Which boat next

Boat2016 said:
U

Out of interest please can you explain how these engines are protected in the absence of anodes ?
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As said they have anodes but they are hanging off the stern in the sea connected to the engines by what looks like a church lightening conductor that runs the L of the boat to the engine room in the bilge to the transom . This is seperate from the negative of the battery say in a neg earth set up for the starter motor they have direct wiring to the starter motor +ve and - ve .
The ECU stuff is also a seperate box mounted remotely, with its own connections to sensors etc not neg earthed like a car .
Also party part of the “ protection “ is building the seawater in contact stuff like the coolers , SW pump etc out of as far as possible electrochemically similiar metals .In otherways not dissimilar.
There are rubber gaskets and seals too which help stop metal bits touching .
So all in all because you can see at haul out or snorkelling in the Med the state of the anodes easily it’s not somthing that’s likely to be missed or need specific knowledge to do them .

Obviously it’s nice if builders bother to outsource the manufacturing of seawater contact parts to somebody who can use a similar metals , but if you don,t and are happy going down the pencil anode route and direct neg earth the whole lump fine .More fine in a brand new warranted boat .
If think newer CATs eventually after class action lawsuits in the states have basically got a grip of the outsourcing and the seawatwr charge air coolers are now titanium.
Just google CAT leaky coolers or CAT lawsuits for marine engines .
Point is at 5/7 years olds or what ever the SH needs to be looked at closely to see it they have been done , not just the week before your inspection but throughout its life .

That day in the parts shop I was after a geny anode that shares the same part as a CAT cooler pencil .
I only wanted 1 and the guy took it out of a boxed order of another boat . Say guess ( I don’t know exactly) 1 out of 4 or 6 ? - back order part easy French engineer to chuck all the bits he has on , between answering his mob , then finishing early billing the owner for 50 % more hrs .
Owner see the punter price of the full boxed contents , not the trade price of the parts buts that’s not the issue.
Issue is have the pencil anodes been done in a timely manor throughout e boats history .

View attachment 75020

Those big round ones .
Flaps have there own seperate as does the shaft/ props .
 
Portofino said:
As said they have anodes but they are hanging off the stern in the sea connected to the engines by what looks like a church lightening conductor that runs the L of the boat to the engine room in the bilge to the transom . This is seperate from the negative of the battery say in a neg earth set up for the starter motor they have direct wiring to the starter motor +ve and - ve .
The ECU stuff is also a seperate box mounted remotely, with its own connections to sensors etc not neg earthed like a car .
Also party part of the “ protection “ is building the seawater in contact stuff like the coolers , SW pump etc out of as far as possible electrochemically similiar metals .In otherways not dissimilar.
There are rubber gaskets and seals too which help stop metal bits touching .
So all in all because you can see at haul out or snorkelling in the Med the state of the anodes easily it’s not somthing that’s likely to be missed or need specific knowledge to do them .

Obviously it’s nice if builders bother to outsource the manufacturing of seawater contact parts to somebody who can use a similar metals , but if you don,t and are happy going down the pencil anode route and direct neg earth the whole lump fine .More fine in a brand new warranted boat .
If think newer CATs eventually after class action lawsuits in the states have basically got a grip of the outsourcing and the seawatwr charge air coolers are now titanium.
Just google CAT leaky coolers or CAT lawsuits for marine engines .
Point is at 5/7 years olds or what ever the SH needs to be looked at closely to see it they have been done , not just the week before your inspection but throughout its life .

That day in the parts shop I was after a geny anode that shares the same part as a CAT cooler pencil .
I only wanted 1 and the guy took it out of a boxed order of another boat . Say guess ( I don’t know exactly) 1 out of 4 or 6 ? - back order part easy French engineer to chuck all the bits he has on , between answering his mob , then finishing early billing the owner for 50 % more hrs .
Owner see the punter price of the full boxed contents , not the trade price of the parts buts that’s not the issue.
Issue is have the pencil anodes been done in a timely manor throughout e boats history .

View attachment 75020

Those big round ones .
Flaps have there own seperate as does the shaft/ props .
Click to expand...

Thanks for explaining :encouragement:
 
Another feature of the sea water in contact parts on MAN s is when the engine stops they self drain out , as mounted above the WL .
Charge air cooler on the induction side
Seawater heat exchangers on the exhaust side
Gearbox oil coolers .

Now think about that please ?

Couple of points in no particular order

The heat dries the inside - gotta be better than sat in salt
No need to engine flush with fresh water - rended useless surley if it all drains out .
So with MAN you can’t pencil anode because the bits they suppose to process drain out .

But crucially if they you were to go down the direct pencil anode route for protection ,like CAT then think about it that system relies on the zinc (s) being wet all the time .So in order for the coolers or what ever on a CAT engine to be protected you cannot allow any drain down other wise the anode hangs in the air .

Now it’s gets really forensically interesting, because you might unearth a full service history all the i,s dotted and t,s crossed but there’s still internal corrosion happening because the engine somehow has drained down , seawater leaked back out leaving the zinc(s) hanging doing diddly squat .

The OP has a blank canvas in the 13-15 M sports boat sector .

I,am just with all this anode stuff basically answering a query from MapisM of why I left an aged CAT powered C12 / C15 of the “brain storming board “
If MapisM wants to grab the pen and walk up and write” CAT powered “up it up fine .

Advise is free
 
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Portofino said:
Hang on a bit P my 2876,s take 32 L of oil
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Really? They actually take 18L, according to MAN specs.
Btw, they specify "deep sump" because they give builders a choice of sumps suitable for different installations, and that is the one with the higher capacity, which is what they supply unless asked otherwise. Besides, 18L seems consistent with the 24L of my higher displacement V8s.
Regardless, PF, as I already said I'm happy to agree to disagree, and if you say that the right number is 32 (and/or that oil capacity is irrelevant), fairenuff.

But just for the records, on a different stroke:

Portofino said:
You asked me why in an indirect way why I did not place CAT cC12 / 15 in my suggestion
Click to expand...

Portofino said:
I,am just with all this anode stuff basically answering a query from MapisM of why I left an aged CAT powered C12 / C15 of the “brain storming board “
Click to expand...
Nope, I never asked you anything like that. What I did is place those engines in MY suggestion, if you don't mind.
Unsurprisingly, you followed up with your usual dismission of some of the best engines ever built, but please don't pretend that you did this to answer a question that not only I never made, but I would never dream to make, because:
1) I didn't call your dismission "usual" for nothing: this is the Nth time you posted it, and I could write it myself by now.
2) Even if I quoted a comment of yours in my post #49, it's pretty obvious that my suggestion was actually addressed to the OP.

See, there are some topics that are well known to be off limits, for anyone familiar with the asylum.
Criticizing Itamas or MAN engines with your goodself are among the most well known of them... :rolleyes:
There's plenty of other examples of course, like convincing myself that the AnCam is a useful tool, or that IPS pods are NOT the work of evil.
We all have our pet peeves.
Though the very top position among these "mission impossible" topics was recently earned - in spades - by Brent Swain.
After he said that his DIY anchor winch "would work well on a Sealine 24", your suggestion that MAN engines are better because they have no anodes sounds almost reasonable in comparison, I must admit. :D
 
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MapisM said:
Really? They actually take 18L, according to MAN specs.
Btw, they specify "deep sump" because they give builders a choice of sumps suitable for different installations, and that is the one with the higher capacity, which is what they supply unless asked otherwise. Besides, 18L seems consistent with the 24L of my higher displacement V8s.
Regardless, PF, as I already said I'm happy to agree to disagree, and if you say that the right number is 32 (and/or that oil capacity is irrelevant), fairenuff.

But just for the records, on a different stroke:




Nope, I never asked you anything like that. What I did is place those engines in MY suggestion, if you don't mind.
Unsurprisingly, you followed up with your usual dismission of some of the best engines ever built, but please don't pretend that you did this to answer a question that not only I never made, but I would never dream to make, because:
1) I didn't call your dismission "usual" for nothing: this is the Nth time you posted it, and I could write it myself by now.
2) Even if I quoted a comment of yours in my post #49, it's pretty obvious that my suggestion was actually addressed to the OP.

See, there are some topics that are well known to be off limits, for anyone familiar with the asylum.
Criticizing Itamas or MAN engines with your goodself are among the most well known of them... :rolleyes:
There's plenty of other examples of course, like convincing myself that the AnCam is a useful tool, or that IPS pods are NOT the work of evil.
We all have our pet peeves.
Though the very top position among these "mission impossible" topics was recently earned - in spades - by Brent Swain.
After he said that his DIY anchor winch "would work well on a Sealine 24", your suggestion that MAN engines are better because they have no anodes sounds almost reasonable in comparison, I must admit. :D
Click to expand...

@ MapisM I thought my post #50 above addressed most of this ?

Well take look at this and I invite your comments please .I have already suggested check for meticulous service history if the OP ends up going down the CAT route .
All I have done is pass on info ,it’s up to others to judge ( scuse the pun :)) —- and make an informed opinion.

@ MapisM If you could “ write this by myself “ as you say above ^^^ then why are you not flagging this up to the OP who made a general enquire ?

I did suggest earlier but in a post google CAT aftercooler - - - etc .

https://forums.cat.com/t5/Cat-Products/2003-3126b-aftercooler-problem/td-p/4310

https://boatingindustry.com/news/2007/01/30/class-action-lawsuit-bought-against-caterpillar/

https://forums.cat.com/t5/Cat-Products/C12-Aftercooler-Failure/td-p/72870

https://www.justanswer.com/boat/67seu-twin-cat-3126b-s-eastbay-38-mechanic-tells.html










https://forums.cat.com/t5/Cat-Products/C32-Aftercooler-Failures/td-p/3630/page/2


https://forums.cat.com/t5/Engine-Room-Discussions/3126-420hp-cracked-intercooler/td-p/2023


http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php?threads/cat-3196-aftercooler-retrofit.26644/
 
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