WHat Gear oils should i use for VOlvo Penta SX drive 1:51

There is no such thing as a water repellent in oil as oil by its very nature is a water repellent and has an additive called a detergent which cleans any water out of the engine, this is held in suspension by the dispersant and it naturally boils off when the oil reaches its working range.
 
Assassin said:
There is no such thing as a water repellent in oil as oil by its very nature is a water repellent and has an additive called a detergent which cleans any water out of the engine, this is held in suspension by the dispersant and it naturally boils off when the oil reaches its working range.
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Try reading here, it mentions the additives in the section on transmission oils. But sounds like you know better anyway.
https://www.volvopenta.com/marineleisure/en-en/for-owners/parts/maintenance-parts.html
 
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Assassin said:
There is no such thing as a water repellent in oil as oil by its very nature is a water repellent and has an additive called a detergent which cleans any water out of the engine, this is held in suspension by the dispersant and it naturally boils off when the oil reaches its working range.
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How can water be 'boiled off' in an outdrive? Either you haven't read this thread or you're talking out of your ...
 
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Often folks get sidetracked and polarise into groups on topics ,, the inability to see any other view apart from there own , it’s like they have made there mind up before posting .

I’d not be worried about any water absorption properties claimed or otherwise .

You don,t know when it leaked unless those few ( dry stack / land storage / low tide access etc ) can timely check the level and content via the top filler dip stick or what ever ?
Let’s talk about the LS function or otherwise of this oil .
Limited Slip .
You see the property I would look for is getting that right the LS or not ?

No LS or little means the cone clutch takes a hammering and transmits the power at a rapid rate - the weak link will fail .
Forums full of “ bushed props “
Some don,t know exactly how much much “ slip “ in my view will extend the life of the cone clutch AND the prop bush .
The greater the torque of the donor engine like the latest D6 the more slippy the gear oil needs to be .

So this begs the Q is the VP stuff ( as well as claimed water mitigating additives ) got the right slippery ness ?

I,am coming from a classic car background gearbox oil in transaxles .
Boggo 75/90 is not good enough for some marques they suggest adding a slip additive or using brand x with like VP claims to have the correct additives in this case slip additive for the liner slip diffs .
You see if it does not slip the gears and bearings take the strain on acceleration out of bends resulting in premature failures.

So back to VP gear lub .
Is a bit of slipping beneficial interns of cone clutch engagement and prop bush life for the first 2/3 secs when the torque is unleashed in a heavy boat ?


Assuming water gets in ,that’s inevitable if it’s not trapped in the emulsion it will evaporate off but stay in the case , condense back when cold and being salty - well I don,t need to explain what happens next .
So any “ special “ additive that end up minimising water coming out is a good feature ,
The Q here seems to be VP claim is BS and Boggo 75/90 from Liddel @ a fraction of the cost etc is just as good .

All things considered for the price and hassle of a breakdown , I would and did use the correct VP branded stuff and would suggest other do .

Residuals - take a moment to reflect a potential buyer reaction revising the previous SH ?? I don,t think a Fleetguard oil filter is gonna upset the apple cart ( one every year mind ) - - but AN OTHER drive oil - hmm .

False economy- on so many levels

My 0.002 p worth .
 
AllanG said:
Can anyone tell me what the SIGNIFICANT advantages are that VP claim their transmission oil has over other transmission oils that meet the VP SAE/API requirements?? Sounds like marketing bull IMHO!
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I certainly can't but one assumes that spurious claims of "advanced additive technology with unique capability to minimize water contamination damage" would meet with fines from the ASA and other authorities.

But this really is very simple. If you don't believe Volvo's claims and are happy for a future buyer thinking you've scrimped on maintenance then get the cheap stuff and save £20-£40 or whatever.
 
petem said:
How can water be 'boiled off' in an outdrive? Either you haven't read this thread or you're talking out of your ...
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Many things are boiled off and not just moisture, dispersants break down many things and many are turned into gases which are also evaporated off. All engines and drives have some form or method of ventilating them off and not necessarily through a breather, some may have breathers and some may simply have enough internal clearances to allow any gases to escape.
 
AllanG said:
Can anyone tell me what the SIGNIFICANT advantages are that VP claim their transmission oil has over other transmission oils that meet the VP SAE/API requirements?? Sounds like marketing bull IMHO!
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That's exactly what it is, consider that many manufacturers make oil for Volvo and on engines alone you can throw a dart at a list of oil manufacturers and they will have an oil meeting VP VDS 4.5, 4, 3, and 2 which means they Meet and exceed the VP specifications; the same applies for transmissions.
 
Lets look at Europe alone and see who makes transmission oil to the required specifications:

Mobil, Texaco, Shell, Amsoil, Fuchs, Chevron, BP Castrol, Cator, Comma, Esso, Jetlube, Kluber, Kuwait, Lubot, Lokoil, Mol, Morris, Millers, Motul, OMV, PETRONAS, Quaker, Repsol, Rockoil, Statoil, Texaco, and Total.

And they all have VP approvals for the required specifications.
 
Lets look at Europe only and see who makes transmission fluid for these drives:

Mobil, Texaco, Shell, Amsoil, Fuchs, Chevron, BP Castrol, Cator, Comma, Esso, Jetlube, Kluber, Kuwait, Lubat, Lukoil, Mol, Morris, Millers, Motul, OMV, PETRONAS, Quaker, Repsol, Rockoil, Statoil, Total.

And they all meet and exceed the required VP specifications for this outdrive.
 
Assassin said:
Lets look at Europe only and see who makes transmission fluid for these drives:

Mobil, Texaco, Shell, Amsoil, Fuchs, Chevron, BP Castrol, Cator, Comma, Esso, Jetlube, Kluber, Kuwait, Lubat, Lukoil, Mol, Morris, Millers, Motul, OMV, PETRONAS, Quaker, Repsol, Rockoil, Statoil, Total.

And they all meet and exceed the required VP specifications for this outdrive.
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Then why don,t VP endorse there gear oil products on the label on the back in the small print ?
Thing is manufacturers endorse on the label other products like say MAN spec 3275 , Volvo VD5 etc for brand XYZ engine oils .
There are really two ways to think about this and they can never be reconciled -- you just have to decide which camp you join.

One school of thought says that the API (American Petroleum Institute) standards are designed to ensure that lubricating oils have a specific set of performance characteristics and so anything that has the same API grade as the Volvo oil should be perfectly acceptable (and cannot lead to refusal to honor a warranty claim). GL-5 or what ever spec is the severe duty rating for gear oils and is very commonly specified for differentials and other car based none marine components.

If you think that way, look at the Volvo gear lube container -- it will say for example- API GL-5 with the viscosity rating 75W-140. There are many other brands meeting those specifications such as Mobil or Red Line that will have the same API classification. Any of those brands should be suitable replacements since the entire point of the API standards is just that -- to ensure that customers can know which oil is deemed suitable by the manufacturer for the service requirement and use any brand of oil they choose that has the same API classification.

The other school of thought is the "why take a chance" point of view. The API standards are minimums -- nothing stops a manufacturer like Volvo from specifying an additive package that goes beyond what is required to get the API rating.
In fact that’s where there term “ unique “ VP quote , possibly enters into the equation from a misleading advertising POV .Especially in litigation trigger happy USA .

Volvo is not in the oil refining business. They went to a refiner (Shell, Exxon or the like) and said "produce gear oil for me that has these specifications and put it in these containers with my label on it." The great mystery is whether Volvo just said "make us API GL-5 75W140" or whether their additive specification is different.
We know the Volvo gear oil is GL-5 because the API would not allow that to be on the label if it had not been tested to meet the standard. If you use a brand other than Volvo, you are betting that Volvo has not included other additives that may give their oil better properties for their gear sets. For example it’s ability to cope better with water ingress ,but there be other benefits .
There is just no way of knowing this unless someone who actually knows spills the beans -- and you can be sure they won't, project fear sells .
The cost difference is probably due primarily to higher profit margins and the expense of branding it and running a separate distribution channel through the Volvo dealers.

Other manufacturers without retail service networks do not take the branded oil approach. For example, I have twin disc gearboxes and MAN Diesels.

Both company’s has a two page lists there respective user manual s of dozens of approved lubricant brands that meet the specifications for there products .
The gearbox oil Twin Disc recommend is straight weight 30W that stays a nice color throughout the service interval.

How ever with your drive oils ( water I guess excepted) you could note the colour at the annual service if the oil is sub spec then -- within 20-30 hours of running probably because it is starting to break down from the heat and extremely heavy loads from a marine drive application then it’s not doing its job .
When I had a VP set up I recall them in the engine section giving a list of engine oils spec and indeed the VP authorised yard sold engine oil from another brand as well as blue container stuff .
How ever with drive and indeed IPS pod oil they only sold and recommend VP ,s own stuff in the branded containers .

Interesting VP allow there dealer networks use a different approach to engine oil and gear oil .They allow endorse alternative engine oils but not gear oils

In fact in the last few years doing our own yard work 2/3 with the VP outdrive set up and more recently 3/4 with a shaft drive set up in a busy yard I don,t think I have ever seen anyone using anything else other than VP gear oil in VP s drives and pods .
White van man included .

Who would risk not using VP branded gear oil with IPS pods - you really are re shaking the dice there going for a double 6 .
 
Assassin said:
Many things are boiled off and not just moisture, dispersants break down many things and many are turned into gases which are also evaporated off. All engines and drives have some form or method of ventilating them off and not necessarily through a breather, some may have breathers and some may simply have enough internal clearances to allow any gases to escape.
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I think you're missing the point. Outdrives are susceptible to water contamination due to leaking seals etc. Volvo claim that their gear oil is unique in having additives that protect against this. Unless you have some insider knowledge then I would suggest that you are speculating (gambling) on whether this claim is valid or not.
 
Portofino said:
Then why don,t VP endorse there gear oil products on the label on the back in the small print ?
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I would say simply because they don't have a specific specification that can be quoted. WIth engine oil, Volvo recommend VDS3/4 so other manufacturers can say their oil meet this spec. If there was anything magical about Volvo's gear oil, it would have a special spec that others can then meet.
 
CLB said:
I would say simply because they don't have a specific specification that can be quoted. WIth engine oil, Volvo recommend VDS3/4 so other manufacturers can say their oil meet this spec. If there was anything magical about Volvo's gear oil, it would have a special spec that others can then meet.
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As others dont have the additives then they obviously cant clain they do so that’s perhaps why they are not shown on the label as is done with engine oils. Gear oils would be a very small market compared to that of 15/40 so maybe thats why other supliers haven’t bothered.
Still waiting for one of the forum volvo experts to confirm?
 
Boat2016 said:
As others dont have the additives then they obviously cant clain they do so that’s perhaps why they are not shown on the label as is done with engine oils. Gear oils would be a very small market compared to that of 15/40 so maybe thats why other supliers haven’t bothered.
Still waiting for one of the forum volvo experts to confirm?
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Won't happen cos they don't know. I would also like someone to answer why Volvo don't give their secret formula some kind of Volvo specific spec, like they do with engine oil.
 
CLB said:
In that case, why have, and publicise, VDS for engine oil?
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Not working for Volvo I have no idea but I suspect it's because engine oil is engine oil! Unlike outdrive gear oil, It's not susceptible to water contamination and is therefore more of a commodity, for example VDS3 is used on Volvo trucks.

I suspect that if Volvo thought they could get away with monopolizing oil sales for their engine they would.
 
petem said:
I think you're missing the point. Outdrives are susceptible to water contamination due to leaking seals etc. Volvo claim that their gear oil is unique in having additives that protect against this. Unless you have some insider knowledge then I would suggest that you are speculating (gambling) on whether this claim is valid or not.
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I don't believe that one bit. Your quote may be correct, but its VP marketing if your statement is correct. I had DPS drives for 14 years and used Mobil gear oil with no issues.
 
Some good points Portofino but to answer your question, the reason they don't put their various approvals on the packaging is space and cost.

One lubricant will meet many specifications and if they put them all on their packaging these would have to be huge containers to put the labelling on; this is why the manufacturers and retailers have data sheets and websites, many will actually post you the data sheets and the product data sheets for free if you request them, but it is much easier for the manufacturer to put their specs and approvals into a single document and post them on their websites where people can read them and download them if they require them. In point of fact, the previously named companies all make oil which meets and exceeds the specifications for the aforementioned VP drives and they are all approved by VP.

Its not Redline in America which produces VP packaged oil as its amsol which currently produces the majority of it; in Europe Exxon Mobil produce the majority of it.
 
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