Wind speed v sail choice

[Alan_B]

Hi all,

I currently have a Hunter Europa which I regularly race within our sailing club. Having only had the boat for a few months there are an endless of things to adjust and sort out, buying a suitable sized spinnaker being a big priority.

Question is, with a main with two reeding points, a no1 and no2 genoa (hanked) I am not sure what is the best way to set up the boat for gusty days. Take last Saturday, it has maybe 15 knots, gusting 30. Put up number two and full main and she plodded on the very best, bar going downwind. I'm not going to switch to no1 for downwind sections of the course so what I was wondering was would I be better putting the no1 up and putting 1 reef in the main? My reason for thinking this is obviously if the boat heels too much we either take a lift or dump the main out slightly. So reducing the main will help us remain upright on a beat, and the no1 will help us keep up down wind. The no2 is significantly smaller to make a big difference downwind.

The other possibility is converting the no1 to roller furling instead of hanked on. Would this be beneficial of will the sail shape be ruined when beating and the sail partially furled?

On the other hand when I get my hands on a kite then the problems will be solved, but in general what would be the best way to rig the boat?

 

[Twister_Ken]

The general rule for racing set up is to select sails for power in the lulls, and feather through the gusts, playing the traveller.

Then, how good are your sails and their adjustments? If you can really flatten the main (backstay, kicker, outhaul, halyard, cunningham, flattener, sheet) you can take a lot of power out upwind, and put it back offwind by slackening tensions. With the genoa, you have backstay and halyard to play with in the same way, and you can move the sheet car aft to spill some power from the top of the sail.

Until you've got a kite, for downwind work you have the choice of poling out the genoa or gybing reach-to-reach, sailing as deep as you can without blanketing the genoa. Experimentation will show you which is fastest. I don't know how your foresheet lead is rigged, but offwind you might want to see if there's a way of moving the lead further forward and outboard, with a tweaker or a barber hauler.

 

[Alan_B]

The general rule for racing set up is to select sails for power in the lulls, and feather through the gusts, playing the traveller.

Then, how good are your sails and their adjustments? If you can really flatten the main (backstay, kicker, outhaul, halyard, cunningham, flattener, sheet) you can take a lot of power out upwind, and put it back offwind by slackening tensions. With the genoa, you have backstay and halyard to play with in the same way, and you can move the sheet car aft to spill some power from the top of the sail.

we have no Cunningham or flattener but do adjust backstay kicker and outhaul to suit the conditions. Maybe we are not adjusting them enough for gusty days. We have been out a few times and had to switch sails because we were having to dump the main far too often so could not hold a steady beat. Never considered how back stay effects the genoa, it's usually hoisted and cleated off tight. I know we are struggling with genoa car position the top tell tales are lifting first a lot of the time but I can't seem to adjust this out successfully every time. Sails are in very good condition.

Until you've got a kite, for downwind work you have the choice of poling out the genoa or gybing reach-to-reach, sailing as deep as you can without blanketing the genoa. Experimentation will show you which is fastest. I don't know how your foresheet lead is rigged, but offwind you might want to see if there's a way of moving the lead further forward and outboard, with a tweaker or a barber hauler.

Downwind the genoa is often poled out / goosewinged but with the number 2 it is such a small sail area we are defiantly loosing time

I think having only 2 on board doesn't help, 1 person on the rail leaves the helm with a fair bit of work to do.

 

[Seajet]

Wouldn't it be better to have the crew handling the headsail, kicker and outhaul etc, and both of you just sat to windward as high as poss in the cockpit ?

As for headsail choice I'd probably go for No.1 and reefed main.

 

[lw395]

Wouldn't it be better to have the crew handling the headsail, kicker and outhaul etc, and both of you just sat to windward as high as poss in the cockpit ?

As for headsail choice I'd probably go for No.1 and reefed main.

Europa is fractional rig?
A number 1 will be too much in the gusts, and the balance will be wrong.
I would prefer #2 and full main in every boat I've raced.
Particularly if you can flatten the main effectively-plenty of backstay.
Unless you are getting a vast yardstick allowance, you need a kite. Even a small kite will be a big gain.
A used kite from a biggish dinghy might be a cheap option for windy days.
A quality kite will help lots on reaches in medium wind, in a blow an old one is 99% good.

 

[Alan_B]

There are only two of us - me (usually crew) and helmsman. So after we tack or gybe and get the sails set I'm usually up on the high side, so any further adjustments are generally made by the helm. It's probably heavy enough weather for just two of us, a third person would be good but not always available.

We are racing white sail class at the moment, and we are actually win a few percent of the standard for our boat. We need to be faster though

Masthead rig on the Europa. I do have a flying fifteen spinnaker, but I was thinking it would be too small? We need one roughly 20ft leeches and 13ft foot which is proving hard to find second hand, and I'm not keen on spending £400 on a new kite this close to Xmas. Might throw the 15 kite up and see what happens.

I was wondering about the balance with no1 and reefer main. Surely more sideways action like this?

 

[William_H]

Especially as a newby to the boat I would say go for smaller jib. You can set up the reefing or at least I have on mine to be a lot quicker to put in or take out than a sail change.
So I would suggest you invest in a smaller jib. (no 3) . I certainly find on my light boat that with small jib it is under powered going down wind. So a spinnacker can get you going much better. It does need more than 2 people in any decent wind however.
if you stick with white sails racing (we call it JAM class for Jibs and main) then you will need to be able to pole out the jib. I have had some success with an additional jib sheet of light rope coming from a pulley on the toe rail and forward of the normal sheeting poiont for the small jib. This light sheet can be attached to the clue when needed or left on the clue to drag across when tacking. The light sheet will improve (widen) sheeting angle and take the sheeting point forward when reaching and can assist the goose winging of the jib without a pole when running.
I think you are far better slightly under canvassed in a decent wind 15 to 20 knots on the wind than over canvassed. A heeling boat will make leeway. A luffing mainsail just makes heeling drag when flapping. You need to beware of luffing the boat in a gust. I found you can get into a habit of luffing too much so slowing down. A log or GPS can help confirm you are maintaining speed on the wind. Of course excessive luffing can easily lead to being put about. So I advocate a little luffing in a gust coupled with dumping the mainsheet. I like to use a traveller to dump the main in the first instance.
Racing can be very good to sort out what works for you. If you can sail on the wind near a good sailor you will soon see what works. Lastly don't rush to fit a furler. Hank ons work so much better to windward IMHO. (30 seasons club racing so far in the same little boat) good luck olewill

 

[Stu Jackson]

Very open ended question. I ran across this recently, especially for a mast head rigged boat:

http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,7704.0.html

For racing on our masthead sloop, we use a 110% jib with a reefed main in those conditions. Our competition is often with 130% headsails or between that and ours. Sometimes we've had great success against them in heavier air.

 

[Allan]

I'm sure most people who have answered so far know more than me. I have crewed on a Trapper with a good,skipper. When the wind got up we would not use the spinnaker. Instead we had quite a large genoa and worked on our method of reefing the main for the windward legs. We did very well.
Allan

 

[Seajet]

There are only two of us - me (usually crew) and helmsman. So after we tack or gybe and get the sails set I'm usually up on the high side, so any further adjustments are generally made by the helm. It's probably heavy enough weather for just two of us, a third person would be good but not always available.

We are racing white sail class at the moment, and we are actually win a few percent of the standard for our boat. We need to be faster though

Masthead rig on the Europa. I do have a flying fifteen spinnaker, but I was thinking it would be too small? We need one roughly 20ft leeches and 13ft foot which is proving hard to find second hand, and I'm not keen on spending £400 on a new kite this close to Xmas. Might throw the 15 kite up and see what happens.

I was wondering about the balance with no1 and reefer main. Surely more sideways action like this?

It obviously depends on wind strength but most racers will try to set a larger genoa to get the aid of the luff length to windward; in this case I think a major point would be having the larger headsail to pole out as soon as turning off the wind.

Hard to get a Europa significantly out of balance, a very well mannered boat...