flaming
Well-Known Member
Bit of shell shock coupled with a kicker that was left hard on and a Driver who failed to recognise why the boat wasn't answering the helm once the kite was on its way down I would suggest.
What would you have done differently?
- Thread starter maxcampbell
- Start date
Bit of shell shock coupled with a kicker that was left hard on and a Driver who failed to recognise why the boat wasn't answering the helm once the kite was on its way down I would suggest.
maxcampbell
Well-Known Member
That suggests that the only thing that should have been done is slackening the kicker, and that without doing this, nothing else would work. My gaffer doesn't have a kicker, and she's always got lots of canvas a long way forward, so I've never got in a pickle like this, and it wouldn't have been my helming instinct to focus on slackening the kicker.
The point is to me that she's dead in the water - it looks to me as though the helm is trying to bear away but she's lying as though hove to. I'd have been torn between hardening in and trying to get some way on before tacking (but then you've got all the gear in the water), and doing anything to get her head pulled round & carry on downwind.
flaming
Well-Known Member
Yes, exactly.
Yes, and releasing the kicker at this point is like a magic switch. Suddenly you can bear away.
We do this practically every week when milling about waiting for a start with just the main up. Modern boats aren't especially handy with just the main up, and if you let the speed drop too much you get stuck on a reach with full rudder on and nothing happening. Then you just call for someone to dump the kicker and hey presto bearing away can happen again.
mcframe
Well-Known Member
But all men must wait for time and tide (Especially those with drying moorings) ;-)
trapezeartist
Well-Known Member
Once they were in the mess, several people have suggested blowing the spinny halyard. I agree: in dinghy circles it's called a Dransfield Drop. Other than trying to get out of a serious mess, the real idea is that if you can't sail high enough to reach a wing mark you blow the halyard and sheet in hard. The spinny rustles quietly behind the main while you point up to make the mark. Once there, re-hoist, gybe and off you go.
In this case, it would have been blow the halyard, sheet in on the port sheet and then recover the sail over the rail. All very easy, while sitting here at my keyboard.
In this case, it would have been blow the halyard, sheet in on the port sheet and then recover the sail over the rail. All very easy, while sitting here at my keyboard.
William_H
Well-Known Member
Releasing the kikker
The kicker or boom vang holds the boom down when the mainsheet is released so boom can swing way out when running. The vang holds the leach (aft edge of mainsail) tight so holding the top of the sal up against the wind.
Releasing the kicker allows the top of the main to fall away and the middle of the leach to also fall away.
The value of releasing the kicker depends on wind direction. So when running with wind behind you releasing the kicker will not make that much difference. However on a reach or when the boat rounds up to a reach it can make a lot of difference to control. The heeling of the boat is largely from the pressure of the spin but releasing pressure from the main is the first step.
So when the pressure comes on and you are reaching the first step is to dump the main sheet then kicker then it is up to the helmsman to turn the boat down wind before she takes over and turns to windward. It is hard to recover the boat direction once it heels and rounds up so you have to get in first.
Running square downwind is a lot easier. But you must avoid those rhythmic oscillations which when they heel the boat can cause it to round up to windward or in this case to bear away uncontrolled to leeward.
Again helms mans vigilance is all important. As soon as you get heel you lose rudder power while the hull shape and sail pressure outboard of the hull give you a round up (or round down) very quickly.
My point is that dumping the kicker is not the panacea for all spin problems. olewill
The kicker or boom vang holds the boom down when the mainsheet is released so boom can swing way out when running. The vang holds the leach (aft edge of mainsail) tight so holding the top of the sal up against the wind.
Releasing the kicker allows the top of the main to fall away and the middle of the leach to also fall away.
The value of releasing the kicker depends on wind direction. So when running with wind behind you releasing the kicker will not make that much difference. However on a reach or when the boat rounds up to a reach it can make a lot of difference to control. The heeling of the boat is largely from the pressure of the spin but releasing pressure from the main is the first step.
So when the pressure comes on and you are reaching the first step is to dump the main sheet then kicker then it is up to the helmsman to turn the boat down wind before she takes over and turns to windward. It is hard to recover the boat direction once it heels and rounds up so you have to get in first.
Running square downwind is a lot easier. But you must avoid those rhythmic oscillations which when they heel the boat can cause it to round up to windward or in this case to bear away uncontrolled to leeward.
Again helms mans vigilance is all important. As soon as you get heel you lose rudder power while the hull shape and sail pressure outboard of the hull give you a round up (or round down) very quickly.
My point is that dumping the kicker is not the panacea for all spin problems. olewill
flaming
Well-Known Member
No indeed. My point was that once their kite was down, and they couldn't bear away, it was the one thing that would have let them bear away.
Crabman
Well-Known Member
9 UP that's the problem and dip pole gybing, what a laugh.
simonfraser
Well-Known Member
as said, they obviously had probs controlling the boat.
so if that near the shore, i'd dump the anchor over the bow, sort the mess and start sailing . . .
so if that near the shore, i'd dump the anchor over the bow, sort the mess and start sailing . . .
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jon711
Well-Known Member
?
I've been dinghy sailing over 30 years, including championship results.... Never heard ofa Dransfield drop..... Would love to hear more info, just for future reference... Not that it will be much help in the Blaze, but, may help in the Merlin....
I've been dinghy sailing over 30 years, including championship results.... Never heard ofa Dransfield drop..... Would love to hear more info, just for future reference... Not that it will be much help in the Blaze, but, may help in the Merlin....
kingfisher
Well-Known Member
Spinnaker newbie question: how do you "strap down a spinnaker"?
flaming
Well-Known Member
Pole further forward than it should be for the wind angle. Also lower. Tweaker on hard to get the clews level and oversheet it a bit. Think of flattening it and hiding it behind the main a bit.
kingfisher
Well-Known Member
But this is a gybe. So at some point you have to open the beak of the pole, where the sail flies freely, as was the case in this video, where it all goes pear shaped once they release the spi.
flaming
Well-Known Member
It was going pear shaped well before they released the pole - the boat was in control of the driver. Simply put they shouldn't have tried to gybe until they'd settled the boat down.
However, to strap it down through thr gybe;
Tweaker on hard on both sides, so once it's off the pole and on the sheets it won't come up at all. Over sheet slightly on both sides, then try and grind it round to match the rotation of the boat.
Any way you cut it, Symetrical Gybes in 30 knots are not easy. But getting them right when the rest of the fleet is falling over, or chickening out of hoisting at all, will win you races.
