptable (which is what the note there is about).

Nothing wrong with an ICC and probably very useful, I was only questioning the statement about RYA qualifications not being accepted in Greece because I believe it to be incorrect.

 

[ronsurf]

Nothing wrong with an ICC and probably very useful, I was only questioning the statement about RYA qualifications not being accepted in Greece because I believe it to be incorrect.

Yes, I should have said that not all the RYA qualifications were accepted (when I chartered a few years ago). I was surprised because I assumed that RYA qualification were accepted all over the world.

Has anyone pointed out that a VHF licence is also required by some countries for one person on board? (Well, it was when i chartered)

 

[Dellquay13]

It was accepted for years (it’s all I was ever asked for) but a couple of years ago there was an issue with port police somewhere questioning it on the grounds that it only covered daylight hours. Clearly that’s now been officially clarified as being acceptable (which is what the note there is about).

Nothing wrong with an ICC and probably very useful, I was only questioning the statement about RYA qualifications not being accepted in Greece because I believe it to be incorrect.
[/QUOTEAm I mistaken in understanding the

It was accepted for years (it’s all I was ever asked for) but a couple of years ago there was an issue with port police somewhere questioning it on the grounds that it only covered daylight hours. Clearly that’s now been officially clarified as being acceptable (which is what the note there is about).

Nothing wrong with an ICC and probably very useful, I was only questioning the statement about RYA qualifications not being accepted in Greece because I believe it to be incorrect.

Am i mistaken that UK ICC is actually for UK skippers of UK registered boats? Has the guidance changed in the 20 years since i took the ICC standalone test?

 

[Hodders]

For sure - kids are 15 and 14 and have both got competent crew.

Currently looking at going to Mallorca and putting in a couple of days of boat handling instruction before next summer.

Looking at my log - I've got a total of 46 days on yachts with just over 1100miles covered. That is all as crew/first mate and includes our week long day skipper practical course.

 

[Norman_E]

If you want to bareboat charter and are nervous of Med style stern to mooring go to Turkey, where most places, particularly the bay restaurants, have lazy lines. In Turkey someone will nearly always take your stern lines. One tip that applies to all stern to mooring situations is don't go close to the jetty and then try to turn the boat and back in to a space. Be aware of other boat's lazy lines or anchor chains and make your turn well away from the jetty so that you can get up enough speed astern to be able to steer. The people who get into difficulty are generally the ones who get too close before turning and going astern and then go too slowly so that prop walk and wind make it difficult to get control.

 

[Martin&Rene]

The original post mentioned BVI as an option. Great sailing with more consistent winds than in the Ionian and most overnights you are on a mooring as they do not like you anchoring on the coral. The only time we came alongside was to fill up with water. If it was not mentioned on your DS course, learn about using mid-cleat mooring lines when coming alongside , as it makes it easier if the yacht is short on crew.

 

[ronsurf]

If you want to bareboat charter and are nervous of Med style stern to mooring go to Turkey, where most places, particularly the bay restaurants, have lazy lines. In Turkey someone will nearly always take your stern lines. One tip that applies to all stern to mooring situations is don't go close to the jetty and then try to turn the boat and back in to a space. Be aware of other boat's lazy lines or anchor chains and make your turn well away from the jetty so that you can get up enough speed astern to be able to steer. The people who get into difficulty are generally the ones who get too close before turning and going astern and then go too slowly so that prop walk and wind make it difficult to get control.

Second this - going in for stern first moorings you can't go in slowly. You have to go in pretty smartish, then whack it into forward just before you hit the wall. I adopted the 'slow is best' attitude to mooring to start with, and generally prop walked all over the place.

I was amazed how many boats can be squeezed in like this.

 

[John the kiwi]

In that case a bare boat charter is the answer for you (which from your experience you should be more than capable of doing), but just a thought do your teenage children and partner think similar? If they do then go for it, if not then consider a flotilla, you will still get lunch time stops at anchor, with plenty of swimming and relaxing. The social side of flotillas means you can join in if you want to, but there is no compulsion. You can find your own restaurant, quiet bar etc.
From my experience on a flotilla there may be organised meals out 2-3 times in the week (which you can join or not) and the rest of the time you choose where you want to eat. Even in the organised meals afterwards you can go back to your boat or find a bar to your liking. You also normally have a couple of days 'free sailing', where you can choose where you want to stay over night, so if you fancy a quiet overnight anchorage, you can do. Also the flotilla skippers are normally okay with you going for longer on your own if they believe you have the required experience.
I think some who have not been on a flotilla think it is something like an 1960's Butlins holidays, with everything organised for you from the time you get up to the time you go to sleep, it really isn't.

Exactly what he said. I have my own boat in NZ, but chose to do a flotilla as a gentle introduction to sailing in Greece with the intention of bareboat charter on a later trip. Enjoyed the whole flotilla thing so much that we did two more. A surprising number of fellow flotilla sailors also had their own boats in the UK but like us were enjoying kicking back and doing the no stress flotillas.

 

[Mr Cassandra]

No wonder

Second this - going in for stern first moorings you can't go in slowly. You have to go in pretty smartish, then whack it into forward just before you hit the wall. I adopted the 'slow is best' attitude to mooring to start with, and generally prop walked all over the place.

I was amazed how many boats can be squeezed in like this.

There so many incident if using the above method.

 

[Beneteau381]

No wonder
There so many incident if using the above method.

Really? Pix?

 

[Mr Cassandra]

d

Really? Pix?

Yes,it's not difficult if you use a better method

 

[penfold]

Appropriate username is appropriate.

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

The original post mentioned BVI as an option. Great sailing with more consistent winds than in the Ionian and most overnights you are on a mooring as they do not like you anchoring on the coral. The only time we came alongside was to fill up with water. If it was not mentioned on your DS course, learn about using mid-cleat mooring lines when coming alongside , as it makes it easier if the yacht is short on crew.

+1. Midship spring mooring is the most useful technique you will ever learn.

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

Am i mistaken that UK ICC is actually for UK skippers of UK registered boats? Has the guidance changed in the 20 years since i took the ICC standalone test?

It's a qualification originating from the UN and administered by the recognised sailing associations/authorities of all the countries in Europe, designed to prove that you are competent to take command of a chartered boat in another European country. An ICC, in any country, can only be issued to a resident of that country.