Will Someone Please Talk Me Out Of This Expensive Refit Lunacy?

[Aigle d'Or]

I wasn't familiar with the Javelin and have just checked it out - nice boat! She looks fast to me and very pretty. Just my kind of boat!

Sounds like the Contessa and Javelin are very similar then. There's one just near me (actually there is only three of us up here with sails :disgust and sadly I have to accept the Contessa is a bit faster than me.
Perhaps its skipper is a better skipper........

 

[Robert Wilson]

I wasn't familiar with the Javelin and have just checked it out - nice boat! She looks fast to me and very pretty. Just my kind of boat!

:encouragement:

 

[[3889]]

slow? That is not my experience. They are average down wind with only white sails up (but fast with a spinnaker) but upwind or on a reach I am almost never overhauled by anything. And as it gets rougher, few stand a chance of getting anywhere near me. Often, on a windward cruise over 20 knots down the coast, I find I am only only boat under sail. Everyone else is motoring. And I'm usually going faster. They are a bit wet to windward but a good spray hood takes care of that. I'd rather sail than motor any day. Cramped? Well yes, but the boat was designed from the outside in not the other way around. Hull shape first, then accommodation. The genoa is easy with a 44 winch. If short tacking and it's a bit much, that probably means there's plenty of wind and you can furl some to make life easier. And you'll still be going fast.

And yet the Contessa has a slower handicap rating than a 26' Beneteau. To break out the clichéd car comparison, if you like Morris Minors then drive one but don't pretend they're a functionally better car than a Ford Mondeo.

 

[Lucky Duck]

And yet the Contessa has a slower handicap rating than a 26' Beneteau.

Sounds like a glorious future in yacht racing awaits him

 

[lw395]

And yet the Contessa has a slower handicap rating than a 26' Beneteau. To break out the clichéd car comparison, if you like Morris Minors then drive one but don't pretend they're a functionally better car than a Ford Mondeo.

Exactly so, and the Contessa rarely surprises anyone by performing above its rating. They are an OK boat from their era, but there does not seem to be much substance behind the way people talk them up.

 

[Aigle d'Or]

I know nothing about racing handicaps, but I've spent a lot of time at sea on passage and I know which boat I'd rather be on, and which would get me to my destination safely in all weathers and....first. Clue: It isn't a 26" Beneteau.

The car comparison is not helpful with yachts. Cars are all about technology and move on a predictable fixed surface. Yachts on the sea are entirely different. Bolt-keels are fine, as are spade rudders - so long as nature is kind to you and so long as you never go aground. They are nice and easy in harbour too, which is where they stay most of the time. I find flat-bottomed boats that are fast on flat water fall quickly behind when they encounter waves. I've sailed on many.

Show me the modern 32' boat with a sensible keel/rudder configuration that would out-sail a Contessa in a blow.

And yet the Contessa has a slower handicap rating than a 26' Beneteau. To break out the clichéd car comparison, if you like Morris Minors then drive one but don't pretend they're a functionally better car than a Ford Mondeo.

 

[Lucky Duck]

Show me the modern 32' boat with a sensible keel/rudder configuration that would out-sail a Contessa in a blow.

Your original claim was that nothing was faster, now it is only 32' boats with 'sensible keel/rudder configuration' - whatever that is.

 

[rotrax]

Getting back to the OP-if you like the boat, are prepared to spend the dough to indulge your whim, go for it.

No doubt you will have a fine vessel after the refit.

Just dont expect the value to increase in proportion to the money spent.

But I am sure you are aware of that..............................

 

[dunedin]

Re speed, interesting to compare actual times for something like the Round the (Southernj Island Race for CO32 versus slightly later generations (Fulamar 32, Elan 333) and modern AWB like a Bavaria 32.
I don’t have the data so don’t know what the elapsed times would be, but regarding boat speed and impact of longer waterline lengths might be interesting

 

[Aigle d'Or]

I was inviting you to suggest a modern boat with a strong keel/rudder configuration of similar size that would be a better boat than the one I have. I know bolt-on keels and spade rudders are the norm for weekend cruising and racing but I prefer a stronger set up - and I can't afford a Rustler 36.

and I was sharing my experience with modern yachts at sea. Of course there are faster 40 footers, but I don't want a 40 footer.

Your original claim was that nothing was faster, now it is only 32' boats with 'sensible keel/rudder configuration' - whatever that is.

 

[Lucky Duck]

Re speed, interesting to compare actual times for something like the Round the (Southernj Island Race for CO32 versus slightly later generations (Fulamar 32, Elan 333) and modern AWB like a Bavaria 32.
I don’t have the data so don’t know what the elapsed times would be, but regarding boat speed and impact of longer waterline lengths might be interesting

This year CO32s took between 9 and 10.5 hours to complete the course
Elan 333 between 8 and 9 hours
First 31.7 between 8.5 and 9 hours

Not so good for the Bavaria 34s - around 10.5 hours!

According to the website an Alacrity 18 Fin Keel took 9.5 hours

 

[Aigle d'Or]

that's very interesting. forgive my incompetence but how do you look up the type of yacht? i could only see Boat names. Am I being stupid? (wouldn't be the first time..)

This year CO32s took between 9 and 10.5 hours to complete the course
Elan 333 between 8 and 9 hours
First 31.7 between 8.5 and 9 hours

Not so good for the Bavaria 34s - around 10.5 hours!

According to the website an Alacrity 18 Fin Keel took 9.5 hours

 

[Lucky Duck]

There is an option to download the results in Excel format.

This has the each boat's class as well as name, then you can filter and analyse the results to our heart's content!

 

[Aigle d'Or]

thanks! I sense a lost afternoon approaching...

There is an option to download the results in Excel format.

This has the each boat's class as well as name, then you can filter and analyse the results to our heart's content!

 

[lpdsn]

Re speed, interesting to compare actual times for something like the Round the (Southernj Island Race for CO32 versus slightly later generations (Fulamar 32, Elan 333) and modern AWB like a Bavaria 32.
I don’t have the data so don’t know what the elapsed times would be, but regarding boat speed and impact of longer waterline lengths might be interesting

The RT(S)IR isn't a good guide for relative performance. It's a very tidally dominated race where many of the participants are not experienced racers and are just out for a slightly competitive cruise in company.

If the OP wants to win it he'd be better off with a very well-prepared Contessa 26 with a very good helm and crew. So be the best of the boats that are slow enough to get the optimal tides all of the way round. The Contessa 32 simply isn't quite slow enough.

 

[lw395]

To be exact, the CO32's rating isn't slow enough!
When I used to have a smaller boat we used to catch them.
Not that speed matters that much for a cruising boat.
Just leave earlier and relax on the way.

 

[doug748]

This year CO32s took between 9 and 10.5 hours to complete the course
Elan 333 between 8 and 9 hours
First 31.7 between 8.5 and 9 hours

Not so good for the Bavaria 34s - around 10.5 hours!

According to the website an Alacrity 18 Fin Keel took 9.5 hours

What you say is broadly true though seven CO32s finished under 9 hours.

Sigma 33s are 15 mins ish quicker. Elan 333 potentially 30mins and more. The faster 40 footers come in about 7 hours and less

Most of the "super fast modern boats" we read about on here are in reality perfectly unexceptional 9 to 10 hour boats - with the emphasis on the 10.

This is elapsed time

I hate to point this out because I have no time for "fast" boats myself, as a universal discriminator for cruising boats it is hopeless. However facts are facts.

 

[Frogmogman]

I've owned my Contessa 32 for 16 years and absolutely love her. She's taken us safely on many long cruises and my daughters grew up with her. To me, she is the perfect small yacht - fast, seaworthy, safe and beautiful. She's going to be 40 next year and I have found myself planning a major £40k birthday refit. I'm 54 and plan to keep her for as long as I am able to sail her. Re-wire, new rudder, new cabin sole, water tank, teak cockpit, re-spray decks and coachroof, solar power, shore power, partial new galley etc. Surely it's bonkers to spend this amount on a little yacht that's probably only worth £20k? Isn't it? So why am I even considering it? Help!

Like you, I'm a big fan of the Contessa 32, and for all the same reasons.

If you love your boat and plan to keep her for the long term, an extensive refit allowing you many more years of pleasure from her is not a bad shout.

Mind you, I agree with those posters who have suggested that you look at what's available on the market. There was recently a Co32 for sale in Malta which had had a fortune thrown at it, only for the owner's ill health to force a sale at far less than the amount already spent, IIRC an asking price of £45K.

Alternatively, there was a lovely looking restored S&S Swan 36 called Cécille on Lilley Marine's books for many months at a tad under £60K; all the charms of the Contessa 32 but even more so.

 

[dragonvc]

We raced in the RTIR in the same subdivision as the contessa 32 off .941 in a hydro 28v contessa at .943 in ISCthere were 7 in front of us and 19 behind us the first contessa was 20 min in front.The few with laminate sails in good condition were mostly fast despite our 3/4 rig we were faster on the spinnaker legs .As a test of speed there are good comparisons of boat speed when close to other similar boats in same wind but in places 50metres out in stronger tide can easily lose 100yds in a small amount of time.Looking at the results many of posters recommendations do not show up as well as their potential would suggest,perhaps the light winds round Ryde sands had a big effect on this years race with a very narrow strip to get out of the tide.So well sailed those Contessas in front of us but we are 4ft shorter and same vintage,the performance of the MGC27/Contessa 28 is equal to the 32.
However wether to go ahead and refurbish the Contessa I remember mooring alongside a Westerly Centaur in Weymouth which was heading west and this boat had had the full treatment and I admired this boat for its excellent condition but not a boat I wanted to sail.I would much prefer to sail a contessa 32 but others are higher up the list and I always admire old boats improved to better than new.Having rescued one wreck and enjoyed the experience with the resources available to theOPI would buy a more modern boat and a nonencapsulated keel and spade rudder would not worry me by their absence,it could even be an advantage thinking of the yacht blown ashore at cork remove the mast keel and rudder ,much easier to deal with!!