jfm
Well-Known Member
With respect, you're kidding yourself. Sure it is an improvement, but it is slight. I mean the policy now scores 3 out of ten, instead of 2, if you see what I mean. All in my opinion only, of course
Who is insured with Haven Knox Johnston?
- Thread starter crazy4557
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P4Paul
Well-Known Member
Hi John,
The revised wording they have offered me and listed under the title 'Additional Conditions' on my renewal quotation is as below.
I know you have just answered Jegs above but can I just double check that it this wording that doesn't meet your high standards or is there something else in the policy that I am missing?
Thanks in advance,
Paul.
Nigelpickin
Well-Known Member
FWIW I had a great chat with Pantanius at LIBS and am moving across to them with haste, regardless of the forfeit in terms of annulling my HKJ policy....
petem
Well-Known Member
Be sure you cancel one before taking out another even if you don't get a refund on the old policy. Having cover duplicate cover can create all sorts of issues in the event of f claim. Sorry if this is stating the bleeding obvious!
Nigelpickin
Well-Known Member
jfm
Well-Known Member
Paul, that is the same wording as Jegs quoted. No, it doesn't pass muster with me. The words "claims for" do not give you any clarity that you are covered for the consequential damage of mechanical breakdown or whatever. If you engines fail and you drift onto a lee shore and suffer a total loss, the proximate cause of your loss will generally be the engine failure. Thus your total loss is very likely to be a "claim for...mechanical breakdown". Sure, you might be able to prove you have the engines properly serviced by the official agent, but that doesn't help you. At least that is the most straightforward reading of those quite simple words - if your insurers don't intend that to be the case, let them say so in clear words in the policy, just as Pantaenius do. If they won't, then worry.
I don't agree by the way that my standards here are unusually high; I'm rooting for cover that is merely commensurate with you have with most car and household policies. The problem therefore isn't that my standards are high, it is that these mainstream yacht policies are appalling bad, imho.
I want to go a bit lighter on HKJ however, in a more general sense. I've always agreed that their customer service is excellent, and I don't know anything for sure but I am hoping we see insurers raise their game during this coming year and improve the cover given by their policies. We'll have to be patient but before too long things might get better on the policy wording front. Full marks from me therefore as regards HKJ's attitude. But I have to be objective and say that right now at this moment I would not insure a boat of significant value using this policy wording, for what I think are fairly obvious reasons
Jegs
Well-Known Member
Hi JFM,
I was reassured because they replaced "3.5 any loss, damage, liability or expense directly or indirectly arising from:" with "3.5 claims for" & therefore they have removed that which I think of as loss following the listed conditions & it now only refers to lack of cover for those problems. Further, the amendment was issued following my email asking whether I would be covered in the event the boat hit the rocks following engine failure. I would think that, following my question, a reasonable interpretation would be that I was covered [ if not, unfair contract terms?].
ATB,
John G
jfm
Well-Known Member
OK. I see where you are coming from and obviously wasn't aware of the email correspondence. Yes, based on that, and without seeing the wording of the emails so merely assuming their contents are ok, you would have a decent leg to stand on. That said, you are relying on emails and interpretations, as opposed to clear cut contractual terms, and why anyone would put their head into the jaws of that lion is beyond me (!)
Separately, there is the whole issue of other things in policies and wide vs narrow 3P liability cover, but we have done that to death in other threads so I wont repeat it here.
Good luck!
P4Paul
Well-Known Member
John, I didn't mean anything in my previous post, apologies if it came across as anything other than me being grateful for your time spent in highlighting and then advising me (and the forum) in this subject.
I am now in receipt of a quote from Pantaenius which wasn't as expensive as I assumed it would be.
Thanks again for your advice.
jfm
Well-Known Member
Oops sorry I didn't mean to suggest I thought you meant something. I mean, absolutely no offence taken whatsoever on my part. Forums eh. This would be much easier as a chat in a pub!
asteven221
Well-Known Member
I know this thread has got a bit old now, but nevertheless it's of particular interest to me, because I have a few days until my insurance needs renewed.
I have been wrestling with the thought of whether or not to renew with HKJ, who I have been with for many years. On the positive side, they have dealt with my recent (circa £6k) claim extremely well and didn't hesitate when I had to get additional work done due to original parts not being available. No issues there. On the negative side, this thread has spooked me about what would happen in the event of a really serious claim. That would be with the backdrop that I have done everything right insofar as being vigilant, cautious and almost paranoid when it comes to making sure my boat is maintained and looked after.
Not sure what to do, although my instinct is to stay with the devil I know.
Anyway, in my research I stumbled across the following link, which I thought I should share with everyone. I guess it's an obvious place to go looking but it was Mr Google that got me there.
http://financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/technical_notes/marine-insurance.html#seaworthy
I have been wrestling with the thought of whether or not to renew with HKJ, who I have been with for many years. On the positive side, they have dealt with my recent (circa £6k) claim extremely well and didn't hesitate when I had to get additional work done due to original parts not being available. No issues there. On the negative side, this thread has spooked me about what would happen in the event of a really serious claim. That would be with the backdrop that I have done everything right insofar as being vigilant, cautious and almost paranoid when it comes to making sure my boat is maintained and looked after.
Not sure what to do, although my instinct is to stay with the devil I know.
Anyway, in my research I stumbled across the following link, which I thought I should share with everyone. I guess it's an obvious place to go looking but it was Mr Google that got me there.
http://financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/technical_notes/marine-insurance.html#seaworthy
petem
Well-Known Member
That's a good link and one I posted earlier. Everyone should read it.
ganter
Well-Known Member
HK-J are good. Been with them for years.
Got this email from them today as a matter of fact...
Dear Mr------,
Given the recent and on-going inclement weather across the UK and the effect this is having on our clients, we are writing to remind you that we are here to help should you require our assistance.
We have already been advised of a number of unfortunate losses that our clients have suffered and are in the process of dealing with those accordingly.
Our claims team is fully resourced and ready to take your call should you have any questions or should you wish to notify us of damage to your boat; you can contact our claims department on: 01732 223 610 alternatively you can contact us by email at havenclaims@amlin.co.uk.
We also have a panel of Marine Surveyors together with our resident Field Claims Adjuster on standby to respond to our clients as may be necessary.
The link below will take you to the claims page of our website, please read this page carefully as it will help to advise you on what action you should take if you are unfortunate enough to suffer loss or damage to your boat.
Hopefully you will not suffer too badly but as above, we are here to help should you need to call on us.
Yours Sincerely,
John Macaulay
Managing Director
Been with them for a long time - a couple of claims later - no complaints.
As others have said...if it got to a serious claim - I would simply write to Robin himself, and remind him that reality mustn't part ways with conscience - simply because the financial incentives are there.
And if that didn't work I'd threaten to burn Suhaili down in the museum at Falmouth.
Got this email from them today as a matter of fact...
Dear Mr------,
Given the recent and on-going inclement weather across the UK and the effect this is having on our clients, we are writing to remind you that we are here to help should you require our assistance.
We have already been advised of a number of unfortunate losses that our clients have suffered and are in the process of dealing with those accordingly.
Our claims team is fully resourced and ready to take your call should you have any questions or should you wish to notify us of damage to your boat; you can contact our claims department on: 01732 223 610 alternatively you can contact us by email at havenclaims@amlin.co.uk.
We also have a panel of Marine Surveyors together with our resident Field Claims Adjuster on standby to respond to our clients as may be necessary.
The link below will take you to the claims page of our website, please read this page carefully as it will help to advise you on what action you should take if you are unfortunate enough to suffer loss or damage to your boat.
Hopefully you will not suffer too badly but as above, we are here to help should you need to call on us.
Yours Sincerely,
John Macaulay
Managing Director
Been with them for a long time - a couple of claims later - no complaints.
As others have said...if it got to a serious claim - I would simply write to Robin himself, and remind him that reality mustn't part ways with conscience - simply because the financial incentives are there.
And if that didn't work I'd threaten to burn Suhaili down in the museum at Falmouth.