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Sail reduction single handed

andlauer

New member
Joined
15 Mar 2007
Messages
310
Location
Paris France
Bonjour
When single handed, as but more than full crewed, the sail reduction must be done on a very conservative manner.
When you are trapped in an oversail situation you don't have other choice than a nice hard work for half an hour or an hour.
If something jams (Murphy's law) it becomes worse and you just get exhaused.
Of course, the wind will increase and you'll have to go for an other sail reduction... still oversailed... but exhausted.... but you are still the only one to do the job!

The only positive think, then, is that it will last less than the income!
Eric
/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 

helixkimara

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6 Nov 2007
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303
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North East
Eric I value your advise (Doesn't mean to say I'll take it)
But
I'm sticking to hanked on foresails on my fractional rig Twister.

Do you think I'm mad ?

My thinking is:
Allot of windward sailing to the Azores so better sail shape on reduced sail.
Don't need an inner forestay for my storm jib.
Can dump all the foresails if it gets really sh-ty
Less likley to jamb.
Can't afford £2000 for roller reefing and new sail so talked myself into the above.

AS AGAINST.

Much easier foresail handling in "normal" conditions
 

andlauer

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15 Mar 2007
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310
Location
Paris France
Bonjour
On Sterenn there's a Tuffluff (a sort of plastic gorge around the forestay the sail is sliding into) and it was already very old when I bought the boat.
It is probably the most demanding on single handed because the sail is not hold until it is hoisted.
I used to ease, in order to mask the sail behind the mainsail, before changing headsail or conduct sail in sail change, like racing crew.

So if you are mad, I'm worse ! (Not an unreasonnable hypothesis) /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I would not have a furling genoa because I consider that it induces too much drag in realy bad condition and that they have an awfull baggy shape when half furled. I also consider that there is no real good way to instal a storm jib with a furling genoa. (It is not a comonly shared position!).

A good compromise would be to have classical jibs hocked to the forestay.(easy, cheap and robust!)
Eric /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 

kds

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21 Nov 2002
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1,770
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Somerset
This comment suprises me !


"AS AGAINST.

Much easier foresail handling in "normal" conditions "

You must surely be aware that in recent years large numnbers of serious sailors have handled furling gear with success in far worse than "normal" conditions. It is standard fitting on solo "round the World" racers.
Can't pretend that I have never had problems getting in the old "hanked on" foresails in heavy conditions.
Ken
 

helixkimara

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6 Nov 2007
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North East
Yes Ken I take your point and agree. I suppose it depends on what we call “normal” conditions.
I would say that it would be” normal” mid Ocean, given the location and time of year to have a force 10 or above a small percentage of the time.

As I mentioned I am convincing myself as I can’t afford the £2000 for new gear.

Possibly also by an experience I Had. Are you sitting comfortably?

1993, September storm in the Bay of Biscay. 4 ½ days (Its well documented)
Force 11 violent storm, huge breaking waves. We were in a 51 ft. sloop.
Sea water got into the fuel tank and engine wouldn’t start. After 2 days batteries died so had no power. The deep reefed main sail had blown out earlier in about F9, in a gust. The well reefed foresail ripped earlier in the same gust. We needed to reduce windage as we were surfing up to 22 knots with lines out. We needed to get the foresail down but could not without unfurling it. It was jammed solid.
Eventually, after 4 ½ days we limped into Gion, Northern Spain under a tinny piece of foresail. Any more than that, there was a huge rip. A small pilot boat came to us ¼ of a mile out and towed us to the harbour wall. We had not called for assistance, we had no radio working. We had flares at the ready but did not need to use them.

2 Yachts were lost with crew in that storm.
One yacht, about 26 foot, was found a day latter and towed in with no one on board. Its reefed sails were set but ripped and it was in sound condition.

Our yacht “First Experience” had only sail and engine damage. All crew save with minor cuts but some good bruises. 4 of the crew were white and drained with sea sickness. The Skipper and I were fine.

Please note that the above is a very “shortened” account so please don’t pick fault. The lessons have been learned.

Convinced myself even more now. HANKS THANKS !
 

andlauer

New member
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15 Mar 2007
Messages
310
Location
Paris France
Bonjour
----
serious sailors have handled furling gear with success in far worse than "normal" conditions.
----
I consider that F10 or 40kts mean wind, could be a nice working hypothesis for our games.

There are two types of furling jibs.

One allow to furl only part of the jib and is suppose to be used in all weather conditions. They are commonly used on cruising boats.

The other one is used to stock sails and allow only furl or unfurled conditions. These are used on offshore single handed or fully crewed racing boats. Usually they have several (often 3)permanent furled jib one behind the other. They may be removed (but one of course) in severe conditions. The other jibs are stored on removable furling systems. (see the Karver (missspell Carver) link on the "rigging" post).

I'm convinced that we should have several jibs (I have and use: a genoa, a solent, an ORC, a storm jib, a normal spinaker and a heavy spinaker (Probably too manny for the JC)) on board. That is the important thing.

Furling, shank, tuffluff or babystay choice is only a second issue.
Eric /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
Joyon
 

jesterchallenger

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Joined
7 May 2007
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134
Location
River Orwell
The trouble is a furling genoa needs to be No1 size for light airs, but heavy enough to cope with stronger winds when furled. Hence you have a light-airs sail that is too heavy but then gets baggy as soon as you have a few rolls in it. In my experience the windward ability of an average furled genoa in say, F6-7, is about 15 degrees worse per tack than the equivalent hank-on sail. So tacking through 130 degrees instead of 100 (assuming you're sailing a bit free to get through the rough sea), which means by simple application of trigonometry that the hank on sail is achieving a vmg over 50% better than the furled sail. And because the hank on sail is flatter, the boat is heeled less. Yes, it's a complete pain to have to struggle with a headsail change on the foredeck in rough weather (my fastest time is about 3 minutes, but when it all goes wrong it can take 20 minutes), especially when you get back to the cockpit and realise you need to do another change straightaway, but...only a small percentage of your sailing time is actually spent changing headsails and it's great to point higher and faster and be more comfortable. And finally the technology of hanks is pretty much foolproof. I also have a second (detachable) forestay so that I can fly twin headsails downwind when it's too hairy for the big spinnaker, although I would anticipate mainly headwinds on the way down. I expect all the skippers with junk rigs are having a good laugh at all these discussions!
 

cnh

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Joined
18 Oct 2003
Messages
372
It's not impossible to change a furling jib. Why not have one large, one small, and change them over if you have to? Changing a furler is not that much more difficult that changing a hanked. The only hassle is feeding it into the groove [get a pre-feeder].

That's what I did when I went to the Azores in '98.

My account of the trip: Azores trip

Nicholas Hill
 

helixkimara

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6 Nov 2007
Messages
303
Location
North East
Nicholas, great account of the Azores trip. Just printed it off to read again with a hot drink for bed. Hope your on the JAC08.
Respect.
 
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