Windvane v Tillerpilot

[mickshep]

I'm thinking of buying one of the above for our 32', 6 ton boat. First thoughts were to go for the electronic option, Now thinking about the vane, A friend has an old but tidy windpilot pacific for sale at a grand, seems a lot of money for a piece of kit that is at least 10 yrs old, or am I wrong? Cheers in advance, Mike


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[Guest]

Post deleted by danfoley

 

[Aramas]

Seems a question of convenience vs. reliability. The previous poster summed it up pretty well, but an additional point is that most autopilots can be integrated into systems so that the boat can be controlled with a laptop or gps from inside the cabin. You can weigh the convenience of having the boat sail herself around your preset waypoints against the prospect of long hours hand steering in the event of failure. If you love gadgets and don't venture far from civilisation, then an autopilot offers a lot more convenient solution. On the other hand, windvanes will just go and go, and in the event of damage, can usually be repaired anywhere, including at sea.


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[johnsomerhausen]

One point that Brian forgot to mention is that the "Pacific" is the most powerful of the Windpilots and you'd probably be "over-vaned" with it. The smallest model of Windpilot (forgotten the name) would probably be adequate for your boat. As both posts have mentioned, if you aren't going trans-oceanic, an autopilot will do the trick, though you'll have to trim your sails just right in order not to overpower it (I'm speaking here of the most basic tiller pilots like the TP100 - now TP 10 - or the Autohelm 1000)
john

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[bedouin]

You shouldn't put a TP10 or AH1000 on a 6 ton boat, at that size it really needs to tbe the AH4000.

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[Scillypete]

I think Fatipa has just about summed up the main points, but just to add, it takes me just a few seconds to set up and connect my windvane to steer which is quiet and uncomplaining until there is no wind, so even for short coastal trips the windvane is the first to be put into operation on my boat, I have even engaged it and sailed off my mooring very useful when shorthanded, we use the electric gobbling and ancient mini seacourse (possibly now 20 years old or more) only when motoring due to lack of wind.

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[charles_reed]

As a long-term, passage-making single-hander, I have both and they really perform different purposes.

The autopilot is used most of the time for coastal work, light winds, motoring and in heavy seas.
It's major disadvantage is it's power usage at between 2.5 and 4.8 amps.
It's major advantage is the accuracy of course steered, which transforms navigation (it's far better than any human helmsman).
Other disadvantages - it can't cope with quartering seas, shy reaching under spinnaker results in an endless series of broaches.

The vane pilot (a Navik) is wonderful under those (shy-reaching) conditions, better than any but the most skilful (national dinghy class) helms. It's ideal for off-shore passages, but totally unable to cope with surfing conditions, it steers an extremely effective course to maximise the set of the sails but, of course takes you off course for any variation in wind conditions.
It doesn't work in anything other than >8 knots of apparent wind and keeps on slipping its collision catch in anything over a seastate 6.

Your offer of the Pacific is an extremely good one, providing it is in good working order. The Pacific has a good reputation and is far more stoutly made than the Navik, but heavier and less likely to produce adequate servo effect in less than 3 knot hull speed. A new one is going to set you back £2.5K+.

A few words of warning about electric autopilots - all the manufacturers are excessively optimistic about the capabilities of their equipment, so you need to go to one that is rated for a much larger boat than yours; all the ones with an external keypad have the same fault, they leak and the PCB fries and cannot be recommended for serious mission-critical application.
Additionally the wheel steering ones, operating onto a drum on the wheel are for fair weather and easy seas – if you have wheel steering you need to go for the direct-to-quadrant type. As these set you back nearly the same as a vane gear the argument is further obscured.

For most an electric autopilot is the most sensible choice but if you’re contemplating extended short-handed offshore sailing the autopilot loses points to the vane gear.



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[charles_reed]

autopilot servo-assistance

There's so little in the difference in power consumption in light seastates that it's a waste of time/energy. In any case you'll probably be motoring so the question is probably academic.

However it might make considerable sense for heavy sea-conditions - the only problem is the pendulum paddle keeps on tripping on my rig and the TP1800 gave up the ghost...

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[johnsomerhausen]

Sorry, forgot to mention that my 29 footer displaces only 4 tons. But I've got both a Navik and the TP 100 (boat has gone to Europe and back to New York)
joohn

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[pwfl]

Just a correction to one of your other replies: the Pacific would be correct for your size of boat - the smaller one is the Pacific Light, which is for smaller boats than yours. The biggie is the Pacific Plus, which is a servo-rudder system. With regards the price, I would suggest a little negotiation, as £1000 would be a bit more than half the price of a new one, which seems a little steep for a 10 year old unit, particularly as I think they may have been developed somewhat within the last 10 yrs, & one that old may be a little dated.

(PS. see www.windpilot.de)

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