Wind Generators or Solar on Motorboat

[Fire99]

Hi all,

Electricity in our marina is due to rocket in price. Figures of around 50% and more rises to come, so I'm thinking practically on minimising electricity use at the marina. Now Bangor NI is a pretty windy place so it may lend itself towards a wind generator but solar technology seems to have moved on a great deal in recent years, and my sundeck could take a lot of panels. Also Wind Generators are a bit of a rarity on MOBO's..

So with electricity now becoming quite a premium, what are your thoughts on something like my Trader with the big sundeck roof. Wind or Solar?

cheers,

Nick

 

[Greg2]

Solar panels are a good option I think - plenty of mobos with them fitted and we will be looking to put some on the wheelhosue roof. I guess that you don’t usually see wind generators on mobos because they generally have more 12v or 24v power available than your average yacht and there may be issues when underway with higher speeds involved?

 

[Fire99]

Solar panels are a good option I think - plenty of mobos with them fitted and we will be looking to put some on the wheelhosue roof. I guess that you don’t usually see wind generators on mobos because they generally have more 12v or 24v power available than your average yacht and there may be issues when underway with higher speeds involved?

Thanks Greg.. I trained a little as sparky as a young lad so electrics i'm mostly ok with but solar and wind generators are a bit of a dark art for me. My concern about solar is that the reviews i've seen in cloudy areas (and let's face it, NI has a LOT of cloud ) have had pretty poor results. My experience of Bangor in the last 8 months or so have been sporadic sun but lots and lots of wind!! I only really run my Trader at a little faster than the average large yacht (10kts or so) so I did wonder about wind generation. My Trader boat neighbour has ordered TWO Rutland 1200 generators so it sparked my interest a bit. Plus the direction of electricity prices in the marine have made my eyes wobble!!

 

[Rappey]

I'm in portsmouth harbour and have both. Solar is amazing in the summer but the wind generates a lot more overall in the winter as 210w of solar on a nasty winters day fails to make an amp.
In an ideal situation a turbine mounted on the pontoon next to your boat would be ideal as you could just unplug and go.

 

[Fire99]

I'm in portsmouth harbour and have both. Solar is amazing in the summer but the wind generates a lot more overall in the winter as 210w of solar on a nasty winters day fails to make an amp.
In an ideal situation a turbine mounted on the pontoon next to your boat would be ideal as you could just unplug and go.

Thanks mate.. That's really helpful. What sort of output are you running on your wind generator? There seems to be a huge variance..

 

[jrudge]

Hurricane has added extensive solar - but like me he is in Spain.

In the Uk I suspect that given your cant fit many panels on a boat they would be good for keeping batteries topped up and maybe making the fridge last a few more hours on anchor but I would be sceptical you will get much more out of it.

Keeping batteries topped would allow you to disconnect from shore power when not on the boat which over time may produce a saving - not sure it would pay for the panels.

 

[Fire99]

Hurricane has added extensive solar - but like me he is in Spain.

In the Uk I suspect that given your cant fit many panels on a boat they would be good for keeping batteries topped up and maybe making the fridge last a few more hours on anchor but I would be sceptical you will get much more out of it.

Keeping batteries topped would allow you to disconnect from shore power when not on the boat which over time may produce a saving - not sure it would pay for the panels.

Thanks for that. I think the best answer is to relocate to Spain (or similar) but that's not too practical right now. The Trader has a pretty large aft deck roof that would fit some pretty sizeable solar panels but for me at the moment the real question mark is that I'm weather limited and solar still seems marginal in benefit when the weather is more inclement ..

 

[Rappey]

I have an old aerogen 4. Max 20A. I chose the aerogen as they are so quite compared to all the other "super quiet" turbines.
At a constant 12 knts it should give 300a/h per week, or 1.8 amps output. (Nearly 10 amps in 20knts)
I don't consume power when on my mooring so solar alone is enough but turbine is good at night when on board.
You can't go wrong with solar. Debatable whether a wind turbine versus cost would be worth it for you

 

[Fire99]

I have an old aerogen 4. Max 20A. I chose the aerogen as they are so quite compared to all the other "super quiet" turbines.
At a constant 12 knts it should give 300a/h per week, or 1.8 amps output.
I don't consume power when on my mooring so solar alone is enough but turbine is good at night when on board.
You can't go wrong with solar. Debatable whether a wind turbine versus cost would be worth it for you

Thanks Rappey. That's helpful. The decent wind generators are quite a premium but I spend a lot of time in the marina so may be looking at around £100 to £130 a month for electricity, with current rises, so I'm considering alternatives which are better longer term options. Also, at heart I like to anchor places (as I used to do on my little Snapdragon yacht back in the day) so a power option that doesn't involve the diesel generator would be a good one..

 

[Rappey]

Aerogen were discontinued a long time ago but they last at least 25 years, then just need new bearings. They can still be found on ebay and Facebook marketplace.
You could mount one on your upper steering position on a short pole so it's easy to remove when underway, providing you have somewhere to store it.
They output DC current so have just 2 wires.
Modern ones make a lot more noise and just don't seem to last very long.

 

[Fire99]

Aerogen were discontinued a long time ago but they last at least 25 years, then just need new bearings. They can still be found on ebay and Facebook marketplace.
You could mount one on your upper steering position on a short pole so it's easy to remove when underway, providing you have somewhere to store it.
They output DC current so have just 2 wires.
Modern ones make a lot more noise and just don't seem to last very long.

Thanks Rappey.. This is a steep learning curve for me here. One thing I have in my favour is some convenient mounting places around the upper helm. I'll have a nose around about the Aerogens..

 

[Rappey]

A whole new thread on "which wind turbine" would be like an anchoring thread. The chinese ones are cheap but a few have had their charge controlers catch fire or their bearings die in a very short time. I'm sure others keep working without issue though. Most seem very noisy
I would expect to pay around £150ish for an aero4gen with charge controller. It's around £22 to replace bearings and seals. I've seen folding ones on fb market but still not understanding how they fold or why.

 

[Fire99]

A whole new thread on "which wind turbine" would be like an anchoring thread. The chinese ones are cheap but a few have had their charge controlers catch fire or their bearings die in a very short time. I'm sure others keep working without issue though. Most seem very noisy
I would expect to pay around £150ish for an aero4gen with charge controller. It's around £22 to replace bearings and seals. I've seen folding ones on fb market but still not understanding how they fold or why.

Thanks Rappey.. Since this is my first dabble into the wind generator world £150 or so for a second hand one would be fine for me to have an experiment with. The price of the new Rutland ones that my friend has purchased, made my eyes roll. With the mounting brackets each one was more expensive than my entire Snapdragon boat cost me to buy.. !!

 

[Rappey]

I would suggest to let others give their thoughts on wind before rushing out and buying one as the above are my thoughts. Others may differ.
Could be a bargain? Never used old stock..
Wind generator, Aerogen (Marine) 12 volt Lvm412 | eBay

 

[Fire99]

I would suggest to let others give their thoughts on wind before rushing out and buying one as the above are my thoughts. Others may differ.

Yeah many thanks. But it certainly gives me a bit of understanding on the whole subject. The interweb is inundated with these kinda things for sale but I'm not serious enough to spend thousands but equally I don't want to buy junk. However, I'm happy to fix things so a decent second hand bit of kit I'm happy to play with bearings and wiring etc. I like a little project.

 

[colhel]

I would just fit something that'll keep the batteries topped up with minimal appliances running. I can't see there being a massive cost saving because when you're on board the electric usage will probably be too high for a solar or wind generator.
We have a solar panel which helps the batteries keep a fridge going. It is reassuring feeling being able to unplug the shore power when leaving the boat for a week or two.

 

[Fire99]

I would just fit something that'll keep the batteries topped up with minimal appliances running. I can't see there being a massive cost saving because when you're on board the electric usage will probably be too high for a solar or wind generator.
We have a solar panel which helps the batteries keep a fridge going. It is reassuring feeling being able to unplug the shore power when leaving the boat for a week or two.

Thanks Colhel. I probably have a similar aim. Keep the batteries topped up and the fridge cool whilst I'm away plus when on board I have full LED lighting so it would be nice to be able to have some onboard lighting that will be topped up from either wind or solar. This would definitely be beneficial when on a trip at anchor. It's nice to have a diesel generator but the flamin thing is a bit of a tractor when its running.

 

[Mistroma]

Last time I checked a wind gen. cost about 8-10 times the cost of solar for equivalent output in summer months. It was valid for Atlantic Spain down to the med. I haven't checked for many years but wouldn't expect the balance to have shifted much. Only fit a wind gen. after you have filled every spare spot with solar. Someone indicated that solar would really only produce a small amount of power in the UK. I guess it's all relative but even so, solar should outperform wind by a good margin in summer.

How much space do you have available for solar? Just approx. dimensions and whether any is suitable for rigid panels.

Rigid are cheaper and last longer than flexible or semi-flexible panels. I can give you a pretty accurate idea of average daily output per month if you can give some more information. i.e X sq. m suitable for panels or approx. dimensions of space available.

Just keeping batteries topped up only needs a fairly small panel.
Running a fridge is a big jump in current draw. e.g. 6A with a 25% duty cycle uses about 36Ah per day
However, you need to put a lot more in than you take out if using lead acid batteries. e.g. Fridge might use 20Ah at night and need >40Ah to get battery back to 100% during the day. Not a big problem with a genny, just run it in the morning to boost back to 85% SOC and leave solar to trickle back to near 100%. Also not an issue if you only spend 1-2 days at anchor and motor home. I usually live afloat for about 6 months and run a fridge 24x7 plus loads of other stuff.

I'm just using figures as examples. You might have a well insulated small top entry fridge or a large front opening model. All guesswork but only trying to show that it's more complex than just matching panel output and usage.

I've just noticed #7 where you mention £100 to £130 a month. I thought you were talking about maintaining a battery or just keeping a fridge running. The amount you mention is a completely different beast.

Even with 100% markup that's got to work out at 250-300Ah/day from a wind gen. or solar panel. You aren't going to get anything like that, even with both fitted.
Just go give a rough idea: You'd need 1000W panel in mid-summer, 2000W early and late season with 5,000W upwards in winter.

 

[Hurricane]

As Jrudge said, I fitted solar panels but as he also said, the boat is in Spain.
However, I didn't fit them to save electric running costs. I fitted them because we like to run the boat at anchor without the generator. The solution is to run the generator in the morning to top the batteries up but with lead acid batteries, they take less charge current the closer that they get to full, taking 6 to 8 hours to finish a charge. So we do a fast charge at breakfast for an hour or two and the solar panels finish the job at a slower rate ready for the next day's charge.

 

[jrudge]

Good luck running a fridge. They are the largest consumers of electric on most boats ( I have three ..!). Not only that but - captain obvious here - they run 24 hours a day. Solar will slow the drain but I believe no more than that.