A cavalier attitude to having an emergency kicker engine...
- Thread starter OKBoater
- Start date
wakeup
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Shall I throw you some fish or the beach ball?
As Mapis put so clearly, it depends upon where you are doing your boating. I have done most of my boating in the Bristol Channel which has the second highest tidal range in the world (circa 14m) and tidal streams to go with it. You Canuks have the highest in Fundy bay.
So I have had two single engine boats on this stretch of water over a 14 year period, a wing engine is totally useless in this environment because you can't push against a 6knot tide with a 5hp nailed to the back of either a 21footer as I first had then a 28 footer. I couldn't carry enough gasoline to make it home. On the occasion I had a problem I called a mate and got a tow. I was completely prepared with a life raft, flares, spare radio, back up GPS, impellers, belts, spare props. Oars are completely useless in this situation. So I spend the time effort and money to make sure my single engines were properly serviced and they never missed a beat. The only problem I had was duff battery, a mate one had a single fail to start and that was dirty fuel. I know no one that has suffered a catastrophic engine failure.
So to say I am unprepared because I chose not to fit a wing engine is stupendously dumb. I actually could inflate my tender and lash that to the side of the boat inside 10 mins but as I said pointless in these tides. Action would be in a failure situation, anchor down, call a mate or RNLI, get beer and wait.
I like to think of it as being more prepared.
Shall I throw you some fish or the beach ball?
As Mapis put so clearly, it depends upon where you are doing your boating. I have done most of my boating in the Bristol Channel which has the second highest tidal range in the world (circa 14m) and tidal streams to go with it. You Canuks have the highest in Fundy bay.
So I have had two single engine boats on this stretch of water over a 14 year period, a wing engine is totally useless in this environment because you can't push against a 6knot tide with a 5hp nailed to the back of either a 21footer as I first had then a 28 footer. I couldn't carry enough gasoline to make it home. On the occasion I had a problem I called a mate and got a tow. I was completely prepared with a life raft, flares, spare radio, back up GPS, impellers, belts, spare props. Oars are completely useless in this situation. So I spend the time effort and money to make sure my single engines were properly serviced and they never missed a beat. The only problem I had was duff battery, a mate one had a single fail to start and that was dirty fuel. I know no one that has suffered a catastrophic engine failure.
So to say I am unprepared because I chose not to fit a wing engine is stupendously dumb. I actually could inflate my tender and lash that to the side of the boat inside 10 mins but as I said pointless in these tides. Action would be in a failure situation, anchor down, call a mate or RNLI, get beer and wait.
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OKBoater
New Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Near disaster in the Bristol Channel
"The Chief Engineer, Jack Giles, had just relieved me after the morning watch when, suddenly, there was a big bang. I rushed to the engine room to find that one of the paddle wheels had sheered. With the cliffs of Illfracombe approaching and with no other form of propulsion, it was a time for saying prayers."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/wales/entries/28520fa5-bba7-36d8-851a-18e692a0dc89
hmmmmnnn I am a little rusty on my biblical knowledge...what kind of horsepower do prayers get you exactly?
Crossing channel in single engine boat
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?473002-Crossing-channel-in-single-engine-boat
Near disaster in the Bristol Channel
"The Chief Engineer, Jack Giles, had just relieved me after the morning watch when, suddenly, there was a big bang. I rushed to the engine room to find that one of the paddle wheels had sheered. With the cliffs of Illfracombe approaching and with no other form of propulsion, it was a time for saying prayers."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/wales/entries/28520fa5-bba7-36d8-851a-18e692a0dc89
hmmmmnnn I am a little rusty on my biblical knowledge...what kind of horsepower do prayers get you exactly?
Crossing channel in single engine boat
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?473002-Crossing-channel-in-single-engine-boat
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MapisM
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
In principle, I avoid classifying people as trolls, Cliff Clavins, sea lions or whatever just based on a few posts - and even more so when they are their very first ones.
But frankly, it seems to me that you are doing your best to be called Happy2.
Which maybe doesn't tell you a lot (unless you are actually the very same person who used to post as Happy1...), but trust me, that's not the best way to introduce yourself in a forum anyway.
Let me recap:
1) in your first thread your asked a suggestion about the type/power for a small get home outboard.
2) then you posted this one, asking whether it makes sense at all to have one or not.
So far so good, if it weren't that after saying that...
3a) you are "new to boating";
3b) you already asked to other boaters who dismissed the idea;
3c) you see "very few boats with kickers";
… you introduced your question saying that in your opinion "no backup motor seems reckless".
Then, during the debate, you got some feedbacks in favour and others against - not exactly surprising in any forum, I reckon.
Otoh, none of the contributions given affected your initial view in the slightest, as I understand. Fairenuff.
But now, you are pretending to convince us all that boaters in the "against" camp are reckless, as you said at the beginning, and this is beyond a joke.
So, I’ve got news for you, if you don't mind.
Whether you are posting your ironical comments as the one I quoted because you are actually an o/b dealer, or just for self-affirmation, it doesn't really matter.
Nobody around here cares one jot about your view, and nobody will change his/her opinion because of yours.
If you feel safer with a kicker, get it, and happy boating. It's that simple.
Next question?
Now listen, OKB.
In principle, I avoid classifying people as trolls, Cliff Clavins, sea lions or whatever just based on a few posts - and even more so when they are their very first ones.
But frankly, it seems to me that you are doing your best to be called Happy2.
Which maybe doesn't tell you a lot (unless you are actually the very same person who used to post as Happy1...), but trust me, that's not the best way to introduce yourself in a forum anyway.
Let me recap:
1) in your first thread your asked a suggestion about the type/power for a small get home outboard.
2) then you posted this one, asking whether it makes sense at all to have one or not.
So far so good, if it weren't that after saying that...
3a) you are "new to boating";
3b) you already asked to other boaters who dismissed the idea;
3c) you see "very few boats with kickers";
… you introduced your question saying that in your opinion "no backup motor seems reckless".
Then, during the debate, you got some feedbacks in favour and others against - not exactly surprising in any forum, I reckon.
Otoh, none of the contributions given affected your initial view in the slightest, as I understand. Fairenuff.
But now, you are pretending to convince us all that boaters in the "against" camp are reckless, as you said at the beginning, and this is beyond a joke.
So, I’ve got news for you, if you don't mind.
Whether you are posting your ironical comments as the one I quoted because you are actually an o/b dealer, or just for self-affirmation, it doesn't really matter.
Nobody around here cares one jot about your view, and nobody will change his/her opinion because of yours.
If you feel safer with a kicker, get it, and happy boating. It's that simple.
Next question?
OKBoater
New Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Here is an example of no kicker engine leading to being shipwrecked on an island in Bristol.
https://www.mby.com/news/man-rescued-from-lonely-island-in-bristol-channel-33219
So to recap then, a kicker is a bad idea until you actually need one. Got it. Me thinks boaters should be self sufficient enough to handle an engine breakdown without the aid of others. IF they do require
aid such as the coast guard then they should be billed for the cost of the rescue...similar to British Columbia where if skiiers ski out of bounds and get stuck or lost...they are also stuck with the rescue bill. I have no problem with people being reckless just so long as they don't expect others to bail them out.
Now listen, OKB.
In principle, I avoid classifying people as trolls, Cliff Clavins, sea lions or whatever just based on a few posts - and even more so when they are their very first ones.
But frankly, it seems to me that you are doing your best to be called Happy2.
Which maybe doesn't tell you a lot (unless you are actually the very same person who used to post as Happy1...), but trust me, that's not the best way to introduce yourself in a forum anyway.
Let me recap:
1) in your first thread your asked a suggestion about the type/power for a small get home outboard.
2) then you posted this one, asking whether it makes sense at all to have one or not.
So far so good, if it weren't that after saying that...
3a) you are "new to boating";
3b) you already asked to other boaters who dismissed the idea;
3c) you see "very few boats with kickers";
… you introduced your question saying that in your opinion "no backup motor seems reckless".
Then, during the debate, you got some feedbacks in favour and others against - not exactly surprising in any forum, I reckon.
Otoh, none of the contributions given affected your initial view in the slightest, as I understand. Fairenuff.
But now, you are pretending to convince us all that boaters in the "against" camp are reckless, as you said at the beginning, and this is beyond a joke.
So, I’ve got news for you, if you don't mind.
Whether you are posting your ironical comments as the one I quoted because you are actually an o/b dealer, or just for self-affirmation, it doesn't really matter.
Nobody around here cares one jot about your view, and nobody will change his/her opinion because of yours.
If you feel safer with a kicker, get it, and happy boating. It's that simple.
Next question?
Here is an example of no kicker engine leading to being shipwrecked on an island in Bristol.
https://www.mby.com/news/man-rescued-from-lonely-island-in-bristol-channel-33219
So to recap then, a kicker is a bad idea until you actually need one. Got it. Me thinks boaters should be self sufficient enough to handle an engine breakdown without the aid of others. IF they do require
aid such as the coast guard then they should be billed for the cost of the rescue...similar to British Columbia where if skiiers ski out of bounds and get stuck or lost...they are also stuck with the rescue bill. I have no problem with people being reckless just so long as they don't expect others to bail them out.
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Once you are done here, are you also going to convince all those neighbors of yours that they are as reckless as many of us?
And that they should also refuse blood transfusions, maybe...?
Neither do I, but I don't like being called reckless from someone who doesn't remotely understand what sort of behavior can be reasonably qualified as such.
Once you are done here, are you also going to convince all those neighbors of yours that they are as reckless as many of us?
And that they should also refuse blood transfusions, maybe...?
wakeup
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
As I said before a kicker would not have helped much at all if he was taking on water. 2 engines at the bottom of the channel as opposed to one.
More fish from the bucket
As I said before a kicker would not have helped much at all if he was taking on water. 2 engines at the bottom of the channel as opposed to one.
More fish from the bucket
prv
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
This is starting to sound rather reminiscent of the Brent Swain thread over in Scuttlebutt
Pete
This is starting to sound rather reminiscent of the Brent Swain thread over in Scuttlebutt
Pete
OKBoater
New Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
"his engine died and the vessel began taking on water"
Clearly he began taking on water because of loss of maneuverability due to the engine failure.
"his engine died and the vessel began taking on water"
Clearly he began taking on water because of loss of maneuverability due to the engine failure.
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longjohnsilver
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Only an idiot, or more likely a drunk, would go out in a 12’ speedboat into the Bristol Channel at 06-30. I should imagine his boat became swamped, so an auxiliary engine would only have increased the weight and thus the speed of sinking.
Only an idiot, or more likely a drunk, would go out in a 12’ speedboat into the Bristol Channel at 06-30. I should imagine his boat became swamped, so an auxiliary engine would only have increased the weight and thus the speed of sinking.
Whippersnapper
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Don’t feed the troll.
Don’t feed the troll.
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
You assume not having a kicker motor is reckless even though many on here and most of the boaters around you think otherwise. You need to learn to listen to others.
It may be news to you but you are not always correct
You assume not having a kicker motor is reckless even though many on here and most of the boaters around you think otherwise. You need to learn to listen to others.
It may be news to you but you are not always correct
sorabain
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Why just have 1 kicker? That sounds reckless, what if that kicker fails? I think you need at least 1 more kicker engine than you've ever heard anyone else carrying, because then you're undeniably the best boater in the world.
Why just have 1 kicker? That sounds reckless, what if that kicker fails? I think you need at least 1 more kicker engine than you've ever heard anyone else carrying, because then you're undeniably the best boater in the world.
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
benjenbav
Well-Known Member
Or a KCS. Many people think better two than one...
ari
Well-Known Member
Re: Emergency kicker engine Yay or Nay?
Interesting that you mention Happy 1, given a comment (and name) I noticed on this video https://youtu.be/RDx4jREoz5M
Coincidence?
Interesting that you mention Happy 1, given a comment (and name) I noticed on this video https://youtu.be/RDx4jREoz5M
Coincidence?
Bigplumbs
Well-Known Member
Blue Sunray
Well-Known Member
jfm
Well-Known Member
A large majority of the zillions of cargo ships incl supertankers that travel around the globe have one engine. How reckless of them not to hang a verado kicker on a bracket at the back.
Happy1 will now link to a cargo ship that crashed due to single engine failure, which I don't doubt has happened at some point in history.
Happy1 will now link to a cargo ship that crashed due to single engine failure, which I don't doubt has happened at some point in history.
MapisM
Well-Known Member
LOL, yeah. Otoh, we might as well reply with some links to accidents involving multiple engines boats!
And then debate till the hell freezes over...
PS: very nice find from ari. I would call it correlation, rather than coincidence...
And then debate till the hell freezes over...
PS: very nice find from ari. I would call it correlation, rather than coincidence...