Your advice on boat-buying and selling: YM feature

R

Rob MBM Editor

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www.motorboatsmonthly.co.uk
Hi there

Yachting Monthly is planning a feature on buying and selling your yacht.

We've got lots of different readers' experiences lined up but we want more! We’re keen to hear your advice and tips on buying and selling.

What we’re interested in are the essential dos and don’ts, as well as the things nobody tells you, things that you only gain through hard-won experience.

Do you have interesting stories/anecdotes to share about buying or selling your yacht – privately or through a broker?

If you’d like to PM me or post here, we’ll print your best advice within the magazine feature.

Many thanks in advance for all contributions

Rob
 
1 - clean up the boat - remove all personal items
2 - look at the boat and think "would I buy this" ... if you can't achieve an objective view on this then ask a friend who doesn't know the boat well to look over it for you. Be prepared to receive negatives and act on them if possible.
3 - if selling through a broker - find an active one - personal recommendation is best (mine sat for 6 months with a useless broker - no feedback or movement - moved to an active broker and sold within 1 month)
4 - check the photo quality used to promote your boat - try to use current photos rather than old shots.
5 - If selling over winter then consider a dehumidifier to prevent damp feeling
6 - Check the operation of the kit you're advertising with the boat - remove it from the listing if it doesn't work - or repair/replace it
7 - Keep the boat clean .... especially the inside. ....
8 - Keep the boat clean .....
9 - Keep the boat CLEAN

There u go - 9 point plan! :D
 
Clean!

fireball said:
1 - clean up the boat - remove all personal items
2 - look at the boat and think "would I buy this" ... if you can't achieve an objective view on this then ask a friend who doesn't know the boat well to look over it for you. Be prepared to receive negatives and act on them if possible.
3 - if selling through a broker - find an active one - personal recommendation is best (mine sat for 6 months with a useless broker - no feedback or movement - moved to an active broker and sold within 1 month)
4 - check the photo quality used to promote your boat - try to use current photos rather than old shots.
5 - If selling over winter then consider a dehumidifier to prevent damp feeling
6 - Check the operation of the kit you're advertising with the boat - remove it from the listing if it doesn't work - or repair/replace it
7 - Keep the boat clean .... especially the inside. ....
8 - Keep the boat clean .....
9 - Keep the boat CLEAN

There u go - 9 point plan! :D
Click to expand...

Hard to improve on such a great and concise list... as to cleaning it out completely and cleaning it up... completely. Just Do It.
Remember that a boat filled with your stuff is not perceived as being "for sale." Nothing aboard that is not clean and transferring with the boat. Interior should be empty. Lockers especially. Just remember that your "used" boat is the buyers "new" boat -- new to them anyway.
A tip: clean the whole bilge 'til it is dinner plate clean and odorless. This just impresses the heck out of brokers and buyers. (Partly because they have been aboard and rejected so many dirty smelly boats already.) It's like the Curb Appeal that realtors talk about.
And read that 9 Point Plan again !
 
PerformanceSailor said:
Hard to improve on such a great and concise list... as to cleaning it out completely and cleaning it up... completely. Just Do It.
Remember that a boat filled with your stuff is not perceived as being "for sale." Nothing aboard that is not clean and transferring with the boat. Interior should be empty. Lockers especially. Just remember that your "used" boat is the buyers "new" boat -- new to them anyway.
A tip: clean the whole bilge 'til it is dinner plate clean and odorless. This just impresses the heck out of brokers and buyers. (Partly because they have been aboard and rejected so many dirty smelly boats already.) It's like the Curb Appeal that realtors talk about.
And read that 9 Point Plan again !
Click to expand...

Its a well known fact that anyone approaching their boat with a tin of danbolin bilge paint will soon have their boat on the market :)

As a buyer - first impressions do count.

Old tatty leather covered wheel? strip it off or get it fixed!
Dried out tatty lines and sheets just make things look awful.
Organised documentation is a sign of a bit of care going in to things.
The boat may not have or be required to have an 'owners manual' but if you have one for an older boat it speaks volumes.

Make it warm in winter, cool and airy in summer , a warm loaf of bread and a cup of coffee are old estate agents tricks but ........

silly things like a log of past adventures left in the nav table.

As someone else has said, if its on the boat it should be part of the sale.
 
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When selling:
- be realistic about your asking price
- reply promptly to any enquiries - whether by phone or e-mail. Every contact is a potential buyer. Ignore at your peril.
- don't make false claims - visited many a boat 'only requiring some TLC' to find a major restoration project when I had travelled long distances to view the boat.
- get as many - recent - pictures on-line as possible. (take Boatshed as an example)
- keep boat in sail-away condition - IMHO boats stuck on the hard deteriorate a lot very fast
- clean (and keep cleaning) the boat. Or even better, let your wife do it - what may seem clean to men, does not always seem clean to women.
- when potential buyers are a couple - don't underestimate or ignore the wife. Also see point above
- have all boat documentation (kit manuals, invoices, registration docs, ... ) to hand.
- be honest

When buying:

- when you make an appointment to view a boat: TURN UP. When you can't make it, give more than 30 mins notice.
- be prepared - do your research - know what you want
- be realistic in your expectations
- don't rub the seller up the wrong way
- be honest
 
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Agree totally with clean it up.

Looking over 1 yacht both SWMBO and I were put off more than somewhat by finding used male underwear strewn on a bunk. Boat looked as if someone had had a really rough passage and had sworn never to set foot on a boat again and had changed out of sailing clothes, jumped off and slung the keys at the broker, maybe they had?

Do all the small jobs: found one boat with parts of the vinyl bulkhead covering hanging down, a bit of evo-stick would have sorted it.

If you are keen on PBO DIY bits, make sure they are done to a good standard, the radar screen that swung out on a hinged piece of wood was OK as a concept, but the wood and hinge were both tatty. I also banged my head on it, which didn't help.

Clean the bilges, after a little they smell. A touch of fresh water and fairy liquid wil have them nice if it's just sea water, if it's diesel then a bit more vigor is needed.

Smell is very important: some boats reek of diesel and damp berth cushions,very offputting.

Make sure the boat has a heater, a nice warm boat when you are looking around on a winter's day is very attractive, a cold clammy one is horrid. Bought our first boat with a favourable first impression - someone cared enough to keep it dry.

First impressions count for a lot: a smart, warm dry boat is far more attractive than the opposite and tempts you to stay and have a good look round and starts to sell itself. Then you get to thinking that if the boat has been this well looked after when for sale she has probably been looked after by her previous owner. In spite of the rose coloured spectacles, get a survey!
 
When buying:
1) Engage a surveyor as early as possible, even before you have decided on a particular boat. They know what is happening in the market, "actual" sale prices, things to look out for on particular makes etc. (Make sure their business is registered in your country of residence. It is far cheaper to fly a good UK surveyor out than to try and sue a foreign one later on.)
2) Depending on the cost of your purchase, engage a marine solicitor. This will help with questions around contracts, deposits, final payment; and ensure that your interests are looked after from a legal perspective. They will also be invaluable if buying outside your country of residence. (Remember the seller is there to sell his boat, the broker is there to make money; neither of these two have your interests as their top priority.)
3) Have the seller provide a concise inventory list. And check it, when you first view the boat and when you go to take posession.
4) Check everything is working correctly, even if this takes a whole day or more.
5) Have an out of water survey;
6) Take the boat out for a sail;
7) Do as much research as possible. Speak to the manufacturer, the in country dealer, any onwers clubs. If possible charter one to make sure that the compomises you are about to make are the right ones.
8) If any work needs to be done, either make the owner do it, and have it approved by your surveyor or if you are going to take it on, get quotes, at least two-three.
9) Haggle on the deal, always haggle. If you don't feel confident doing it, have somebody do it on your behalf.
10) Do not be rushed. Take your time, you are the one with the money.

And don't forget to have fun :)

Anything else?

(As you might guess, I have had a rather expensive lesson in buying boats!)
 
If selling through an online broker, ensure the search facility works before handing over your money! YBW's doesn't - well it does if you know a specific boat is for sale and if you know if it's for sale through a broker or privately, or if you have the YBW reference number but most prospective buyers will just be searching generically within a price band or some other criteria.

I also think (crabby today aren't I?) that if the boats priced right, having it clean and tidy and with everything working is a tad idealist! Unless I'm looking for a boat that's pristine and prepared to pay the price then I don't mind a bit of boaty mess etc if the equivalent pristine boat price is 20% more. In any case it depends on the boat, selling a £500k 5 year old boat boat I probably would expect clean and tidy with all systems working but not if I'm buying a £1500 30 year old boat.

Cheers, Brian.
 
In any case it depends on the boat, selling a £500k 5 year old boat boat I probably would expect clean and tidy with all systems working but not if I'm buying a £1500 30 year old boat.
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Ah - I said clean - that doesn't mean pristine ... just brush/wash the boat through - a deep clean ...

And if you're advertising kit then it should be working - unless you state it isn't ... no point stating it's got a Navtex if the thing doesn't work ... it just pisses the buyer off ... either remove it from the listing or just state - not working ... pretty much like you have done on your listing ...
The point about recent photos is partly justified by your gallery showing two different types of Navpod at the wheel ... but was actually made when we viewed a boat at Deacons yard - the pictures showed a nice boat in use ... the reality was a boat that had been badly laid up and left - damp, dirty and in need of significant amounts of work.
 
To my mind it is really important when buying through a broker to meet the owner and get as much info from them about exactly how all the systems work- get them to show you how. This saves a lot of time/money later when something doesn't perform as expected eg oil pressure gauge drops to whatever after 30 mins of running. I bought a boat without meeting the owner- never again.
 
If thinking of buying a new boat, charter it first. No amount of glossy brochures and glossy sales patter will be half as informative as living on the boat of choice for a week or two.
 
Guapa said:
When selling:
- be realistic about your asking price- reply promptly to any enquiries - whether by phone or e-mail. Every contact is a potential buyer. Ignore at your peril.
- don't make false claims - visited many a boat 'only requiring some TLC' to find a major restoration project when I had travelled long distances to view the boat.
- get as many - recent - pictures on-line as possible. (take Boatshed as an example)
- keep boat in sail-away condition - IMHO boats stuck on the hard deteriorate a lot very fast
- clean (and keep cleaning) the boat. Or even better, let your wife do it - what may seem clean to men, does not always seem clean to women.
- when potential buyers are a couple - don't underestimate or ignore the wife. Also see point above
- have all boat documentation (kit manuals, invoices, registration docs, ... ) to hand.
- be honest
Click to expand...

Guapa has hit on the two points most sellers overlook.

For realistic pricing, do check out the achieved prices for your type of boat, not just the asking prices.
I would then suggest a thorough understanding of the contractual process is pretty vital to avoid expensive misunderstandings. Read up the RYA advice on the subject. For example, most buyers agree a price subject to survey, and then try to negotiate the price down after the survey. But in some contracts if a defect has been disclosed in the original particulars, this cannot then be used in the post-survey haggle.
Moral: be honest with your particulars, sensible with your asking price, use a good broker, and you should have a smooth transaction.
 
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