Absolutely Speechless (non boaty)

[TheBoatman]

Yes you guessed it, The Taxman.

I have paid all my tax on time and the agreed amounts (agreed with the taxman that is).

In May I owed £0, zero, zilch, nowt, bugger all. I was completely paid up.

This morning I recieved a "Penalty Notice" saying that I should have told them that I owed them £0, zero, zilch, nowt, bugger all and that they have calculated the "penalty" at £100 per month since May and will continue to charge me this amount until I clear the debt.

I know he doesn't come into this forum because its only for (Tory voting) rich boat owners but I would like to say this:

"Gordon, how the ***k can you stand up in parliament and say that your reducing the amount of red tape and stress on the small businesses when you can find it within your power to fine me for having a zero balance, and why did you charge me for 4 months and then wait until the 5th month before telling me"

Gezzs I hate all polititions with a passion.

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[aod]

How appropriate your timing is! This morning I received a tax assesment of £500 owed (of course by me) for the year 1996-1997 when I was paye.

I also run a small business and get hammered at every turn by either the tax man or the VAT b-------ds and almost every year I pay a fine for something or the other that I knew nothing about.

I agree with you entirely that these days you have spend an inordinate amount of time with accountancy issues to make sure the b-----ds can't stuff you for even more money.

I also hate politicians with a vengance but not as much as the small minded petty jobsworths at the IR.

I think attempting to run a small business these days simply isn't worth all the aggro!

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[Metabarca]

Ah, but thank your stars that you get a letter saying WHY you have to pay. Here in Italy, I got a similar cough up or else letter: three pages printed on both sides but nothing saying what I'd done wrong, why I had to pay or to which tax it referred (we have several here, don't you know - aren't we the lucky ones!). I had to get my accoutant on to it and he sent me armed with sheaves of paper to the tax office where, three hours later, I was told what the letter should have told me. Plus, of course, I have to pay. I hate politicians and taxmen, but I hate Italian politicians and taxmen even more! It took me 5 years (FIVE) to recoup some VAT I was owed once.
gnasshhh, grrr grr

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[jhr]

I realise that you hate politicians (don't we all....?) but in this case I'd suggest writing to your MP to complain. This is outrageous.

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[steve_cronin]

An Apology, from the Taxman?

YES!!

I got one last week. Both by telephone and in writing.

They just sent me a demand which, along with the attached "history" had no relation to my afairs at all. Had it been true, my wife would have received exactly the same as we are 50/50 partners in the business and she did not. We didn't owe anything anyway:all paid up on time. Anyway three days after the demand arrived, on a weekend, I got a phone call from someone claiming to represent the revenue repeating the figures. I told him that as his call was un solicited, I wasn't going to continue discussing my affairs with him and would terminate the call. BLOODY STALINISTS!! Even if I had owed them anything, why ring me at home? Anyway Sunday call to my accountant (who is also a personal friend) brought about the telephoned and a very nice letter of apology. Sadly however this was OVER TWO MONTHS LATER and after he had needed to send them THREE copies of his complaint - they managed to loose each systematically, around a week apart, I had received all sorts of letters including a threat of "Distraint on Goods" and yet another sinister phone call.

I suppose that if it had been the boatyard sending out an erroneous bill we would all forgive after the correction but being it's the Revenue, am I being harsh?... well actually, thinking on, it is more the fact that they just can't possibly contemplate that they are either in the wrong or that their system is fallible. NO they ARE Stalinists AND well superannuated ones too!

Steve Cronin

<hr width=100% size=1>The above is, like any other post here, only a personal opinion

 

[tcm]

ah but. I made some money and found out they wanted some tax. Now, it's at that point you should get mad. Cos it's your money. Whereas it seems this govt have inured most people to paying loads more tax than when we were at long-running wars, owned an empire, built parks, tube systems, railways, canals sewerage systems, motorways, channel tunnels, huge govt buildings (not crap tents near greenwich) and all without machines and computers...

These days people only get mad when the process of paying tax is handled badly.

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[Talbot]

If you want to see someone really get mad, then start to discuss IR35. This incredibly offensive section makes consultants pay more tax than anyone else - and that cannot be fair. Did tony's crony's redress the balance by allowing sick pay or enemployment benefits - no, just tried to find more ways to suck more money out of us.

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[robp]

Going by the months, is this P35 stuff? A penalty for not sending the return in?

Agree with the "Red Tape stuff - and what AOD says. Part of the system of "stealth" tax is loading more and more responsibilities and work onto us and small business. Thereby transferring costs from them to us.

It's magical how the government can come up with more & more ways of them spending less and us paying more.

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[snowleopard]

Look at it this way

Sorry guys but you don't really understand the principles of tax collection.

The inspectors have an incentive programme which rewards them not for getting it right but for collecting the maximum amount. It's not surprising that mistakes are always in their favour or that they regularly go on fishing expeditions to see if they can get you to cough up for something you don't really owe.

One company I worked for reimbursed travel expenses in the monthly pay. Employees regularly had to appeal against the taxman trying to treat it as salary. If you appealed they immediately dropped it; if you didn't they pocketed it and kept quiet.

As for this government, they claim to like small businesses. This is in fact true. The unpublished subtext is: YOU DAMN WELL BETTER STAY SMALL. It's simply the politics of envy, or to paraphrase the well known version of the party anthem:

The middle class can kiss my a***
I've got the PM's job at last.

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[aod]

Re: Look at it this way

Well if this is true it explains a great deal. Nothing moral about it is there when they have incentives to increase their revenue regardless of the consequences to the poor buggers on the receiving end.

I absolutely detest the officers of the IR because of their reckless disregard of the effects of their actions.

Like I said 'jobsworths' bit like over enthsiastic probationer constables who nick everybody for anything and everything.

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[Sybarite]

Re: An Apology, from the Taxman?

Folks: this is nothing new ; I heard the same stories when I was an articled clerk decades ago. Like somebody getting a bill for something like 0.4pence ; he paid with a halfpenny and demanded his change; or sending in a zero cheque and asking for a written receipt etc etc.

The same thing happens in other countries and with exactly the same administrative attitude.

As a former FD of a French car rental company, the authorities stopped us registering our cars in the Champagne dept which was by far the cheapest and the only one geared up to handling volume registrations. This, despite us having our vehicle owning company based there. Imagine then lining up in the Préfecture one moring to get 5000 cars registered - manually! Or instead of doing it at one centre, trying to organize several hundred employees to go out on the same day to Prefectures dotted all over France.

As this cost us a lot of money we counter-attacked on the basis of an approach which I had worked on. We "eliminated" - perfectly legally - the local business tax which in France often exceeds the amount of corporate tax. Advantage £3.5m.

John

PS: If any of you have subsidiaries in France the same procedure still works -subject to certain provisos.




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[webcraft]

Re: An Apology, from the Taxman?

It's threads like this that make you realise why the working class joe public doesn't have much time for us yachties . . .


- N


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[steve_cronin]

Sorry OLD BOY....

Your posting is very grandiose and well, (ctlr i) impressive but this is not the way an Englishman expects to be treated!

<hr width=100% size=1>The above is, like any other post here, only a personal opinion

 

[zephyrsailor]

Re: Look at it this way

i belive from a tax lawyer friend of mine that the IR cannot fine you a greater amount than the tax you owe. there fore if you owe nothing the maximum fine they can put on you is nothing.

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[Jeremy_W]

>>> I know he doesn't come into this forum because its only for (Tory voting) rich boat owners...

I never knew that! Should I leave immediately?

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[TheBoatman]

The thought had crossed my mind, but then the last thing that anyone in business wants to do is stir up / question either the IR or HMC & E (Vatman) because they can be thee most vindictive of people. They wouldn't rest until they had taught me a lesson I wouldn't forget? They would get me to trawl through my books (going back 7 years) to justifiy every expense/invoice, which would cost me 100's of hours and lots of dosh because it is a well know fact that the perception is we are all lying, cheating B*****ds and must be on the fiddle, and it is there goal in life to make sure we don't question them?
BTW I have contacted my accountants and they have said "send them the notice and they will deal with it".

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[Captain_Chaos]

The revenue can sometimes show kindness and consideration to tax payers.for example, for "ordinary" employees of businesses who are made redundant, the maximum tax free payment is £30k. For civil servants, there is a special exemption that allows them to receive twice this amount.
The tax perks for MPs also make interesting reading.


A recent newspaper article in the Daily Telegraph on Jim Davison ( the well known comedian) suggested that he had been given 3 years to pay his tax arrears despite a salary of c£750k per year;

It is alleged that the inland revenue accepted 10p in the £ from the administrator of Leicester City when they could not pay. It is also rumoured that the administrator of notts county FC has gone for over a year without making any payments for paye or nic despite having deducted amounts from the players wages. Apparently he couldnt pay because he needed the money to help finance the business.

How many "real" businesses would be exttended the same courtesy?


<hr width=100% size=1>My drinking team has a sailing problem

 

[sailorman]

wot u lot dont realise is that we have to pay more tax so that all the public servants can then retire early with stress or medically enhanced pensions. thats y we spend more each year on the plod to fund the pension, not plod on the street

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[Bergman]

Re: You must have

really done something to annoy them.

I did just the same as you - paid up in full

Only I got a rebate:

They sent me a cheque for £0.00

Amazing

What do these people use instead of a brain/

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