Which Way to go - New or S/h

MedDreamer

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Some of you may remember my boatless mate from this years LBS. Well he is now progressing to serious consideration of boat buying and he went scouting at SIBS this past weekend.

The two boats he narrowed it down to were the Bayliner 275 (redesignated wide body 265) and the Doral 250 - both listed around £50K new and both easily accomodating him and his partner. He felt that with deals and discounts etc he could get a new boat but that it would be at the upper limit financially.

My suggestion to him was that he would be better off spending half of that amount on say a 5-6 year old Bayliner which he could afford with just a few judicious changes to his household budget. Don't think he would find the Doral for that price though (and he did express a preference for the Doral). This would mean that he would then be able to enjoy his boat without any great financial strain.

I feel he may be smitten with the idea of new though (and I would agree that they are both nice boats and that the Doral in particular is a lovely package).

What does the team think he should do. He does look in on here but doesn't know I was going to post this but as he the sort of person who does his homework thoroughly bedfore commiting to anything I am sure he would appreciate your comments.

Cheers

Martyn











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martynwhiteley

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If I hadn't met him, I'd be thinking it was your 'imaginary' friend Martyn, and you were trying to break it to us gently that you were considering going Doral yourself!

My next door neighbour at Goole has a fairly new Doral 270, and it does seem a very nice boat. I still think that many Dorals had a 'fussy' over complicated look, but when you study them, the design is full of clever touches, and all those extra curves and knuckles seem to have a purpose.

Where is K intending keeping it?

(Not many moorings available 'round 'ere chap!)

I agree about the option of spending £30K on a 5 years old one, much more cost effective, and he'll lose nowt if it don't work out. (And I won't be too miffed if he manages to berth it at Goole!).

Some nice Rinkers about for £30K ish!

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tcm

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Not direct exp of those models, but there's no doubt that buying new is a far more lovely experience, initially at least.

But for newbies, it is not like a new car, where little if anything goes wrong. The volumes are so low that he can almost pretend that you made the boat from an assortment of bits, and despite the fact that you're a nice chap, some things won't be quite right, and some things won't work, and some things will be a bit poxy. This is quite galling for first time new boat buyers.

He could certainly enjoy the boating more if he bought secondhand, giving him enuf loot to fix or upgrade things, but stating from a physical boat that is physically there in front of him, instead of a line on an order book that might be fine, but might not.

BUT, i have myself er never followed this advice.





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MedDreamer

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It was the Rinkers that got him going down the new route in the first place Martyn, but he narrowed it down to the Bayliner and the Doral.

Actually I agree with you about the Doral. My next berthholder at Windermere had a 250 and I thought there were too many unneccesary design details on it but it did look well built. The cockpit and cabin are excellent though.

I think his ambtion is to follow us to the sunshine but I will suggest Goole as an alternative - just have to get him drinking "girlie" beer to fit in.

Martyn

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jhr

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Personally, I'd go the second hand route, not least because of the immediate 17.5% VAT depreciation on a new boat.

Ok, I'm exaggerating, but so long as it's been properly looked after, a newish second hand boat will make an excellent buy. Somebody else will have put right all the initial snags (and if they haven't, your mate should walk swiftly away), spent a fortune kitting it out and taken the heaviest hit on depreciation. S/he will also have spent time putting a few minor dings and scratches in the topsides and superstructure, which will stop your mate agonising when, as is inevitable, he adds to the tally himself.

IMHO, the only reason for buying new is (a) if you can't get exactly what you want any other way, either because the model is brand new or because it's rarer than hen's teeth - I guess this may be your mate's problem if he wants the Doral; (b) if you are the kind of person who absolutely has to buy new and wouldn't be seen dead in last year's model (but then, what do you do next year?) or (c) someone else is paying.

Very similar to buying a car, imho. Caveat emptor and all that, but to me, buying a new boat makes even less sense than buying a new car. Your mate should buy a nice, clean 3-4 year old boat and spend the rest of his money on, ahem, essential purchases from the Swindlery.



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martynwhiteley

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What do you expect when you keep me waiting 6 months for another pint of TT Landlord/forums/images/icons/wink.gif

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MedDreamer

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Quite right, I'm away this weekend but will give you a ring next week and arrange a drink - I'd love to see the boat so I'll pop down to Goole if you like.

Martyn

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PhilF

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I'd go second hand but from a main dealer, you get the TLC without the agro of everything not being perfect but wanting perfection inherant in a new purchase

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martynwhiteley

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This deal would take some beating

2004 Rinker 250 Firesta Vee
Size: 27'1

Rinker 250 Sports Cruiser, finished in white with blue camper pack. Mercruiser 5.0L V8 260php MPI inboard driving a Bravo III Outdrive.
4 Berths in one cabin, full galley, separate heads all to Rinker's usual standard.

Specifications
Craft fitted with Navman GPS Colour Chart Plotter, Navman Depth/Fishfinder, Electric Windlass, Colour TV/DVD, Electric Flush WC, H&C Water to Galley, Heads and Transom Shower.
Craft in excellent Condition, owner working abroad hence craft for sale.

Price: £37,995

All at www.rinker.uk.com


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MedDreamer

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Re: This deal would take some beating

Sounds good Martyn but I'm trying to point him at something like the newly listed 1998bBayliner 2655 that Essex Boatyards have on their books sub £25K

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PhilF

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Re: This deal would take some beating

Tell him to talk to Ben, used to be at Crest, I found him good

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jon_bailey

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From my experience Doral will be significantly higher priced than Bayliner, particularly 2nd hand. Is he going diesel or petrol route because bayliner not so keen on fitting diesel - or that is what I understand. IMHO Doral's are much better built.

All new boats depreciate quickly in the first few years, although if you buy well depreciation appears to level off and you can even find that excluding inflation you may get more than you paid.

If he is looking to trade up after a couple of years 2nd hand makes more sense. Boat Sealine and Doral will offer you the price you paid new for a trade up but to do this you have to stick to the same brand and try getting a discount off of the new boat /forums/images/icons/wink.gif


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TwoStroke

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Has to be s/hand. As much as I would like to go new - would be looking at 25ft, have now seen bigger boat at SIBS and wife likes it. Roomier and more comfortable when entertaining and easier stop overs. New would blow the budget so s/hand - we're only talking 4 years old to reach budget - so most boats barely run in. Would advise your mate to do the same. Plus a big saving on all the electronics too! Just waiting for a good 'un to appear now.

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