why do they sail with a man up the mast ?
- Thread starter simonfraser
- Start date
fireball
Well-Known Member
So they can spot wind gusts/shifts
Tamarisk1
Well-Known Member
you only need to know where jimi is to predict those!
bbg
Well-Known Member
Fireball got it in one - they typically only send someone up when going downwind, or in light and shifty airs upwind.
Permitted on AC boats, but generally NOT permitted in most racing under Rule 49.2 of the RRS.
Would also have a much larger negative effect on a smaller boat due to the weight aloft.
Permitted on AC boats, but generally NOT permitted in most racing under Rule 49.2 of the RRS.
Would also have a much larger negative effect on a smaller boat due to the weight aloft.
temptress
Well-Known Member
CREW POSITION
49.1 Competitors shall use no device designed to position their bodies
outboard, other than hiking straps and stiffeners worn under the
thighs.
49.2 When lifelines are required by the class rules or the sailing
instructions they shall be taut, and competitors shall not position
any part of their torsos outside them, except briefly to perform a
necessary task. On boats equipped with upper and lower lifelines of
wire, a competitor sitting on the deck facing outboard with his waist
inside the lower lifeline may have the upper part of his body outside
the upper lifeline.
As seen recently in the Commodores Cup (UK) and Onionpatch (USA) and other events . Boats do have crew 'up the mast' and this is not in contraventionjm of 49.2 (see text above). Unless I missed an appeal ruling somewhere.
You would have to aruge pretty strongly, and as far as I'm aware noone has sucessfully done this, to get someone DSQ for this. As least under the current rules.
49.1 Competitors shall use no device designed to position their bodies
outboard, other than hiking straps and stiffeners worn under the
thighs.
49.2 When lifelines are required by the class rules or the sailing
instructions they shall be taut, and competitors shall not position
any part of their torsos outside them, except briefly to perform a
necessary task. On boats equipped with upper and lower lifelines of
wire, a competitor sitting on the deck facing outboard with his waist
inside the lower lifeline may have the upper part of his body outside
the upper lifeline.
As seen recently in the Commodores Cup (UK) and Onionpatch (USA) and other events . Boats do have crew 'up the mast' and this is not in contraventionjm of 49.2 (see text above). Unless I missed an appeal ruling somewhere.
You would have to aruge pretty strongly, and as far as I'm aware noone has sucessfully done this, to get someone DSQ for this. As least under the current rules.
fireball
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
competitors shall not position any part of their torsos outside them
[/ QUOTE ]
You could argue that with sufficient heal the crew will have their torsos outside the lifeline .... however as it has a detrimental effect to heeling I can't see that it is a major problem!
I suppose the concern may be that if smaller racing boats start doing this they will want the lightest crew member up the mast (often the youngest!) and the crew member is more likely to get injured being thrown around whilst up the mast. So I can see why this could be discouraged!!
competitors shall not position any part of their torsos outside them
[/ QUOTE ]
You could argue that with sufficient heal the crew will have their torsos outside the lifeline .... however as it has a detrimental effect to heeling I can't see that it is a major problem!
I suppose the concern may be that if smaller racing boats start doing this they will want the lightest crew member up the mast (often the youngest!) and the crew member is more likely to get injured being thrown around whilst up the mast. So I can see why this could be discouraged!!
bbg
Well-Known Member
They had crew up the masts upwind or downwind? IIRC, when AC boats first started to do it the general consensus was that if a boat was heeling enough that the man up the mast was outside (in a vertical line) the lifelines, it wasn't permitted for the purpose of looking for wind, as that didn't fall into "except briefly to perform a
necessary task".
Downwind probably OK. Upwind - if the wind is so light and fluky that you need someone up the mast to look for puffs, maybe the boat won't heel enough to put the man ouboard (depends how high he is, too).
I agree that 49.2 doesn't exclude it explicitly (which is why I said "generally") but I think it does exclude it if the spotter's body is outboard of the lifelines (as they clearly are in the AC boats pictured).
However I haven't raced competitively for several years, so things might have moved on.
necessary task".
Downwind probably OK. Upwind - if the wind is so light and fluky that you need someone up the mast to look for puffs, maybe the boat won't heel enough to put the man ouboard (depends how high he is, too).
I agree that 49.2 doesn't exclude it explicitly (which is why I said "generally") but I think it does exclude it if the spotter's body is outboard of the lifelines (as they clearly are in the AC boats pictured).
However I haven't raced competitively for several years, so things might have moved on.
fireball
Well-Known Member
So - its ok when they're tacking downwind then! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
bbg
Well-Known Member
Nice try /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Ships_Cat
Well-Known Member
I seem to recall that this practice was tested during one of the recent past AC Challenges (in Auckland, I think) and it was found, or maybe just agreed for the purposes of the AC, that it was ok.
Given that hint, maybe someone recalls more?
John
Given that hint, maybe someone recalls more?
John
temptress
Well-Known Member
The current (and previous) AAC boats don't have lifelines at all - not required under class rules! Wording has changed and seems to be common place even in fleets with lifelines - but not seen it tested anywhere.
bbg
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
The current (and previous) AAC boats don't have lifelines at all - not required under class rules!
[/ QUOTE ]
Exactly - which is why I said it is OK for ACC boats to do it!
The current (and previous) AAC boats don't have lifelines at all - not required under class rules!
[/ QUOTE ]
Exactly - which is why I said it is OK for ACC boats to do it!
uforea
Well-Known Member
On the large gaff rigged classic yachts they also have a man up the masts to help with the setting and recovery of topsails etc.
Ted
Ted
adelaidem
Well-Known Member
Perhaps having a crew member weight on a halyard puts some type of pre-bend on the carbon sticks
