Would a (gas) flame failure device work for oil?

[Kelpie]

I am looking to install a dripfeed diesel heater and would like to ensure that it is as safe as reasonably possible. I have already found that a fire safety valve, costing about £30, can be relatively easily added (this would stop the fuel flow in the event of a fire) so the next thing would be to add some sort of flame failure device, as commonly fitted to gas appliances.
You can get a gas flame failure device easily for about £15, but would this work as a valve for oil too?

 

[prv]

Surely flame failure with oil isn't dangerous anyway, just potentially messy if it went unnoticed for a very long time.

Pete

 

[Lon nan Gruagach]

I'm going to have a wild guess at this one...
Provided there is nothing in the FFD that rots in diesel, the problem as I see it is that gas appliances use small amounts of very very fluid fuel, whereas diesel is whole lot more viscous and just wont pass the (probably tiny) passage in the valve in quantities large enough for your stove.
Again, a guess that the gubbins are all metal and the only way to know is to try one.... whats the worst that can happen? the stove goes out due to not enough diesel.

 

[sarabande]

another guess.


If you are talking about a form of thermostat which prevents oil flowing in the supply pipe if it is activated by a fall in temperature at the burner, then there will have to be a bypass arrangement, otherwise you could not light the stove.



Lots of interesting ideas here

Fire valves

 

[duncan99210]

Looking at the manual for a Taylor's stove, there is mention of a thermocouple valve: you have to press in a knob during lighting until it is hot enough to allow fuel to flow. So there are valves out there designed to work with diesel rather the adapting a gas component.

 

[Kelpie]

Surely flame failure with oil isn't dangerous anyway, just potentially messy if it went unnoticed for a very long time.

Pete

It is far less dangerous than gas, you are right. What I want to prevent is the unstemmed flow of oil into a hot but extinguished burner, which will the cabin with nasty vapours. I would like to be able to leave the heater running overnight or unattended.

another guess.


If you are talking about a form of thermostat which prevents oil flowing in the supply pipe if it is activated by a fall in temperature at the burner, then there will have to be a bypass arrangement, otherwise you could not light the stove.



Lots of interesting ideas here

Fire valves

You wouldn't need a bypass, as the heater uses alcohol to pre-heat and you don't turn the fuel on until it is already hot.
Will check the link, thanks.

 

[Kelpie]

I'm going to have a wild guess at this one...
Provided there is nothing in the FFD that rots in diesel, the problem as I see it is that gas appliances use small amounts of very very fluid fuel, whereas diesel is whole lot more viscous and just wont pass the (probably tiny) passage in the valve in quantities large enough for your stove.
Again, a guess that the gubbins are all metal and the only way to know is to try one.... whats the worst that can happen? the stove goes out due to not enough diesel.

You may well be right, the aperture might be far too small.
The other thing that crossed my mind was that the temperature sensor might be unsuitable, as it may be calibrated for a different operating temperature.

 

[TSB240]

Most oil powered products use either the flame rectification principle or a photocell to detect for an established flame rather than failure. Time out will then either close feed valve or stop supply pump.

 

[DownWest]

A while back, I retro-fitted FFDs to gas stoves to comply with new rental regs. The thermocouple sensor provides a small current when hot that holds the gas valve open with an electromagnet. Pushing the button and holding, keeps the valve in contact with the EM until there is enough juice to hold it open. None of the bits would be restrictive to liquid and the pipes were around 6mm bore with flared joints.

 

[Kelpie]

A while back, I retro-fitted FFDs to gas stoves to comply with new rental regs. The thermocouple sensor provides a small current when hot that holds the gas valve open with an electromagnet. Pushing the button and holding, keeps the valve in contact with the EM until there is enough juice to hold it open. None of the bits would be restrictive to liquid and the pipes were around 6mm bore with flared joints.

Thanks! I take it the system is completely self-powered by the thermocouple itself then?
Do you know if they are all like this, or if it would only be certain makes or types?

 

[DownWest]

Thanks! I take it the system is completely self-powered by the thermocouple itself then?
Do you know if they are all like this, or if it would only be certain makes or types?

As said, this was a while back. But looking at a gas hob I installed yesterday (Electrolux), they are not much different. Just integrated with the gas control valve. The ones I bought were self powered by the thermocouple and a stand alone unit. The particular problem was the oven or grill, so I just cut into the tube after the fitted control valve and mounted the push button unit on the front panel. I had a local supplier (Algarve) who had all the bits and thermocouples at any length. Course, in the current H S & E climate, I wouldn't go near such a thing, but back then it was easier. No 'royal dogs' in sight

To add: IIRR all made in Italy.