Achor light on a mooring buoy

[LadyJessie]

[ QUOTE ]
Can you point me in the direction of the colreg that says a boat on a mooring buoy must display an anchor light?

[/ QUOTE ]Please read rule 30 of the colregs. You must here understand that the concept of 'anchored' is not limited to attachment by the means of some physical 'anchor' only; it means the literal attachment to the bottom by any means. This reading of the colregs have been established in many courts around the world for many old years. It should be good enough for you as well. It is also logical; if I arrive in a bay at night and see you, I have no way of knowing what your particular 'anchoring method' is. It does not matter.

The issue of discussion here is, imho; your supposition that any mooring buoy releases you from the necessity of an anchor light and my contrary suggestion that you might have to display an anchor light if you are anywhere close to traffic. Not withstanding how you are attached to the bottom. I think you are wrong, my understanding of both the letter and the essence of the colregs are that you are bound to have to show a light, anything else would be bad seamanship. Looking forward to hear if you have a different opinion.

 

[nathanlee]

Yikes! I just returned to this thread to find a bit of an eruption of opinion. I certainly didn't intend that to happen, it was just a question, but, and I don't want to encourage bickering here, but.... it does suggest the colregs are open to at least some degree of interpretation.

Actually, I kind of like that. It's like the last bastion of common sense. The law, judge, jury, and executioner; all rolled into one collection of guidelines, who's disobedience will result in entirely unpredictable punishments.

 

[l'escargot]

[ QUOTE ]
...Please read rule 30 of the colregs. You must here understand that the concept of 'anchored' is not limited to attachment by the means of some physical 'anchor' only; it means the literal attachment to the bottom by any means. This reading of the colregs have been established in many courts around the world for many old years. It should be good enough for you as well.

[/ QUOTE ]
I have. Now that you are alluding to case law, can you please point me in the direction of one single case where a court has ruled that a small boat on a recognised mooring is classed as anchored and is in breach of colregs for not displaying an anchor light, or for that matter an anchor ball? That will be good enough for me.

To take your argument further, all the yachts moored on piles or a midstream pontoon should also display anchor lights and day shapes. Come to that, perhaps anyone on a tidal mooring should nip out and change the lights/shapes to show that their vessel is aground every half tide. I think you are over interpreting the rules in a way that was never meant.

To answer your edited post, the issue under discussion here is the original question: "...what is the correct thing to do on a mooring buoy, anchor light, or not?" I believe the answer remains that an anchor light (or day shape) is not required by a small boat on a mooring buoy in an area of charted/recognised moorings be there people on board or not. However, I have also qualified this view with "... but if you are on board and you want to show one there is nothing to stop you". I accept that perhaps there are times when it would be prudent.

 

[LadyJessie]

lescargot: I think we are discussing 'apples and oranges' here. Your point is mainly relating to UK rivers, which I easily admit is a very special case. It should really be very easy for anyone to recognise a UK river mooring. That should be a no-brainer.

My point was that the rest of the world does not look like that. If you anchor or pick up a mooring buoy in most other parts of the world you are very likely to be exposed to other traffic. You have to think about how your boat is exposed to this danger and ensure that it is visible. That is the normal situation in most anchorages. My concern was to try to highlight this to the OP and ensure that he/she did not think that this narrow view of UK anchoring practice was the norm to follow in the rest of the world. The basic colregs makes more sense than the more liberal view that has been developed in the UK; you should watch out for that! Put out an anchor light! How difficult is that...???

 

[Rabbie]

This point occurred to me years ago. I acquired a couple of solar lights and used them on moorings - just for self/boat -preservation. Better safe than sorry.

 

[l'escargot]

No, I'm not discussing UK rivers. I am referring to harbours and coastlines on both sides of the English Channel.

Even if I was referring to rivers, the OP sails a 21 foot boat out of the Thames and around the South Coast.

You are answering questions that weren't asked and despite your claims that a moored boat is anchored, anchorages and moorings are totally different entities wherever in the world they are situated.

Basic colregs need to be interpreted sensibly. In my experience, it is actually the rest of the world that does this better than the UK. The average small boat sailor gets too bogged down in placing their own interpretaions on the colregs, instead of applying them how they were intended.

 

[absit_omen]

I think that Ms J has dug herself a mud hole and is finding it difficult to get out. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

 

[Tranona]

Lescargot
Word of advice
You are wasting your breath with LJ. The more you are right, the more he claims you are wrong!

He has already been asked to cite a case to support his statement that it has been recognised in a court of law. He is incapable of answering that question for two reasons. Firstly because I doubt there has ever been a case and secondly his knowledge of such matters (as he has demonstrated on these fora on countless occasions) is so limited that he would not know anyway.

 

[ebbtide]

[ QUOTE ]
There is no requirement for a boat on a charted mooring to show an anchor light, but if you are on board and you want to show one there is nothing to stop you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Only commonsense! As Richard has posted, if you are in a vulnerable position like the first on a trot of moorings, then it is prudent to display a light.

I came into Beaulieu River one night and rounding the port-hand markers after crossing the Bar entered that long reach to find the distant green wasn't working. My hand lantern hadn't been charged up either. so next thing I saw was the transom of a large yacht a few feet off the bow; he was on one of two isolated moorings and didn't show any lights BUT IMHO it would have been seamanlike to do so, for his safety as well as helping others.

Like many of these forum disputes which end up looking for regulations to justify an attitude, the contributors haven't covered enough miles yet to be frightened!

 

[oceanpilgrim]

hi
when i anchor or moor up in or near any night movment i have four garden solar powerd lights,two front two stern,if very busy anchor ligt on as well,yes i have been ramed in the night befor !!

 

[Chrusty1]

Re: Achor light on a mooring buoy (Another can of worms!)

[ QUOTE ]
I think that Ms J has dug herself a mud hole and is finding it difficult to get out. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I do enjoy these threads /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Especially when the "COLREGS" table bashers get into their stride........

 

[RestlessL]

Re: Achor light on a mooring buoy (Another can of worms!)

Collregs 3(i) "The word underway means that a vessel is not at anchor, or made fast to the shore, or aground."

So having established that a moored vessel is not at anchor, surely it should show navigation lights at night (unless exempted, eg by local byelaws).

 

[Chrusty1]

Re: Achor light on a mooring buoy (Another can of worms!)

/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Oh! eh! What!..........sorry, I must have nodded off then for a minute!

Were was I? Oh yes Colregs......

Well Rule 5 says......

"Every vessel shall at all times maintain a proper look-out by sight as well as by hearing as well as by all available means appropriate in the prevailing circumstances and conditions so as to make a full appraisal of the situation and of the risk of collision."

So taking that as the honest gospel, everybody that leaves a vessel unnattended on a mooring is in breach of the rule, as the rule states quite clearly that a vessel shall at all times maintain a proper watch! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Refueler]

In practical terms of safety and being seen - I would advocate a light of some description at most times irrespective of moored, anchored or whatever. That is not the point.

You have stated clearly that Colregs say you SHOULD have light if moored to a buoy. Wrong.

What they do in fact is provide sufficient leeway in the Colregs for you to show if you consider it wise and seamanlike to do so. Why does it do that ? If Colregs were hard and fast on all points - then individual, special circumstances would be ruled out ... submarines, aircraft carriers not able to show prescribed lights in normal fashion ... unable to take avoiding action from a give-way vessel, show a light on sails when you are worried .... the list goes on and on and on ....

The problem is when it is then quoted to prove a point. It has not that point in fact. What it has, is the provision to ALLOW you to be prudent and safer.

Many people misunderstand the basis of Colregs - read the books, write them up in stone ... quote rule xx, paragraph x, subsection xx ... when in fact Colregs are a collection of simple common sense items to make life on the water safer. They should be read in full for each section and not have single extracts gleaned out. That's what politicians do !!

Now I'm sure there are some that would love to have a go at me for above .. go on ... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[Refueler]

[ QUOTE ]
lescargot: I think we are discussing 'apples and oranges' here. Your point is mainly relating to UK rivers, which I easily admit is a very special case. It should really be very easy for anyone to recognise a UK river mooring. That should be a no-brainer.

My point was that the rest of the world does not look like that. If you anchor or pick up a mooring buoy in most other parts of the world you are very likely to be exposed to other traffic. You have to think about how your boat is exposed to this danger and ensure that it is visible. That is the normal situation in most anchorages. My concern was to try to highlight this to the OP and ensure that he/she did not think that this narrow view of UK anchoring practice was the norm to follow in the rest of the world. The basic colregs makes more sense than the more liberal view that has been developed in the UK; you should watch out for that! Put out an anchor light! How difficult is that...???

[/ QUOTE ]

mmmmmmm I suggest you take a trip to the Far East and that may alter your view about it only being a UK point ! West Africa maybe ? Florida Keys ? Those examples make UK look like paddling pools ...

 

[out_to_sea]

Re: Achor light on a mooring buoy (Another can of worms!)

As a complete newbie to sailing, I was given a little book called "boat owners highway code" published by practical boat owner magazine /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

It says "all vessels at anchor under 50m should show an all round white light. Vessels under 7m need not when anchored away from shipping but its advisable. Lights at mast top can get confused with the stars."

"ships over 50m must show two all round whites with the stern one lower. under 50m this is optional."

"very large ships have to illuminate the whole length of their decks when at anchor."

If you had a floating brothal... what lights would that display? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Chrusty1]

Well said that man! I think some of the posters on "COLREGS" get a bit adrift of common sense, in fact some of them definitley seem to have slipped their moorings! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Chrusty1]

Re: Achor light on a mooring buoy (Another can of worms!)

"If you had a floating brothal... what lights would that display?"

Goodness gracious!

No good asking me about things like that, I wouldn't have a clue, couldn't possibly comment, completely outside of my experience, never seen such a thing, wouldn't know what one would look like!

Dear Oh Deary me! whatever next???!!! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Alfie168]

The first time I sailed into Cowes (I was not skippering) it was dark, and there is a whole trot of moored keelboats on the east side of the river entry and they are completely unlit, and difficult to identify against the background light scatter.

We didn't hit them. But we might have done, and the odd light would have helped. I can only assume lights are not required as otherwise the Cowes harbourmaster would be crawling all over them. Before others leap at me...yes it was our error in missing a buoy and turning too early.

Whatever the regs say I'd have thought a solar powered light with a daylight cutoff is a perfectly reasonable and low cost item to have hanging around a moored boat. If it saves some poor bugger inadvertently crashing into your pride and joy, then its even more reasonable.

Tim

 

[nathanlee]

Re: Achor light on a mooring buoy (Another can of worms!)

[ QUOTE ]

If you had a floating brothal... what lights would that display? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Single all round white light at mast top, same as any normal yacht, except the vessel must display "Kudu" on the bows and transom.