flaming
Well-Known Member
That's a very interesting claim. I would be very interested to see a photo of your Jib when reefed shot from the middle of the foot to the head when hard on the wind.
When do you put a reef in?
- Thread starter BelleSerene
- Start date
That's a very interesting claim. I would be very interested to see a photo of your Jib when reefed shot from the middle of the foot to the head when hard on the wind.
Sailfree
Well-Known Member
Word of warning - have you ever tried to hoist main in reefed position. Boat is 43' jeanneau with fully battened main.
We came unstuck last year on cherbourg scuttlebutt trip.
Had boat for 12yrs and it always reefed down OK BUT never tried reefing main before hoisting it.
We have single line reefing. Discovered that with sail in stack pack trying to reef down friction bought reefing block on sail hard against mast guide and prevented reefing.
We then motored head to wind to try to hoist full main in 32kts of wind (plus enough boat speed sufficient to maintain steerage) intending to then take in reefs. Sea was rough. But before we could reef down the flogging main sail shook a reefing block shackle loose. Swinging block threatened to brain crew!
Now revising reefing system reducing ropes to 10mm (Not sure why jeanneau fitted 12mm from new), fitting smaller reefing blocks which are ball bearing blocks with locking shackles.
Will no longer pass ropes through mast guides.
On 43' a single line 3rd reef single line would be too long so the single line third reef was only on leech and had to put luff over horn on boom, necessitating going up to the mast in the worse of reefing conditions. Decided when I need third reef I will not be flying a spinnaker so now going to use pole downhaul clutch for an extra line for a new third reef luff line.
You never stop learning!
We came unstuck last year on cherbourg scuttlebutt trip.
Had boat for 12yrs and it always reefed down OK BUT never tried reefing main before hoisting it.
We have single line reefing. Discovered that with sail in stack pack trying to reef down friction bought reefing block on sail hard against mast guide and prevented reefing.
We then motored head to wind to try to hoist full main in 32kts of wind (plus enough boat speed sufficient to maintain steerage) intending to then take in reefs. Sea was rough. But before we could reef down the flogging main sail shook a reefing block shackle loose. Swinging block threatened to brain crew!
Now revising reefing system reducing ropes to 10mm (Not sure why jeanneau fitted 12mm from new), fitting smaller reefing blocks which are ball bearing blocks with locking shackles.
Will no longer pass ropes through mast guides.
On 43' a single line 3rd reef single line would be too long so the single line third reef was only on leech and had to put luff over horn on boom, necessitating going up to the mast in the worse of reefing conditions. Decided when I need third reef I will not be flying a spinnaker so now going to use pole downhaul clutch for an extra line for a new third reef luff line.
You never stop learning!
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LittleSister
Well-Known Member
I know that feeling!
Jeez,
you must be a lot more popular than me, in the Solent I usually have tons of space to round up and reef or do whatever I like - I hate this impression everyone is within touching distance, in fact separation is judged by fractions of miles, not metres !
I remember heaving to in the Solent so we could make a cup of tea and sandwich in the little boat we had at the time. We sat there having our lunch, and were trying to make out whether a friend of ours was among the Folkboats racing some distance away, when they suddenly turned and all headed straight for us. By the time we were sure what was happening it was best to just sit there as the fleet passed either side if us - any move would have disadvantaged one or other of them.
lw395
Well-Known Member
We frequently start off with a reefed main.
Even with plain old slab reefing, isn't it normal to manually get the reef lines into shape, as hauling on them when they are wrapped in a stowed sail is always going to jam or generally end in tears? Best case it's rubbing your sail in an unnecessary way.
I think I've sailed on four boats with single line reefing. One it worked brilliantly, the others it was more trouble than help.
Two line systems where the rams horn is replaced by tack lines are my favourite.
Of course if you reef the sail before stowing it, everything is simple....
BelleSerene
Well-Known Member
I just did myself a huge favour and invested in a job lot of 8mm (polyester sheathed) dyneema for my reefing lines - 8mm is the thinnest that'll work in the rope clutches and the winch jammers. The lines go from boom/ gooseneck up to low-friction rings which I've soft-shackled to the reefing eyes, back down again, (the leech ones through the boom), and all four aft to the coachroof. (I make the soft shackles myself so they're not expensive.)
The combination of dyneema (low stretch so the sail doesn't become over-powered when reefing lines stretch in use), thinner lines to reduce friction against sail and blocks, and low-friction rings has revolutionised both reefing and shaking reefs out under way for me. I can also now easily pull a reef on by hand with the sail in its stack pack, before hoisting the main in the reefed position.
I appreciate that you have single-line reefing - that'll make it harder to do. I wonder if it strengthens the case for using thinner lines? My boat's a 39' Beneteau and the battens aren't full length.
Seajet
...
So you weren't doing anything wrong and everyone had tons of space - racing fleets can choose where they like but cannot monopolise areas - you should just have a camera ready or shorts to drop and ' moon ' - whichever is applicable !
flaming
Well-Known Member
Had this a lot on my dad's old Dufour. Even when the sail had been reefed before being dropped, if you then just tried to hoist to the same reef it would frequently jam up, or you'd lose the lovely shape you had before. I put this down to the fact that when you drop the sail you effectively reduce the tension in the reefing line and the leach line will therefore pull a bit of line through the boom. So when you rehoist everything has moved a bit.
So what you need to do is to mark your lines. If you're hoisting to a reef then what you do is pre feed your reefing line to about 2 -3 foot short of "made". Then hoist your halyard to the mark before finishing off by tensioning the reefing line.
jimi
Well-Known Member
I keep on promising myself to do that!
DannyB
Well-Known Member
I sail a 39 foot Jeanneau, and I effectively reef every time I drop the sail, if I don't, the reeling lines get tangled. When I hoist the sail I just decide whether I want the full rig, one reef, or two reefs, and open the appropriate clutches. It seems to work. Just dropping the sail used to result in loops of reefing line getting tangled up everywhere.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Probably won't look too pretty when rolled down for heavier winds. The jib was recut from new on advice of the sailmaker who says it was effective on similar boats compared with a padded luff. Not had enough experience in heavier winds yet, but seems to set well in the 16-20 range.
SimonFa
Well-Known Member
+1
I set off from Studland towards Weymouth in light airs yesterday knowing the forecast was going to be westerly gusting +17kts. I started with 2 reefs in and as I round Old Harry the wind was 6 to 7 AWS. By the time I reached Swanage Bay it was up at 15 AWS and I was staring to be glad of one reef. By Durleston Head, which is always very windy in a westerly it was up to 21AWS and I knew I'd made the right call. The most I had was 25kts and with the traveller all the way out that was reasonably , although I should probably have reeled the headsail.
For me reef 1 is about 12kts TWSif I'm likely to go anywhere near close haul and reef 2 at 16kts.
jimi
Well-Known Member
When I replaced my genoa I got it made a bit smaller with effectively one reef in it. The logic was that in light conditions I'd probably use the cruising chute and the genoa would set perfectly in the F4/5 range as well as having a better shape in heavier winds. I have'nt regretted that decision.
RupertW
Well-Known Member
Nor me - upwind I think the full length luff makes it fine even in lighter winds but I do notice in the 10- 15 knot range reaching that I'm not quite prepared to put up the asymmetric but I'm sure I could get more speed out of a bigger Genoa like my previous one.
thecommander
Well-Known Member
Are people really rounding up to reef? I go close hauled, sheet the main out then do all the reefing business. I can do this singlehanded.
SimonFa
Well-Known Member
bitbaltic
Well-Known Member
Previous threads on this topic have featured several people starting the engine to do it.
We just release the halyard clutch and let it run through until the whipping for the appropriate reef is just through the jaws. Then we winch in the (single line) reefing line until the whipping which says it is set is just about to run into the clutch- job done. We can do this becuase the main will drop under its own weight on any point of sail in all the winds we have tried it in (which I guess is up to a F6 to windward and maybe a 5 downwind).
BelleSerene
Well-Known Member
How do you get it to do that?! I just reduced a lot of friction in mine with a PTFE spray lube on lugs that haul up the mast track - but it'll still only fall all the way down when head to wind, and way off the wind I wouldn't have a hope! What's your secret?!
Sailfree
Well-Known Member
Good point reefing down before you drop the main so ready to hoist in reefed position.
With a fully battened main I cannot reef down except by motoring head to wind. I do have ruggerson main ball bearing cars.
With a fully battened main I cannot reef down except by motoring head to wind. I do have ruggerson main ball bearing cars.
westhinder
Well-Known Member
A big + 1
With such a set-up we can reef on most points of sail and frequently put in the appropriate number of reefs before hoisting.
What's more, taking in a reef is literally 2 minutes' work. 39 footer, FB main.
Major_Clanger
Well-Known Member
'Stokey' Woodhall, an RYA instructor in the 1980s had some sage words, "The time to reef is when you first think of it, and the time to shake it out is after your first cup of tea!"