Why are boats so expensive ?

prv said:
Me too, particularly the boatloads I see in the Solent in full brand-name oilies and lifejackets and tethers[1], on a sunny day when I'm bimbling around in cheap walking trousers and a T-shirt. ...
[1] let's not have that argument, I just want to emphasise that they're dressed for a North Sea gale.
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I lived at one time next door to the poshest bike shop in Edinburgh. It was amazing to note how many customers would turn up in the full rigout - advertisement covered tops, lycra shorts, even the clicky shoes - but without their bicycles. I suspect that similar motives apply to those who dress for a North Sea gale in order to walk up Cowes High Street.
 
Madhatter said:
Back to my question why are boats so expensive, new, used whatever and worse still parts and mooring costs are almost prohibitive for the ordinary man in the street.
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Boats are always expensive - as are cars, bikes, planes and so on when you can't afford to buy what you want! - which applies to most of us most of the time but at different levels.

Is the "so expensive" in comparison with what you earn, what they used to cost, relative to other products - one could go on for a long time trying to define "expensive".

In real terms boats, like most man made consumer products have fallen in price. 50 years ago an "ordinary man in the street" could not dream of affording a sea going boat - now you have an enormous choice for a fraction of the average annual wage. It is a mistake to look at the mean income as a measure of wealth - it is the median disposable income which is important when considering whether discretionary activities are expensive - and they are clearly not as sections of society have seen their discretionary income rocket - and enjoy spending it on boat, cruises, cars, home "improvements" and so on.

But at the same time other sections of society have minimal discretionary income either because of poorly paid jobs or more commonly huge fixed commitments - mortgage, children and so on. When this goes away (and you have been sensible enough to keep the same partner, educate your children well, chuck them out as soon as they are capable of earning a living) then you will find that the old Westerly you coveted but could not afford has been replaced by an HR 36 that is just too expensive and you have to settle for a Bavaria!

And so life goes on!
 
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Alright there

Seanick said:
Thats either really big, or really small !!! :-)
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Oi! You two! Get a Forum!

(that's not a bad idea actually: a forum dedicated to banter)

Boats are expensive because of marginal costs. I am not going to explain more unless asked to, or unless anyone here really has problems with insomnia, at which point I would be happy to oblige the honorable forumites.

Best,
Greenmantle
 
Yachting for the Ordinary Man

wotayottie said:
Yachting never was a sport for the ordinary man in the street though it is if anything becoming more so now that it used to be. After all the average pay is what - maybe 25k before tax and with all the expenses of living to be taken out of it. And the cost of a marina berth maybe 5k average. Even with a club berth its easy to see total annual costs approach 5k.
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I think you make a good point. We have all read of the days when YM and YW once sponsored the design of a small yacht to "...give readers the opportunity to obtain a design of distinction at a nominal cost." In these time of economic "overfalls" is it time for a return to these values?

Or I might just be over come by the seasonal spirit;)
 
are boats expensive

its all relative and about choice

mine cost about the same as a decent conservatory / extension which we decided we didn't need. We decided the house was big enough.

Its annual upkeep is less than many spend on drinking and tobacco. It lives on a mooring / boatyard in the winter

new boats are expensive. We knew we couldn't afford one.

Not convinced boats are expensive if you're prepared to accept what you can afford rather than what you aspire to and do lots of DIY on it.

At the end of the day we all sail on the same water and visit the same places and there will always be a more expensive boat. You just need to learn to live with that fact then you will see things differently.
 
Ubergeekian said:
I lived at one time next door to the poshest bike shop in Edinburgh. It was amazing to note how many customers would turn up in the full rigout - advertisement covered tops, lycra shorts, even the clicky shoes - but without their bicycles. I suspect that similar motives apply to those who dress for a North Sea gale in order to walk up Cowes High Street.
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Havent you seen them rolling up to the London boat show in sailing gear? Lots of old men wearing Breton caps! Younger ones in deck jackets or oilies.

Having said that I always sail wearing a life jacket and since its a PITA to remove / connect to my oily jacket that often means in fine weather I am wearing my jacket. Why not?
 
Bosun Higgs said:
Havent you seen them rolling up to the London boat show in sailing gear? Lots of old men wearing Breton caps! Younger ones in deck jackets or oilies.
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A bit like the way all YM and PBO contributors are pictured in expensive sailing jackets with the collars turned up? I hope to get to Excel this year and will watch out for the phonomena you mention. I tend to go to boat shows in a Barbour waxed jacket and flat cap myself.

Having said that I always sail wearing a life jacket and since its a PITA to remove / connect to my oily jacket that often means in fine weather I am wearing my jacket. Why not?
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I'm not sure about the number of jackets here. Are you saying that your (life) jacket is semi-permanently connected to your (oily) jacket so that when you wear your (oily) jacket ashore in fine weather your (life) jacket tends to come along for the ride? Why not indeed, though I don't normally wear an (oily) jacket in fine weather myself ...
 
savageseadog said:
I would say the market is wide open for a visionary builder to knock em out by the thousand, possibly even in the UK. A Branson or Dyson type of visionary is required. Jeanneau and Beneteau have gone some way but I'm sure more could be done with innovative construction methods and engineering. The way the world is going I guess our yachts will soon be coming with noodle steamers built in.
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I find it bizarre that we have left the seas and rivers behind. We're a tiny island (moreso for me, because I'm in Northern Ireland) and yet only a tiny fraction of people have been on a boat smaller than a ferry.

I'm only getting started - have about 3 hours of sailing under my belt - and no boat - but I have a dream and I'm going to drag some of my friends aboard.
 
cimota said:
We're a tiny island...
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Often said but not true. Great Britain is the ninth largest island in the world, according to Wikipedia. What I find even more interesting is that the coastline length of Great Britain, including its principal islands, is about 19,491 miles (presumably statute not nautical). If you knock out the rubbish bits (south and east coasts) that still leaves rather a lot of miles.

And we haven't even mentioned the lakes and other inland waterways.
 
That depends on your definition. We squeeze into the top 10 but conveniently ignore continents. And as I said, I'm not on GB ;)

But even looking at Northern Ireland (where I am). We have this ruddy big lake in the middle of the province and still only a tiny percentage of boat owners.

There are economic reasons of course, regions where people are poorer are less likely to have leisure boating.
 
cimota said:
There are economic reasons of course, regions where people are poorer are less likely to have leisure boating.
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They are less likely to have the industrialised leisure boating of much of the south coast of England, but may well have higher participation levels overall when you take the budget end into account.
 
EuanMcKenzie said:
At the end of the day we all sail on the same water and visit the same places and there will always be a more expensive boat. You just need to learn to live with that fact then you will see things differently.
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Aye.

To paraphrase slightly "Unless you're DylanW or LarryE, there will *always* be folks with smaller or bigger boats than you; love what you sail, sail what you love."

So, am I bonkers to consider spending >5% of the boatsworth on a fancy-fast kite? OK, we've currently got heating and a fridge, but compared with 20K for 5' of foredeck, it's the best way I can think of to waste *my* dosh. :-)
 
Sailing Clubs...

When I lived in Boston (USA), I joined one of the three or four large sailing clubs that exist in Boston Harbor (The Boston Sailing Center, http://www.bostonsailingcenter.com/index.asp). For less than the price of a full set of Henry Lloyd Gore Tex and boots, you could take a yearly membership and sail J/24s, Solings, Sonars, Olsen 25s. For about double you could upgrade to J/30s, C&C34s. If you had the money for it, you could even get a membership that included a full week's use of the 40' cruiser. There was NO per use cost - you were allowed to make a reservation up to several weeks in advance, but only have one outstanding reservation. In practical terms, we had so many boats that unless it was a July or August weekend you could always get a J/24 or Soling without a reservation - we had tens of each. (NB - it seems prices have doubled in the eleven years since I left...but that's inflation more than anything)

You didn't have to pay for maintenance, although if you sunk it or abused it you would be billed. The club carried all insurance. They had a nice floating base with changing facilities, showers, and club house - a converted lake steamer.

In short, it made sailing something that was affordable, they offered tons of instruction (for a fee, of course), and promoted the sport very, very well. And socially you met a LOT of people...

I have yet to see anything like this arrangement in the UK, at least on the south shore / Solent area. Does anyone know of one?
 
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