Why are YBW article-downloads so damned expensive??

[andymcp]

Scanning complete magazines is a tedious and expensive manual job. Then there's the task of physically reading the contents pages, entering them into a database and indexing them to the scanned images.

Sorry, but it just isn't expensive or complex. The place I work has a section that receives several hundred journals, magazines and books a week, scans them all, indexes them all, plus reads every article and provides an abstract summary in a consistent form (so trained staff, not scanner monkeys) to make the whole deal searchable. It then licenses access to that information, and even offers to search it for you if you only have a vague inkling of what you want and/or are a bit lazy.

Significantly more complex than the reprints service at IPC, and still far cheaper than IPC's pricing in the cases where we do pay-per-view access.

 

[Richard Shead]

If course they are reading it ... All I am going to say is the digital landscape changes almost daily all or our titles are now on Zinio but more importantly the app store which gives our global audience a much better chance of finding the issue they want when they want it without delay.

There have been a number if assumptions on here most of which are wildy inaccurate but all I will say is that all good things come to those who wait ....

Not everything is kept in a digital format and you would be amazed at what we are asked for.

Remeber three of our marine titles are over 100 years old one near 50 and the other catching up ..

On a different note if you were about to drop 100k. On a boat do you not think along with a survey 7 pounds is not too much for good report ? Just a question.

Anyhow that's all from me.

Cheers

 

[andymcp]

Fair points Richard, but it's also a valid point that no matter if in the context of a boat purchase £7 is good value, this thread pretty clearly demonstrates that there is greater demand at a different price point. I might buy one boat, but I'll look at loads (each therefore £7 a pop) and be interested in even more.

But it's IPC's call at the end of the day. So good luck to you, it's a great asset you have there with a willing audience if the price is right.

 

[Me_has_a_Boat]

On a different note if you were about to drop 100k. On a boat do you not think along with a survey 7 pounds is not too much for good report ? Just a question.

Leaving aside what is a "good" report - have IPC not heard of the internet? (it has lots of interesting things on it, including about boats - it's not all naked ladies doing stuff ).

and most of it is for free..........including the naked lady stuff. so I am told.........

 

[prv]

On a different note if you were about to drop 100k. On a boat do you not think along with a survey 7 pounds is not too much for good report ? Just a question.

Sure - as I said, that's the one circumstance in which I did buy one. But buying a boat isn't the only reason to want to read an old article. Take the Buckler review mentioned upthread - clearly there's no way I'm going to buy such a monstrosity, but I am idly curious about how such a monstrosity came to be, and what it sails like. I spent an evening last year trawling through everything Google could tell me about it, if I could have found out for a quid what PBO thought of it as well, I would have. But not for much more than that.

Perhaps this idea of people only buying old reviews of boats they're about to purchase explains the current price? Probably when people had to first somehow find out that an article existed, and then write to the publishers asking for a photocopy, it made sense; that's not something you'd do on a whim. But now, articles are offered up in response to a Google search for anything remotely relevant, so impulse purchase is a distinct possibility, but the price kills that stone dead.

Pete

 

[Richard Shead]

Sure - as I said, that's the one circumstance in which I did buy one. But buying a boat isn't the only reason to want to read an old article. Take the Buckler review mentioned upthread - clearly there's no way I'm going to buy such a monstrosity, but I am idly curious about how such a monstrosity came to be, and what it sails like. I spent an evening last year trawling through everything Google could tell me about it, if I could have found out for a quid what PBO thought of it as well, I would have. But not for much more than that.

Perhaps this idea of people only buying old reviews of boats they're about to purchase explains the current price? Probably when people had to first somehow find out that an article existed, and then write to the publishers asking for a photocopy, it made sense; that's not something you'd do on a whim. But now, articles are offered up in response to a Google search for anything remotely relevant, so impulse purchase is a distinct possibility, but the price kills that stone dead.

Pete

As I said it was just a question....

There are many new things in the pipeline on the digital front but IPC is not just marine so everything has a time scale.

Cheers

 

[Me_has_a_Boat]

Seadogs:-

http://www.seadog.org.uk/

https://sites.google.com/a/jaytac.com/seadog/Seadogs

https://sites.google.com/a/jaytac.com/seadog/Seadogs/Review

http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/archives/seadog-30/seadog-30.htm

http://www.sailingtoday.co.uk/seadog/seadog-30

http://seadog30.webs.com/

http://www.kyteweb.net/canute/inventory.htm

http://members.chello.nl/~r.kramer5/index.html

http://www.boatshed.com/seadog_30_ketch-boat-46736.html

http://www.facebook.com/Seadog30?ref=hl

https://docs.google.com/a/jaytac.com/file/d/0B73rFs1lDsoAV3hfWl9jWHlxVkk/edit?pli=1

Only around 140 built (1960's and early 1970's) - more popular vessels will have a lot more - the above (collectively, if not some individually) say far more than the 2 IPC Magazine reports do (and multiple sources always add a certain something) - and a certainty that at least some of the links will include actual people willing to talk about Seadogs .......and of course all are FREE......not to say the IPC reports don't have there place (being from a recognised publisher does add something, but it's simply one of many data points). But £7 a pop? It might be small beer in comparison to a purchase, but nontheless I really don't see the value.....or the neccessity.

No doubt in time some of these links will dissapear into the ether - but others will replace them (the Seadog ownership is towards the mature end - aka internet illiterate!)......and information on the internet will only ever grow for all boats, why would folk (en masse) be spending £7 on a PDF from 10 or 20 years ago - when they can get something more recent, more relevant - and likely with a person attached. 99p is the way to go (at least until IPC twig how to make money from supplying for free) - plus make the spending easier than stuffing in credit card details everytime .........but probably have to wiggle out of the deal already made or wait until it finishes . and hope that by then not too late.

 

[Greenheart]

...when people had to first somehow find out that an article existed, and then write to the publishers asking for a photocopy, it made sense; that's not something you'd do on a whim...

...but now, articles are offered up in response to a Google search for anything remotely relevant, so impulse purchase is a distinct possibility, but the price kills that stone dead.

Pete

That's it exactly, Pete. If archived pages were cheap to read, we'd 'click & pay' for the privilege, casually and unthinkingly...and we'd represent a lot of business thereby. Whereas, the £7 fee is like paying an entry fee to a supermarket - we just don't visit at all.

Mr Shead must be out of step with the potential market, to suggest that only on the brink of paying large sums for a yacht, would we consider reading a review, hence the review can be laughably overpriced. And what about all the many articles on other themes?

And...the fact that IPC may rely upon another company to handle orders for archived articles, doesn't negate the necessity for appropriate price-setting. If the profits have to be divided up, there'd still be more money to split, if far more of us used the service!

IPC...have you ever heard of 'pound shops'? Have you seen how much business they do? Ever wondered why?

Who, at IPC, has failed to recognise that a thousand sold at £1.50 each, represent more profit than a handful at £7?

 

[Richard Shead]

That's it exactly, Pete. If archived pages were cheap to read, we'd 'click & pay' for the privilege, casually and unthinkingly...and we'd represent a lot of business, thereby. Whereas, the £7 fee is like paying an entry fee to a supermarket - we just don't visit at all.

Mr Shead must be out of step with the potential market, to suggest that only on the brink of paying large sums for a yacht, would we consider reading a review, hence the review can be laughably overpriced. And what about all the many articles on other themes?

And...the fact that IPC may rely upon another company to handle orders for archived articles, doesn't negate the necessity for appropriate price-setting. If the profits have to be divided up, there'd still be more money to split, if far more of us used the service!

IPC...have you ever heard of 'pound shops'? Have you seen how much business they do? Ever wondered why?

Who, at IPC, has failed to recognise that a thousand sold at £1.50 each, represent more profit than a handful at £7?

Ok I will bite....

I am not out of step (I am a boat owner as it happens) it was a QUESTION like I said, see I can shout as well..

And nobody has failed to recognise anything, perhaps if people read my replies in more detail they would see what I am trying to say...

The pound shop comparison in my mind is frankly ridiculous, besides have you ever seen a leading brand in pound shop? and one that has more than a month left on its sell by....And yes I have one in Twickenham which I have been to once and will never go again as it does not service my needs.

I say again, we do read these forums, we do listen but things don't just happen over night..

And I am fully aware of micro payments, what they mean and the volumes they deliver, I am also aware of the volumes we currently deliver...

Have a good weekend and thank you for your comments.

 

[maxi77]

Does everyone assume all the old back issues are already scanned and stored digitally by IPC? I wouldn't have thought so. Why would they. Scanning complete magazines is a tedious and expensive manual job. Then there's the task of physically reading the contents pages, entering them into a database and indexing them to the scanned images. I would imagine IPC haven't wasted their time and money doing this for all the back issues, so you pay a reasonable price for the privilege.

There are plenty of companies who will scan your paper archive at prices that make it a good idea to save the warehouse costs never mid sell it to the punters, If IPC have not scanned their archive they are seriously wastin money

 

[prv]

There are plenty of companies who will scan your paper archive at prices that make it a good idea to save the warehouse costs never mid sell it to the punters, If IPC have not scanned their archive they are seriously wastin money

To be fair, I doubt fifty years of PBO takes up more than a small storage room in the office, so it's not like they're currently paying "warehouse costs".

(I realise we're talking about more than just PBO, but the principle's the same.)

Pete

 

[Fire99]

Take my example. I'm interested in articles with my current Snapdragon 23 and a potential purchase, a GK29. But that GK29 may become a Trapper 501 or a Prospect 800 etc etc.

If the articles (articles not whole magazines) were at worst £1 each, i'd be tempted for a download, purely since a magazine testers opinion often offers a good unbiased overview of a boat.
However, £7 per article is (regardless of where's and why's) ridiculous and a step away from buying a jar in Scotland, filled with 'Scotch Mist'.. Not exactly value for money.

 

[Greenheart]

I say again, we do read these forums, we do listen but things don't just happen over night..

And I am fully aware of micro payments, what they mean and the volumes they deliver, I am also aware of the volumes we currently deliver...

Have a good weekend and thank you for your comments.

Isn't it conspicuous that old (sometimes very old) articles, are not nearly so saleable as today's slick top-end yachting journalism, which the PBO/YM brands exemplify...so it's business-blindness to set archive prices at even more than it costs to read 2012 boat-reviews...

...hence my pound-shop comparison. I've never been in a pound-shop either, but there's no doubting their popularity. And, archived articles are by necessity already out of date, so that's a red herring.

Old articles look like a possible profitable byway, apparently currently under-used by IPC. I certainly didn't start this thread to be naggingly critical about IPC's ways of working...I just wanted to read old articles that are presently unrealistically priced. So, no sale.

Always nice to hear a response from the people at the helm, though.

 

[Ex-SolentBoy]

Drop the price, or make them free, but add current advertising automatically to the downloaded printout.

If they were free lots of people would download them and you would probably make more money from the advertising.

 

[maxi77]

To be fair, I doubt fifty years of PBO takes up more than a small storage room in the office, so it's not like they're currently paying "warehouse costs".

(I realise we're talking about more than just PBO, but the principle's the same.)

Pete

It is not just the final output it is all the paper that is involved in getting there, the correspondance with the authors, the tax people the printers etc etc. Business generates a lot of paper and an awful lot of it needs to be stored

 

[maxi77]

If course they are reading it ... All I am going to say is the digital landscape changes almost daily all or our titles are now on Zinio but more importantly the app store which gives our global audience a much better chance of finding the issue they want when they want it without delay.

There have been a number if assumptions on here most of which are wildy inaccurate but all I will say is that all good things come to those who wait ....

Not everything is kept in a digital format and you would be amazed at what we are asked for.

Remeber three of our marine titles are over 100 years old one near 50 and the other catching up ..

On a different note if you were about to drop 100k. On a boat do you not think along with a survey 7 pounds is not too much for good report ? Just a question.

Anyhow that's all from me.

Cheers

I don't know how much you actually get in income but based on the straw poll here not much. I have never paid 100K for a boat and my next one if there is one will be cheap enough to make £7 seem way to much considering the other stuff available for free on the web. charging paper prices for electronic stuff is so stone age time to wake up and smell the coffee. That is one of the reasons I am not an electronic subscriber and no longer read your publications

 

[Richard Shead]

I don't know how much you actually get in income but based on the straw poll here not much. I have never paid 100K for a boat and my next one if there is one will be cheap enough to make £7 seem way to much considering the other stuff available for free on the web. charging paper prices for electronic stuff is so stone age time to wake up and smell the coffee. That is one of the reasons I am not an electronic subscriber and no longer read your publications

Ok so lets put all of our content on the web for free....oh and lets not pay the journos as I am sure they would happily write for free if it appears in the electronic version.....

Ever heard of VAT? Apples Cut? software licences? Just a few things that need to be considered when publishing stuff on line (the paid for stuff)

As I said a lot of assumptions here, I am very happy to talk through it at Southampton if you are coming to the show.

 

[Pinnacle]

As I said a lot of assumptions here, I am very happy to talk through it at Southampton if you are coming to the show.

Will you be offering a free drink as in previous years?

 

[lustyd]

Will you be offering a free drink as in previous years?

Free drink? What about VAT and apples and...

 

[lustyd]

lets not pay the journos as I am sure they would happily write for free.

Don't do that, we'll end up with the "quality writing" that is Blogs as our only content