What happens when the fuel just becomes too dear?

[Lakesailor]

Quite.

had a meal, taken a look around the place he has visited,while it is open

that can be done after a car journey. The journey itself seems not to be the object, but the destination. So take a car drive or a ferry if it's across the channel.
Or, of course, spend the extra £97.

It is your choice.

 

[Bajansailor]

Aye, I think too many folk with fast motor cruisers have forgotten what it is like to go boating to enjoy the journey, as well as arrive at the destination.
If fuel prices continue to go through the roof in countries where they love to add 75%+ taxes on, then it really makes sense (and cents, $$$s rather) to think about life in the slow lane, and enjoy the passage.
And if a storm is forecast for 5 or 6 hours time, and you will take 10 hours to get to the destination that the planing boat would reach in 3 or 4, there is always manana..... (ok, maybe not if you are cash rich, time poor, with limited holidays).

May I commend to all mobos (both planing and displacement) the Marine Power Source digital magazines published annually by John Deere?
Here is a link to the 2012 Recreational Boating issue :
http://www.deere.com/wps/dcom/en_US...agazine/marine_recreational_powersource.page?

Click on the magazine to download it.

On page 6 there is a nice article about Steve Dashew's FPD 64, and on page 12 a write up about the Nordhavn 40 - she is 23 tonnes displacement, yet can cross oceans at 7 knots happily, burning approx 1 litre per mile, which is rather better than many planing boats not much bigger who are looking at gallons per mile instead.

They also publish annual Commercial and Industrial Power Source digital magazines - all good reading.

 

[Firefly625]

the future? quite convincing... able to be developed for marine use.... who knows?



http://automobiles.honda.com/fcx-clarity/

 

[Firefly625]

But how much of that decrease is down to lower usage and how much down to the fact that you don't sell people's weekly shopping and give them a voucher for 5p off a litre as they're leaving the car park?

I think people's fuel buying habits have changed in the last 10 years.

Henry

to a degree, however we dropped .5m litres from 2010 to 2011, No new supermarkets have been built around us for 8years.

 

[PaulGooch]

If you are try visiting before the place closrs, although to do this you will need a mobo

Or could could leave earlier ?

 

[Whitelighter]

Or you could buy something that is powered by the wind and can still comfotable cruise at 15-18knts and can top 24 knts

 

[Momac]

Aye, I think too many folk with fast motor cruisers have forgotten what it is like to go boating to enjoy the journey, as well as arrive at the destination.
.

Couldn't agree more.
Being river based I enjoy taking it steady , which also has the advantage of being economical on fuel. Even greater economy can be achieved on tidal rivers by making use of tidal flow as free fuel.
For me the enjoyment is the journey , relaxing and taking things steady, taking in the views and stopping off at out of the way places.
I do occasionally get to go fast and it is a satisfying experience - it can make some jorneys possible/safer that could be troublesome at a slow pace.
Increasing fuel prices may well make some slow down a bit.

 

[bumpy_the_dog]

Let's face it, the circumstances that currently allow the wealthiest 10-20% of the population to own and operate a mobo if they wish, well those circumstances were an historical anomaly. As well as fuel prices there are at least three other factors which will soon restrict mobos to the wealthiest 1-2% of the population instead of 10-20%.

First is house prices. If you'd not climbed a fair way up the housing ladder before about 2000 then you'll likely be carrying a pretty brutal mortgage. Furthermore, The Economist calculates that UK house prices, measured against long run rents, are still 28% overvalued. A lot of people basically funded a boat by releasing equity from their property. That's simply not going to happen for the forseeable future.

Second is pensions. Only three FTSE 100 companies now have final salary pension schemes that are open to new joiners. The collapse of good company pensions in the private sector means there won't be so many well heeled pensioners able to afford boating, but instead there will be now many middle and senior managers faced with putting 15-20% of their income away to fund retirement.

Third is education. The average graduate today is carrying about £60k of debt. That's a decent mobo right there.

That's the big three mobo killers for the next decade or two. Add in rising fuel prices and a 50% top tax (60% marginal rate between £100k and £130k), and it's easy to see why sailing in general and mobos in particular will soon revert to being the hobby of the genuinely wealthy.

 

[henryf]

to a degree, however we dropped .5m litres from 2010 to 2011, No new supermarkets have been built around us for 8years.

I don't think that is necessarily relevant. As fuel prices rise people who previously bought off you because you were convenient change to buying off the already established shopping and a 5p voucher outlets.

I think the days of a pure petrol station may be limited in many locations. I have lost count of the number that are now Tesco Express, Co-Op, etc. that will also affect you. Need to get some petrol but also need a bottle of baby oil, some humus and a copy of this month's Steam Train Gazette so you double up on the stop.

Henry

 

[elton]

the future? quite convincing... able to be developed for marine use.... who knows?



http://automobiles.honda.com/fcx-clarity/

Looks about as much use as a chocolate fireguard.

 

[Lakesailor]

Let's face it, the circumstances that currently allow the wealthiest 10-20% of the population to own and operate a mobo if they wish, well those circumstances were an historical anomaly. As well as fuel prices there are at least three other factors which will soon restrict mobos to the wealthiest 1-2% of the population instead of 10-20%.

First is house prices.
Second is pensions.
Third is education.

That's the big three mobo killers for the next decade or two. Add in rising fuel prices and a 50% top tax (60% marginal rate between £100k and £130k), and it's easy to see why sailing in general and mobos in particular will soon revert to being the hobby of the genuinely wealthy.

I reckon that is a good assesment.
Yes, plenty of subjective comments on here from people who are still able to afford the hobby, but the reality is, objectively, that you are right.
That means a terrific number of boats will become unsaleable.

 

[Firefly625]

Looks about as much use as a chocolate fireguard.

Honda have developed a home heating system which as a by product produces hydrogen so you would actually be able to fill your car up at home, obviously there would also be a requirement for hydrogen fuel stations to be mainstream so we are talking future stuff, but that is what the OP's post was surely about.... so this "may" be the future, but of course at present it is very much at development stage. But not quite sure why its as much use as a chocolate fireguard?

 

[Firefly625]

I don't think that is necessarily relevant. As fuel prices rise people who previously bought off you because you were convenient change to buying off the already established shopping and a 5p voucher outlets.

I think the days of a pure petrol station may be limited in many locations. I have lost count of the number that are now Tesco Express, Co-Op, etc. that will also affect you. Need to get some petrol but also need a bottle of baby oil, some humus and a copy of this month's Steam Train Gazette so you double up on the stop.

Henry

You need to be doing volume, we do that and we have a busy shop and we in a superb location. 1800 cars visit our site every day (on average) so we are not going anywhere I'm glade to say! But Henry, surely you are not arguing against the fact that over the last decade cars have become more economical???

 

[elton]

But not quite sure why its as much use as a chocolate fireguard?

Where would you get the hydrogen from? How would you store and transport it? Hydrogen is a notoriously difficult fuel to handle, which is why no one uses it.

 

[henryf]

You need to be doing volume, we do that and we have a busy shop and we in a superb location. 1800 cars visit our site every day (on average) so we are not going anywhere I'm glade to say! But Henry, surely you are not arguing against the fact that over the last decade cars have become more economical???

They have but I think there are more of them.

Henry

 

[Firefly625]

They have but I think there are more of them.

Henry

and we both thank the Lord for that... ;-)

 

[Searush]

Let's face it, the circumstances that currently allow the wealthiest 10-20% of the population to own and operate a mobo if they wish, well those circumstances were an historical anomaly. As well as fuel prices there are at least three other factors which will soon restrict mobos to the wealthiest 1-2% of the population instead of 10-20%.

First is house prices. If you'd not climbed a fair way up the housing ladder before about 2000 then you'll likely be carrying a pretty brutal mortgage. Furthermore, The Economist calculates that UK house prices, measured against long run rents, are still 28% overvalued. A lot of people basically funded a boat by releasing equity from their property. That's simply not going to happen for the forseeable future.

Second is pensions. Only three FTSE 100 companies now have final salary pension schemes that are open to new joiners. The collapse of good company pensions in the private sector means there won't be so many well heeled pensioners able to afford boating, but instead there will be now many middle and senior managers faced with putting 15-20% of their income away to fund retirement.

Third is education. The average graduate today is carrying about £60k of debt. That's a decent mobo right there.

That's the big three mobo killers for the next decade or two. Add in rising fuel prices and a 50% top tax (60% marginal rate between £100k and £130k), and it's easy to see why sailing in general and mobos in particular will soon revert to being the hobby of the genuinely wealthy.

That may be true of the top end of the market, but you are forgetting the 50% plus of people with little old mobos & yachts on trailers or drying moorings. There are plenty of us about doing our sailing on a shoe string. I have a 31' ketch & spend less than 1500squid pa - half of which is my mooring fee in a lovely sheltered old World Heritage harbour. Many spend a lot less than me too.

 

[Seahope]

Let's face it, the circumstances that currently allow the wealthiest 10-20% of the population to own and operate a mobo if they wish, well those circumstances were an historical anomaly. As well as fuel prices there are at least three other factors which will soon restrict mobos to the wealthiest 1-2% of the population instead of 10-20%.

First is house prices. If you'd not climbed a fair way up the housing ladder before about 2000 then you'll likely be carrying a pretty brutal mortgage. Furthermore, The Economist calculates that UK house prices, measured against long run rents, are still 28% overvalued. A lot of people basically funded a boat by releasing equity from their property. That's simply not going to happen for the forseeable future.

Second is pensions. Only three FTSE 100 companies now have final salary pension schemes that are open to new joiners. The collapse of good company pensions in the private sector means there won't be so many well heeled pensioners able to afford boating, but instead there will be now many middle and senior managers faced with putting 15-20% of their income away to fund retirement.

Third is education. The average graduate today is carrying about £60k of debt. That's a decent mobo right there.

That's the big three mobo killers for the next decade or two. Add in rising fuel prices and a 50% top tax (60% marginal rate between £100k and £130k), and it's easy to see why sailing in general and mobos in particular will soon revert to being the hobby of the genuinely wealthy.

What a bleak analysis. Time to sell up now while there is some chance to escape then?

 

[oldgit]

"That may be true of the top end of the market" "There are plenty of us about doing our sailing on a shoe string."

A,men to that.

This forum in particular at times can very marina centric and ignore the fact that represents a smallish proportion of boaters .................
The vast majority of boats down here on the Medway and suspect on the east coast in general will never ever ever have graced the interior of a Marina ever,and inhabit a world of basic boatyards,mudberths,swinging moorings and the odd club berth.
This applies to both MoBos and especially sailing boats.
The average trip out may not approach much more than 30 odd miles in total and half of that at 6 knots max,so fuel is not the be all and end all of the matter.
The cost of running a boat can be well within the reach of the average man even now provided you are prepared to forego the pleasures of a fast flybridge addicted to permanent shorepower to keep the fridge and humidifier constantly on the go.
Around £1500 pa will get you a reasonable mooring and a lot less than that should you be prepared to join a decent Club and muck in with a bit of welding,painting,chain laying or my particular contribution hedge cutting.
The fuel consumption of boats above the lock must amount to pints rather than gallons*
*old money.
The displacement and repositioning of larger boats (by our standards) from the South coast to our local marinas has been noticeable over the last few years.
A possible financial migration has been going on for ages.

 

[ccscott49]

Is the eight hours of sitting doing nothing the eight hours of sailing extra to the mobo who had tied up, had a meal, taken a look around the place he has visited,while it is open, and the final 3 hours not being battered by a storm that has moved in earlier than expected. Or are you suggesting that the mobo would have nothing to do when he gets there. If you are try visiting before the place closrs, although to do this you will need a mobo

Then the sailboat or slow motorboat guy will have to go somewhere closer! or have two days doing it!