Which anchor advice sought.

[Koeketiene]

Please pardon the rather contentious thread tile.

I am currently researching which anchor to get for my boat.
There is currently no provision for any ground-tackle whatsoever - no bow roller, no windlass, no nothing... (see also an earlier post of mine regarding electric windlass).

The boat's an older (1977 vintage) IOR one tonner design.
She can be quite 'wet' at times. Especially to windward she has submarine ambitions - frequently ploughing into waves. Freeboard is also quite low.
Taking all of this into account, I do not intend to leave the anchor on the bow when underway to avoid damage to the furling gear and topsides.
There is an anchor well, but this does not open on deck.
To remedy this would prove expensive - prohibitively so (teak deck).

So ideally I am looking for a modular anchor I can take apart and stow into one of the not so generously sized cockpit lockers.
I am considering the Mantus M1.

1. Anyone got any first hand experience of the Mantus M1?
2. Are there any other anchors with a modular design I should also be considering?

 

[Laminar Flow]

Please pardon the rather contentious thread tile.

I am currently researching which anchor to get for my boat.
There is currently no provision for any ground-tackle whatsoever - no bow roller, no windlass, no nothing... (see also an earlier post of mine regarding electric windlass).

The boat's an older (1977 vintage) IOR one tonner design.
She can be quite 'wet' at times. Especially to windward she has submarine ambitions - frequently ploughing into waves. Freeboard is also quite low.
Taking all of this into account, I do not intend to leave the anchor on the bow when underway to avoid damage to the furling gear and topsides.
There is an anchor well, but this does not open on deck.
To remedy this would prove expensive - prohibitively so (teak deck).

So ideally I am looking for a modular anchor I can take apart and stow into one of the not so generously sized cockpit lockers.
I am considering the Mantus M1.

1. Anyone got any first hand experience of the Mantus M1?
2. Are there any other anchors with a modular design I should also be considering?

I commend you on your bravery for starting this thread.

I haven't experience with the M1, but I do with the Kobra II. It can be disassembled by removal of a single bolt, though I'm really not so sure how practical that might be in reality. The Kobra won the comparative anchor tests by the German magazine "Die Yacht" on three separate and consecutive occasions.
After using CQR and various flat anchors for well over forty years, I am continuously and pleasantly surprised by the Kobra's aggressive behaviour on any sea bed I have yet encountered. A final bonus for us was that we didn't have to actually sell the boat to buy one.

Another option would be of course an aluminum anchor to keep the weight out of the bows. Our Dutch friend is pretty happy with his Spade. A Fortress type could be set in chocks on the foredeck and would save you having to lug it around when needed.

 

[Jamie Dundee]

The Kobra folds up quite neatly. Kobra® anchor - Plough anchors - Kobra, SOC & DC - Anchors - Mooring & Tenders | Plastimo, happy boating to you

 

[Laminar Flow]

The Kobra folds up quite neatly. Kobra® anchor - Plough anchors - Kobra, SOC & DC - Anchors - Mooring & Tenders | Plastimo, happy boating to you

Up to 12kg it has a (quick) folding mechanism, above that size they are secured with a bolt.
I know that quite a few people had the mechanism welded shut - might not have been that practical in retrospect.
Still think it is a good anchor for the price.

 

[Jamie Dundee]

Up to 12kg it has a (quick) folding mechanism, above that size they are secured with a bolt.
I know that quite a few people had the mechanism welded shut - might not have been that practical in retrospect.
Still think it is a good anchor for the price.

Been really pleased with mine, my experience similar to yours. Mine doesn’t have a bolt, only a ‘mechanism‘ to unhinge it. Default position is closed under pressure so don’t envisage a problem.

Edited to add; I have the 10kg Kobra, not the Kobra 2.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

If you're going to have to lug it from one end of the boat to the other the only type for which this will not cease to be fun very quickly is a fortress.

 

[noelex]

The Mantus M1 is an excellent anchor. I have numerous photos showing the setting performance of the Mantus (along with many other designs) in this thread:
Photos of Anchors Setting - Page 141 - Cruisers & Sailing Forums

The Mantus can be unbolted into three pieces that store almost completely flat. This makes it easier to carry a spare anchor, however, the assembly process involves 6 bolts. This is not practical to contemplate every time you want to anchor.

The steel Spade may be a better solution in your case. This is still an excellent anchor. It is bulkier when disassembled, as the ballasted fluke is still a rather awkward shape, but there are only two parts and one bolt.

 

[Poey50]

Definitely add a suitably sized Viking (5?) to your shortlist. High holding for the weight and readily assembled / disassembled. It seems to be showing up well in comparative tests.

Viking Anchors - Viking Anchor

 

[[2574]]

If you're going to have to lug it from one end of the boat to the other the only type for which this will not cease to be fun very quickly is a fortress.

I dismantled my fortress for the first time yesterday, I was astonished at how easy it was. Reassembly too. I’ve struggled stowing it for the past decade. Doh!

 

[thinwater]

Unless you are truly offshore, not having an anchor ready to go is a significant risk. I'd take the time to create secure on-deck storage for one good anchor, rather than faff around with take-apart anchors you won't be able to assembly in critical moments. If you are within sight of land, you really need an anchor ready to go.

(I have nothing against take-apart anchors. Could be handy. But I feel like even on a small boat, the bower should be ready to go and the kedge should be in a convinient place, in one piece. A back-up could be in the bilge, or possibly the bower for a multi-day passage, if the weather suggests it.)

 

[LiftyK]

I have used a Mantus M1 for several years. It sets well in areas where my Delta did not and I really like it. Sometimes it lives in an anchor well, with the shank facing forward and protruding out from under the front of the locker lid. At other times I connect the anchor shackle to my toe rail to hold it position on the anchor roller. To prevent the anchor from damaging the gel coat while underway I also have an snubber. Mantus calls it anchor guard though I vaguely recall buying it as an anchor mate. My modest sized boat, like yours, does occasionally travel through waves. The snubber keeps the anchor secure This setup works well and I’m happy to leave the anchor in the bow roller in any weather.

Although I purchased my anchor in a flat pack and it went together easily, I would agree with noelex that you probably don’t want to be assembling it while underway. The bolts are smeared with grease so it would be a messy job.

I’m aware of reports that suggest the shank angle of the Mantus, which seems to contribute to its fast and reliable setting, may limit holding power. While I have not ridden out any storms with my Mantus I can report that on two occasions I have held fast while friends around me have dragged their anchors.

 

[Koeketiene]

Thanks all for the input.
Will stake a closer look at the Kobra and Viking.
Not too sure about the fortress. Don't quite see how leaving it in place (should the conditions warrant it) on the bow roller would be possible. OTOH, it's the lightest of the lot.

Don't envisage spending eons on the hook - an overnight stay at anchor (or even just stop for lunch) in benign conditions are far more likely.
As stowage space is at a premium, I am tempted to go for the one that takes up the least space and is the easiest to assemble/take apart.

 

[dunedin]

Starting from a boat with not even a bow roller, why not take a Scandinavian approach- as many / most of their boats don‘t seem to have any bow anchor and merely a stern one. Looks odd the first time I saw a boat anchored well away from shore, stern to the wind
PS. We have a Rocna as a kedge, the roll bar makes it very easy to carry around as a handle!

 

[Laminar Flow]

Starting from a boat with not even a bow roller, why not take a Scandinavian approach- as many / most of their boats don‘t seem to have any bow anchor and merely a stern one. Looks odd the first time I saw a boat anchored well away from shore, stern to the wind
PS. We have a Rocna as a kedge, the roll bar makes it very easy to carry around as a handle!

True, but has more to do with the choice of cruising grounds where it is common to secure the stern out and tie the bow off to shore, close enough so as to be able to step off onto the rocks. Something I should not be trying any time soon in Brittany.

 

[Tranona]

Thanks all for the input.
Will stake a closer look at the Kobra and Viking.
Not too sure about the fortress. Don't quite see how leaving it in place (should the conditions warrant it) on the bow roller would be possible. OTOH, it's the lightest of the lot.

Don't envisage spending eons on the hook - an overnight stay at anchor (or even just stop for lunch) in benign conditions are far more likely.
As stowage space is at a premium, I am tempted to go for the one that takes up the least space and is the easiest to assemble/take apart.

With that usage pattern a Fortress on 10m 8mm chain and 30m rope would seem appropriate - and no need for a windlass! You might even consider a removable bow roller which is what some modern equivalents of your style of boat use. Your needs as you describe them are very different from those here who debate the finer points of the huge range of anchoring setups designed for use in a wide range of conditions.

 

[RJJ]

Thanks all for the input.
Will stake a closer look at the Kobra and Viking.
Not too sure about the fortress. Don't quite see how leaving it in place (should the conditions warrant it) on the bow roller would be possible. OTOH, it's the lightest of the lot.

Don't envisage spending eons on the hook - an overnight stay at anchor (or even just stop for lunch) in benign conditions are far more likely.
As stowage space is at a premium, I am tempted to go for the one that takes up the least space and is the easiest to assemble/take apart.

+1 for Fortress, mounted flat (assembled) in chocks lying on the foredeck, or vertically in chocks so the shaft is lashed to the mast if you want to keep the foredeck free. A Fortress for your sized boat is only 5kg or 7kg if I remember correctly.

I agree with thinwater: I don't fancy a full-fat galvanised anchor in the cockpit, which you have to assemble, carry forwards (with chain) manhandle over the bow roller and all that jazz. Sure, you could do it, but it would seem to me a major constraint on your cruising even in good weather. In foul weather, if you needed your anchor quickly, it's a non-starter. And I'm guessing cockpit locker space isn't abundant?

Stern anchoring also a strong possibility.

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

I have a Fortress Guardian (cant remember the weight) kept in the locker as a secondary anchor (main anchor is a 16kg Kobra 2). The Fortress Guardian is aluminium, very light, it folds flat and holds extremely well and probably would suit your requirements as it is so easy to move around and to store away.

 

[Black Sheep]

My own solution (in a smaller boat) was to run enough chain from the samson post to get me over the chafe point of the bowroller; then enough octoplait to run the length of the boat outside everything, then back into the cockpit from the stern. Shackle it to enough chain for max likely water depth with an anchor of choice (my choice was Knox). Anchor storage and deployment is from the stern, but the boat still swings from the bow. You might consider a Fortress or similar clipped to the sternrail. I like the solution. In my case, I really wanted to avoid working at the pointy end when anchoring, but I found I preferred dropping the hook over the back while slowly moving forward out of the shallow bit, to the old way of nosing into the shallow bit and waiting for the boat to stop and start making sternway.

A significant downside is that it's much harder to adjust the length of rode. I just decided to have enough rode for 10m depth at highest tide and that's that. The other pain is retrieval - you have to effectively turn the boat on the rode to get the chain to the stern, where you can pull it over the sternrail.

In many ways you get some of the advantages of stern anchoring (as per dunedin and RJJ), but the boat is pointing the conventional way, and you don't get wave slap on the stern or rain blowing in the hatch.

 

[Neeves]

You can source 'devices' to store assembled Fortress or Guardians (or have the devices made) on pushpins or pulpits. Check the Fortress website for sources from memory California then make your own (or have them made). Both the aluminium Spade or Excel (source the latter from Jimmy Green) disassemble. The Mantus has the same ultimate hold as a Delta or CQR - so half that of a Spade, Excel, Viking or Rocna. Mantus also takes twice as far to set/engage as the newer better models Spade/Excel etc). Kobra is a good choice but though it folds it does not disassemble - so might still be difficult to store. Assuming a 15kg steel anchor of good hold, Spade/Excel/Rocna/Kobra (not Mantus) you would need 30kg to get the same ultimate hold for Mantus as 15kg Spade) then an aluminium anchor offering the same hold, Spade/Excel/Fortress would weight 8kg and a Viking around 10kg, its made from thinner HT steel)). The cheapest option, by a lot, is Kobra followed by Viking.

Carrying a 15kg anchor down a side deck in a bit of chop is really not a recommended practice, especially if its young crew (quite possible, but also quite possible to drop it, and dropping a 15kg anchor will do nothing for your teak decks).

An anchor is meant to be a safety device and ready for instant deployment (though I wonder how many have had the need). But with this in mind storing down in the bilges is really not a good idea and a complex assembly demand, Fortress, Viking, Mantus is hardly ideal (if a primary anchor - I would store assembled). Consider how you could store on deck, preferably as far forward as possible (cabin roof, base of mast). The RNLI store their Spades on the foredeck - but they don't have sails nor a teak deck to contend with. We have stored a fully assembled anchor at the mast base. We store our second rode, 15m of 6mm HT chain and 40m of 12mm 3 ply nylon, in a milk crate (neatly coil the rope inside the perimeter of the crate and drop the chain into the hole in the centre) works well and is easy to carry around (and deploy from a dinghy). You do need to religiously coil neatly when you retrieve. Our 8kg Excel, Fortress and Spade (all aluminium) set well using our mixed rode as does the Viking - no need for a windlass nor lots of chain.

Given your constraints and described usage, and recalling your thread on windlass, I would initially postpone the windlass and all the implications, and use the rode in the milk crate option. You should really have 2 anchors anyway, people do lose their anchor , and would thus consider a Fortress as the second anchor - go for the Fortress (anecdotally commonly available on eBay) and see how you get on. In the meantime mull over how to store a primary anchor. I think you will find the Spade and Excel aluminium options prohibitively expensive (but very manageable) and perfectly adequate and my fall back would be Kobra or Viking. The Viking is good in that it has good hold, good reviews and you can use a lighter option, so its cheaper, than other steel anchors (for the same hold). No assembled steel anchor is going to be easy to store - so that might be your initial focus.

I have extensively tested all the anchors I mention and use the aluminium Fortress, Excel and Spade (all 8kg) as primaries. I would use the 10kg Viking but we cannot cope with a roll bar. We would happily use a 15kg Kobra (we have one (welded up) but an 8kg aluminium or 10kg Viking is much more sensible. Our yacht is a 38' cat and our primary rode 75m of high tensile 6mm chain (Maxwell windlass). We have been using the 6mm HT chain and aluminium anchors now for almost 10 years and cruise to SW Tasmania (think Southern Ocean, Roaring Forties).

Jonathan

 

[Neeves]

Koeketiene

The advice you have received might enjoy some qualification.

There is a serious and far reaching trend to ignore the sizing charts developed by anchor manufacturers and to buy bigger and bigger anchors. You may subscribe to the idea.

The point is being reached where anchors are being recommended where people are not using 'anchors' but portable (and heavy) moorings. Again you might subscribe to the concept. I think anchors should work better, or worse, by design - not weight - again you might not agree.

It merits observation that some of the people offering their advice are using, and their advise is based on using, anchors much larger than the anchor maker would recommend for the size of yacht to which the anchor is fitted.

Consequently recommending an anchor without defining how the anchor is used and thus denying the OP, you in this case, opportunity to evaluate or weigh the recommendation might be considered misleading.

I might urge caution until such time as you have ascertained precisely what is being recommended and how it is being used.

You seem to imply you are considering not storing your anchor on the bow roller (I understand you might not have a bow roller (yet). If you are considering storing in a cockpit locker or in the bilges then weight (when you carry the anchor for deployment) will be a consideration and choosing an anchor that needs to be oversized, overweight, will not really be ideal for you and design will be more critical. I think you are also implying that the anchor would be used for lunch stops, rather than overnight, I'd suggest that though lunch stops might be foremost in your mind - you would be better considering the necessity to carry an anchor as a safety device and it should thus be able to hold you, overnight.


I mention our yacht size and rode to help you with your decision but also admit to a , well known, weight fetish, hence the 6mm high tensile rode (replacing 8mm chain), and the quiver of, exclusively, aluminium anchors, 8kg replacing the 15kg steel equivalents. Even 15kg steel anchors would be considered undersize by many - but I have tested most anchors and found our choice, Spade, Excel, Fortress (and Viking if we could accomodate a roll bar) to be totally reliable. We do deploy 2 anchors in a 'V' if winds at the masthead in an anchorage are to exceed 30 knots - not to offer more hold - but to reduce veering.

Take care, stay safe

Jonathan

Just something else to mull over.