Writing a book using info gleaned from ybw

[tcm]

Long threads, meh.

IMHO only three things stand in the way of you using ybw as resource for your sailing book.

1 Copyright
This only becomes an issue if the posts are lifted verbatim. The information itself (albeit good/bad) can be paraphrased in all manner of ways. Not a big problem here at all.

2 Common courtesy
The OP (and others of course) in another thread should be treated with respect and in that regard it would be reasonable if anyone planning a book is open with their intentions. It is absolutely fine (as many have done) to say “I am writing a book and would appreciate your thoughts on the following...” In other words - don’t interview people without making that fact clear.

3 Your ability to write a book in the first place, and get it published.

Ay, there’s the rub. Main issue here is that there are so many godawful boaty books. I think that many contributors would prefer NOT to help add to that number unwittingly.

One of many examples is "Your First Atlantic Crossing" where the owner of a 30ft canoe-stern ferro boat recommends the same after discussing all the other materials ... and then later describes his "crew problems" enroute - a young male and female who seem to resent him on board because they fancy each other and he doesn’t realise it. Hilarious.

Even with good information, many books will still be awful. Because they are written badly and witlessly. So for instance, if you didn’t know that the sentence in the previous paragraph but one was from Hamlet (and a few sentences before/after) WITHOUT using Google, well then, you ought to think twice about inflicting your own efforts on others.

Likewise, if you didn’t know the meaning of the word “glean” in the subject line and that perhaps the most famous cultural use of this word is a painting called “The Gleaners”, Millet, Barbizon school etc - again, one might sensibly need to be a touch more knowledgeable in this general department, arts etc.

Yes, of course one might *easily* be able to write a book without this sort of wider ancillary or even superfluous knowledge but, gawd - it’s gonna be so depressing for the rest of us. And I’m sure that any writer would want the reading experience that they create to be wonderful, happy, intelligent, amusing - as well as informative?

So, I think it would be lovely for people to write a book - the more the merrier IF they write good books. And hopefully this will help.

 

[gavin_lacey]

No cos by the time I get round to reading and and witing posts on here there is a strong likeyhood that I will have drunk so much cheasp greek wine that I no longer care about spoling mistakes and grammatical errors let alone over sentimental posts.

 

[sailinglegend420]

IMHO only three things stand in the way of you using ybw as resource for your sailing book.......

I would add another - inaccurate information - which is often contradicting, misleading or with generalisations which only confuse!

Sadly there are many ignorant posters who sound convincing, BUT they are often expressing an opinion which is not based on fact or their own experiences.

Boat owners can often be very opinionated about what makes “their system” and "their way" right - maybe right for them but not always for others with different installations. Opinions vary widely on “best practice”; even industry experts such as Mr Calder and Mr Stirling hold widely differing views.

This is a great resource but readers often have to trawl through too much "information" in postings which have been hi-jacked or have drifted "off topic".

A plea to all posters - please be clear and concise - with relevant comments that you know to be correct. That will make it easy to copy and paste straight into my book.

If posters just want to rant please go to "The Lounge" or "Scuttlebutt".

 

[wklein]

Ay, there’s the rub. Main issue here is that there are so many godawful boaty books. I think that many contributors would prefer NOT to help add to that number unwittingly.

One of many examples is "Your First Atlantic Crossing" where the owner of a 30ft canoe-stern ferro boat recommends the same after discussing all the other materials ... and then later describes his "crew problems" enroute - a young male and female who seem to resent him on board because they fancy each other and he doesn’t realise it. Hilarious.

I couldn't agree more, in fact an extremely popular bluewater cruising guide springs to mind. This is what i did you could do it other ways but don't.

If anyone is looking for a very sensible bluewater cruising book that is as un-biased as i have found check out Blue Water Countdown by Jeff Pack.

 

[AndrewB]

If anyone is looking for a very sensible bluewater cruising book that is as un-biased as i have found check out Blue Water Countdown by Jeff Pack.

I also have "Blue Water Countdown", but though I greatly respect Geoff Pack, to me this book is everything that is wrong about the old, pre-internet approach to cruising advice.

Geoff Pack had comparatively restricted long distance sailing experience, and it shows. Some important topics are very much glossed over (and in that sense it is biased). Often the advice is dogmatic "this is the way to do it"; and at times he leans on outdated book knowledge as a substitute for practical experience. The one area where this book is first-class is in promoting catamarans as safe blue-water yachts.

I would guess that regulars on this forum have, collectively, over a million sea-miles of experience, in all sorts of craft, in all sorts of cruising ground, in all sorts of conditions. The advice given here is largely from people's own experience, not just a rehash of old lore. There is plenty of discussion of alternative approaches to problems, and it's up-to-date.

Of course, the advice here is by nature tips on something specific, rather than a systematic look at a whole topic, and in that respect should complement books and magazines. People offer advice from all levels of experience, and you might say some is better than others. But sometimes the best advice for you is that which you get from someone at a similar level of experience to yourself, who appreciates your problems, and not from the saltiest sea-dog. And yes, occasionally really foolish advice is offered, but it's not that difficult to spot and generally does tend to get slapped down.

 

[tcm]

"generally does tend to get slapped down"

ahem

 

[wklein]

I read it shortly after reading the Dashew's cruising encyclopedia which is at best a list of the most expensive kit available where anything under 45ft is roughing it.

I guess it is about the only book of its type where i have agreed with basically everything said. Also he started out in a virtually identical boat to my own so we obviously have similar priorities.

 

[whiteoaks7]

Long threads, meh.

IMHO only three things stand in the way of you using ybw as resource for your sailing book.

1 Copyright
This only becomes an issue if the posts are lifted verbatim. The information itself (albeit good/bad) can be paraphrased in all manner of ways. Not a big problem here at all.

2 Common courtesy
The OP (and others of course) in another thread should be treated with respect and in that regard it would be reasonable if anyone planning a book is open with their intentions. It is absolutely fine (as many have done) to say “I am writing a book and would appreciate your thoughts on the following...” In other words - don’t interview people without making that fact clear.

3 Your ability to write a book in the first place, and get it published.

I think there's a very important fourth point. If I offer an opinion into a forum I can expect it to be debated and criticised; argued until a consensus is reached. If you pick up my untested assertion and publish it you are promoting it as a fact because it it in your book. I would be very unhappy about this both from a contributor and a reader's viewpoint.

David Berry

 

[Tomahawk]

Factual accuracy

A common idea appearing here is that someone writing a book must be factually accurate in their writing.

It goes without saying that to publish prejudice as fact is generally not good behaviour. Unfortunately it appears that some people who use this forum consider they can both publish inaccurate comments, but also make accusations and have them treated as facts, to whit..... On first May andrewB made an accusation against a forum member.

I get the impression that there are currently people here asking repeated questions of the type that suggest they are compiling a publication based on the replies.

It appears that andrewB had someone in mind. However, the manor of his post invited salacious gossip and speculation. This is born out by the replies to the OP. That gossip turned into personal abuse as another forum members speculated as to who andrewB was acusing. Of course andrewB can say he did nothing wrong. He only asked a question at the end of his post. But there is no question mark in his first statement and his question was loaded, Please come out in public and admit you are writing a book or desist?

Then deuc02 put up a post which invited speculation on the personal circumstances of the accused. And off course such speculation then followed. Some of the comments could be humorous if they were anonymous, but when they are directed at a clearly identified person it is unwarranted.

Now we have lost Nostrodamus. This forum will be sadder for the loss. This leaves andrewB to free to sail away..

 

[tcm]

hum. You meant the "manner" of his post, not the "manor". I also think you meant that somehting was "borne out" not "born out", yes?

 

[jonic]

A common idea appearing here is that someone writing a book must be factually accurate in their writing.

It goes without saying that to publish prejudice as fact is generally not good behaviour. Unfortunately it appears that some people who use this forum consider they can both publish inaccurate comments, but also make accusations and have them treated as facts, to whit..... On first May andrewB made an accusation against a forum member.



It appears that andrewB had someone in mind. However, the manor of his post invited salacious gossip and speculation. This is born out by the replies to the OP. That gossip turned into personal abuse as another forum members speculated as to who andrewB was acusing. Of course andrewB can say he did nothing wrong. He only asked a question at the end of his post. But there is no question mark in his first statement and his question was loaded, Please come out in public and admit you are writing a book or desist?

Then deuc02 put up a post which invited speculation on the personal circumstances of the accused. And off course such speculation then followed. Some of the comments could be humorous if they were anonymous, but when they are directed at a clearly identified person it is unwarranted.

Now we have lost Nostrodamus. This forum will be sadder for the loss. This leaves andrewB to free to sail away..

Its become a storm in a teacup and now really out of hand if Nostro does leave. (Mind you loads of us have said that and been back a short time later-YBW is addictive )

But Andrew didn't pick it out of thin air, Nostro posted quite a few times a while ago asking how and if he could make money from a cruising book so Andrews post was not without foundation.

The thread got really daft though.

So what if he wants to write a book anyway? We'd probably all buy it. His blog is a good read.

 

[sarabande]

somehting

Ah, the dictation software picking up the brogue, then ?

 

[Conachair]

If I offer an opinion into a forum I can expect it to be debated and criticised; argued until a consensus is reached.

A consensus reached???

More chance of herding cats.

 

[Grehan]

This is getting - has got - bl**dy crazy.

 

[sarabande]

as with any decent craic it is covering philosophy, semantics, philology, logic, prejudice, antipathy, and plain bias. Lovely.


Chomsky rules.

 

[jonic]

as with any decent craic it is covering philosophy, semantics, philology, logic, prejudice, antipathy, and plain bias. Lovely.


Chomsky rules.

Bloody hell. I'm off to Tescos.

 

[deuc02]

At some point someone said there's a few precious people on here. Well said that man (or woman)

 

[NornaBiron]

as with any decent craic it is covering philosophy, semantics, philology, logic, prejudice, antipathy, and plain bias. Lovely.


Chomsky rules.

and spelling and grammar!

 

[Plomong]

1 Copyright
This only becomes an issue if the posts are lifted verbatim. The information itself (albeit good/bad) can be paraphrased in all manner of ways. Not a big problem here at all.

This appears correct to me. The information itself is not copyright, only the particular expression of it. I don't think that blending of items of information (not text: information or ideas) from these fora with information from many other sources could be considered a breach of copyright, so long as there is no lifting of verbatim or quasi-verbatim text or structure from the forum. However, to get a definitive answer on this we would need to hear the opinion of experts, probably best solicited over in The Lounge.

2 Common courtesy
The OP (and others of course) in another thread should be treated with respect and in that regard it would be reasonable if anyone planning a book is open with their intentions. It is absolutely fine (as many have done) to say “I am writing a book and would appreciate your thoughts on the following...” In other words - don’t interview people without making that fact clear.

If you are using the fora to interview people informally, then I feel you should be open about your intentions, just as you would in face-to-face situations.

I don't for one moment think the person mentioned in that other thread is interviewing people on these fora with a view to writing a book, so the above comment should not be construed as saying anything against him in particular.

Plomong

 

[KellysEye]

There is no reason somebody shouldn't write a book provided there are notes at the bottom of each page giving the number of the quote in the Appendix of all the contributors quoted. As seen in many other books.