Adding lithium battery

shanemax said:
Yes if your battery is at 60c it has been sitting in your black metal car some where in the tropics. On a hot summer day, even in the uk anything black can easily reach that temperature and you know it as we have all experienced taking our hand off something which is very hot that's been in the sun.
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The recommended safe max temp for lead acid batteries is 50C, for Lithium it's 60C.

LA batteries generally have no management system to control excessive charging or temperatures, Lithium does, making it a safer system in this regard.
 
shanemax said:
, why do NO car manufactures fit lithium starter batteries
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Simple. Because they are not necessary. LA or AGMs are fine. The benefits of lithium (size, weight, fast charging, discharge to zero etc) have no value in a car where the primary use is starting the engine and all service loads are covered by the on board generation systems.

The value of Lithium is in its energy storage capacity and charge/discharge profile which is what makes it ideal for a cruising boat with limited energy generation capacity and limited space. most installations retain an AGM for engine start as this is ideal for the job, particularly if a high power type like a Red Flash or Odyssey is chosen.
 
Still say try booking any type of lithium 100 amp battery (including your Life PO) on any aeroplane with any airline in the world as cargo luggage and see what happens. DHL will carry them but the restrictions on charge and the paperwork is frightening. Yes wheel chair batteries can be carried as cabin luggage under strict conditions but not in the hold. Now I wonder why as airlines are there to make a profit. Another politicians question no body answers.
 
shanemax said:
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I'll take that as an "I don't know what I'm talking about" then. I do enjoy it when people display their ignorance with such confidence - carry on posting please, I'm going to top up my popcorn - we need a bit more Dunning-Kruger entertainment on this forum.

Ford can get a Li battery at a decent price, but they can get a lead acid one for less. Everything runs on Li batteries these days, from toothbrushes to cars, using different chemistries dependent on the charge density required and the product requirements.

I suggest you return to your village and resume your previous occupation, and if the job has passed on to someone as equally qualified as you, then I'm sure there are other villages with open positions. (y) ;)
 
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Baggywrinkle said:
I'll take that as an "I don't know what I'm talking about" then. I do enjoy it when people display their ignorance with such confidence - carry on posting please, I'm going to top up my popcorn - we need a bit more Dunning-Kruger entertainment on this forum.

Ford can get a Li battery at a decent price, but they can get a lead acid one for less. Everything runs on Li batteries these days, from toothbrushes to cars, using different chemistries dependent on the charge density required and the product requirements.

I suggest you return to your village and resume your previous occupation, and if the job has passed on to someone as equally qualified as you, then I'm sure there are other villages with open positions. (y) ;)
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As someone who practiced design mechanical engineers for more years, I care to remember I fully concur with the design parameters of low costs both in materials and especially in the design of methods of manufacturer.

As batteries in car manufacture like tires are purchased in and fitted components cost is very important, so Baggywrinlie I totally agree with your post

I an currently considering replacing my LA domestic batteries with Li but my engine start battery will remain as LA
 
shanemax said:
Still say try booking any type of lithium 100 amp battery (including your Life PO) on any aeroplane with any airline in the world as cargo luggage and see what happens. DHL will carry them but the restrictions on charge and the paperwork is frightening. Yes wheel chair batteries can be carried as cabin luggage under strict conditions but not in the hold. Now I wonder why as airlines are there to make a profit. Another politicians question no body answers.
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Just a guess as I've never checked.

Would a small 20Ah AGM battery be allowed as hold luggage. I'm guessing that it wouldn't.

Flooded lead acid would be a problem because of free acid. I imagine AGM would have a problem because of the stored energy and the risk it poses.

I might check later when it's cooler. 38.5C in the shade earlier.
 
Is the OP planning to fit a Lithium battery to his boat or to a commercial passenger jet ?

Shanemax comes out with this 'plane nonsense and other rubbish every time there is a thread about Lithium batteries. It's impossible to engage with him because has has zero understanding of the subject matter and seems unable to grasp anything that he is told.
 
billskip said:
Just a thought, coz I don't know, what type of battery is used for "hybrid " cars and for starting?
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I'd imagine it would be lead acid on cost grounds. Even Tesla used to fit 12V lead acid auxillary batteries. They did change to 16V lithium ion later because the lead acid ones were going flat when car wasn't being used for a while.

I suspect warranty issues and bad press made them bite the bullet on cost.

My Tesla certainly has a 16V "start battery". I've never been able to find the starter motor.:D
 
Mistroma said:
My Tesla certainly has a 16V "start battery". I've never been able to find the starter motor.:D
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The "start" battery runs some of the boring services like unlocking the doors and powering the computing hardware - at least that is what the manual for my MG4 says. Seems to work OK
 
Tranona said:
The "start" battery runs some of the boring services like unlocking the doors and powering the computing hardware - at least that is what the manual for my MG4 says. Seems to work OK
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Obviously too subtle when changing reference from auxillary to starter.:D

My point was that even a pure EV used lead acid for auxillary items initially. That would really point to it being cost saving and supports earlier arguments about why ICE cars didn't use Lithium ion. I came to that conclusion immediately as it seemed obvious there were no overriding reasons to fit Lithium ion as start batteries. Further consideration only backed up that conclusion.
 
Baggywrinkle said:
I'll take that as an "I don't know what I'm talking about" then. I do enjoy it when people display their ignorance with such confidence - carry on posting please, I'm going to top up my popcorn - we need a bit more Dunning-Kruger entertainment on this forum.
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never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
 
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