A Question Of Seamanship. February YM

[prv]

There wouldn't be much point in manufacturing an engine with a starting handle that couldn't be used.

There was a handle on Kindred Spirit's 2GM20; I tried a few times to start it just to see if I could, but never succeeded. Lots of similar tales posted here over the years with those engines.

The Bukhs have a nice big flywheel and a better position for the handle, so starting one of them is a more convincing proposition.

Pete

 

[sailaboutvic]

All that is undoubtedly true ..... but it was Vic's recommendation to remove the fan belt before starting the engine that attracted my attention as, if by some miracle the engine did start, it would be a short-lived triumph!

Richard

Ok guys , yes I was joking .
But what about putting a socket on the end of a B&D drill . ?

 

[Topcat47]

I can't believe this thread is still going.

 

[Poignard]

What I do is pump fuel through using the lever on the lift pump. Position the starting handle so it's moving downwards on the compression stroke. Then open the decompressors and start turning the engine until it's turning as fast as I can make it. Then shut the decompressor. The inlet manifold heater helps if fitted. Also a squirt of oil down the inlet valve.

I have never failed to start it by hand, even though it might take several attempts. Sometimes I have had to sit down afterwards! I'm glad I now have a second battery!

 

[Uricanejack]

I've started a Lister SR2 by hand by dropping one compression level at a time at the right moment (getting the timing right was critical)

I've nearly broken my wrist trying to start a Lister HA2, a much bigger engine, by hand!

These were both old fashioned relatively low compression air cooled "industrial" diesels. The reason, IMO, they don't fit hand start to modern marine diesels is 'cos it would be impossible to start the engine with the thing!

I've a feeling its more likely down to cost reduction. Though I have sailed a boat which had a diesel with a hand crank. Which the boat builder installed so it was completely impossible to turn the crank.

 

[Woodlouse]

I've a feeling its more likely down to cost reduction. Though I have sailed a boat which had a diesel with a hand crank. Which the boat builder installed so it was completely impossible to turn the crank.

Your last point is probably a consideration too. How many boats have their engines installed in a manner that gives room to swing a crank?

 

[Uricanejack]

I think I've had this argument about cranks before.

The scenario doesn't mention one being available. So I assume the boat is like mine and does not have one. (a feature I miss)
The provision of a hand crank would eliminate the problem. They take practice to use and can cause injury.
I have recently started a modern 3 cylinder diesel with a hand crank. Admittedly it was not in the confines of a small sailing vessel. I had lots of room and a helper.
I have a Yanmar 3GM 30 F. I was surprised newer versions don't have compression levers. I looked em up and couldn't see any.

I would have suggested "Bump Starting" that would require a fixed pitch propeller. (I have a feathering prop). And Compression lever when I've tried it.

 

[Uricanejack]

Not being a delivery dude. I still delivered my own new to me boat.
Prior to purchase and delivery I had it surveyed. Which provide a list of stuff to do. some listed as essential some nice.
I had it lifted cleaned, painted new zincs and minor repairs.
Getting the boat ready was a learning process. Just the sheer difficulty of getting there and getting stuff done. Finding stuff in a strange town was a PIA.
Getting the entire rig overhauled would have been nice. No rigger in area. Best place for job was at destination. Surveyor and I saw no problems. Had the boat out for a couple of short sails.
I can't see anything more than that as practical for a delivery.
Engine serviced, by a mechanic. Just a service was not a high cost. Possible I could have done myself but I'm not a mechanic. And I wanted it checked out before I bought it. Fuel tank drained No.
Batteries. Boat was in yard for a month. both dead. Jump started. one recovered one didn't. I should have replaced it.
Sailing overnight. Just nave lights and instruments on. essentials on everything else off. Run on suspected duff battery. Kept good one isolated. Engine started very 4 hrs no issue.
Had the batteries or engine failed. Its a sailboat. big deal. I would have just sailed it to destination. (I had battery lights)
It was windy ripped the No 1 jib. used the No 2.

I guess if you are going to deliver a boat. My priority are.
Is it safe.
Apparently structurally sound. Through Hulls ect.
Rig and Sails appear OK.
Basic engine Checks, Oil, Belts, Coolant, Water coming out exhaust, Recent service. Filters Checked Changed, Impellor, Spare.
Basic recommended safety gear.
Basic tool kit.
Basic Nav gear. Hand compass Binos, Pencil Ruller. Log or Note book.
Charts, Tide tables and sailing Directions for voyage.
A few things might not be perfect. As long as you know and have a contingency plan. In my case I suspected I had 1 duff battery.
Even then other stuff may still go wrong.

 

[NormanS]

How long is that?
Come one, make a guess, easy to judge, but make a decision.

As I have previously suggested, if you do want advice and suggestions about the adequate checks that require to be done on a boat which has been lying for some years, before setting out on a delivery trip, please start a new thread. We are cluttering up an existing thread.

 

[capnsensible]

Not being a delivery dude. I still delivered my own new to me boat.
Prior to purchase and delivery I had it surveyed. Which provide a list of stuff to do. some listed as essential some nice.
I had it lifted cleaned, painted new zincs and minor repairs.
Getting the boat ready was a learning process. Just the sheer difficulty of getting there and getting stuff done. Finding stuff in a strange town was a PIA.
Getting the entire rig overhauled would have been nice. No rigger in area. Best place for job was at destination. Surveyor and I saw no problems. Had the boat out for a couple of short sails.
I can't see anything more than that as practical for a delivery.
Engine serviced, by a mechanic. Just a service was not a high cost. Possible I could have done myself but I'm not a mechanic. And I wanted it checked out before I bought it. Fuel tank drained No.
Batteries. Boat was in yard for a month. both dead. Jump started. one recovered one didn't. I should have replaced it.
Sailing overnight. Just nave lights and instruments on. essentials on everything else off. Run on suspected duff battery. Kept good one isolated. Engine started very 4 hrs no issue.
Had the batteries or engine failed. Its a sailboat. big deal. I would have just sailed it to destination. (I had battery lights)
It was windy ripped the No 1 jib. used the No 2.

I guess if you are going to deliver a boat. My priority are.
Is it safe.
Apparently structurally sound. Through Hulls ect.
Rig and Sails appear OK.
Basic engine Checks, Oil, Belts, Coolant, Water coming out exhaust, Recent service. Filters Checked Changed, Impellor, Spare.
Basic recommended safety gear.
Basic tool kit.
Basic Nav gear. Hand compass Binos, Pencil Ruller. Log or Note book.
Charts, Tide tables and sailing Directions for voyage.
A few things might not be perfect. As long as you know and have a contingency plan. In my case I suspected I had 1 duff battery.
Even then other stuff may still go wrong.

It always seems that you cannot plan for everything!

As others have suggested, a drop test on the batteries is a good idea (load em up, lights, fridge etc). A good engine run after usual checks, in gear and big revs for a couple of hours works too.

Its that underwater thing that gets neglected though. Important to find out when the last lift was. Fifty quid on a diver is not much in the grand scheme to get rid of excess fouling, clean prop and check general condition. A service I have needed on a couple of deliveries.

:encouragement:

 

[alant]

As I have previously suggested, if you do want advice and suggestions about the adequate checks that require to be done on a boat which has been lying for some years, before setting out on a delivery trip, please start a new thread. We are cluttering up an existing thread.

Right.

 

[Strolls]

The French singlehanded racer's trick was to attach a rope to the engine pulley wheel, up out through the hatch and attach to the boom ............. then crash gybe the mainsail with as much force as possible. Apparently it worked

I can't immediately find it, and the one I've seen wasn't a singlehander, but there's video of this somewhere on YouTube.

 

[fisherman]

Anyone who has had a lashing about the arms from a stuck seagull starter cord will have a mental image of the whole rig being wound down through the hatch when the engine starts and the rope tangles the pulley.
I once saw an old chap cowering in the bow of his boat as a lead weight and set of mackerel feathers whirled above his head.

 

[laika]

Everyone is aware that the failed engine thing was just a device to set up a scenario where you're faced with a decision to carry on with a plan or change it because of lack of power and failing electrics, right?

It's a similar thing to how a scenario for "A Question of Vampire Slaying" which starts "Chet and Mary-Lou's car breaks down. They have no cellular signal but Mary-Lou suggests that the creepy old house on the hill they passed a mile back might have a phone..." probably isn't looking for a run-down of how you'd fault find on a '75 mustang with the complete set of snap-on tools which you always carry with you....

 

[vyv_cox]

Everyone is aware that the failed engine thing was just a device to set up a scenario where you're faced with a decision to carry on with a plan or change it because of lack of power and failing electrics, right?

It's a similar thing to how a scenario for "A Question of Vampire Slaying" which starts "Chet and Mary-Lou's car breaks down. They have no cellular signal but Mary-Lou suggests that the creepy old house on the hill they passed a mile back might have a phone..." probably isn't looking for a run-down of how you'd fault find on a '75 mustang with the complete set of snap-on tools which you always carry with you....

But, as has been pointed out earlier, that is the essence of forums. 95 posts and 3214 views on the topic suggest that many people have found it interesting and enjoyable. I don't remember many threads in which member A asked a question and member B answered, no other contributions.

 

[lw395]

Everyone is aware that the failed engine thing was just a device to set up a scenario where you're faced with a decision to carry on with a plan or change it because of lack of power and failing electrics, right?

It's a similar thing to how a scenario for "A Question of Vampire Slaying" which starts "Chet and Mary-Lou's car breaks down. They have no cellular signal but Mary-Lou suggests that the creepy old house on the hill they passed a mile back might have a phone..." probably isn't looking for a run-down of how you'd fault find on a '75 mustang with the complete set of snap-on tools which you always carry with you....

But fixing the Mustang and running over the vampires is still the way to go?

 

[fisherman]

But fixing the Mustang and running over the vampires is still the way to go?

Does the Mustang have a hand start?

 

[RichardS]

Does the Mustang have a hand start?

Talking of Mustangs, which we seem to be, here is a photo I took a couple of days ago before we flew home.

I'm sure many of you will recognise the view ....... but a virtual pint to the first who can explain the significance of this particular road.

Richard

 

[dom]

Where Bullitt car chase was filmed? ....in a Mustang!

Edit: the Drift Polizei are going to go nuts

 

[RichardS]

Where Bullitt car chase was filmed? ....in a Mustang!

Edit: the Drift Polizei are going to go nuts

Good grief ... that was quick! Congratulations Dom.

The car chase from Bullitt is generally recognised as the first dedicated such sequence in movie history and won its editor an Oscar I believe. The chase was actually filmed in a dozen locations throughout Frisco on different days and then spliced together in post-production in a completely different order to the actual filming, which results in many continuity errors in terms of damage to the cars and hub caps being lost more than once.

It is therefore impossible to drive the route taken by the Mustang and the Charger because in the film they vanish around a corner and then re-appear from around a different corner on the other side of the city. For me, the most iconic part of the chase is the section in the photograph down Taylor Street from the Broadway intersection at the top to the junction with Filbert halfway down. This section actually appears twice in the chase but filmed from a different angle, which is why the famous green VW Beetle can be seen being overtaken 4 times.

One final nugget for fellow lovers of American Muscle Cars, although the Mustang with Steve McQueen at the wheel actually wins the chase, in reality the Charger was a much faster car and during filming the stunt driver, Bill Hickman, had to keep his foot of the throttle to allow the Mustang to keep up. Of course, being American, neither car was great going around corners!

Richard