What causes a furling genoa to jam?

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steve yates

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After it's furled and you try and unroll it with the sheet?

I got the furling drum round to the right side today, put the sail up and voila, it furled beautifully.
Could I get it out gain? Could I heck.

I was hauling on the port sheet, realised on the drive home I never tried the starboard sheet, :o

I'm sure either sheet should be able to unfurl it though?

It rolls out to about a small triangle 3ft x2ft, then jams solid.

Had to get the kids home so left it furled up, but I'm assuming I will have to unclip the sheets and just hand over hand the jib back round the forestry to unfurl it and start again?

Could I have wound the initial line in the furling drum the wrong way?

This is my last problem to sort out so I can actually get the boat out sailing, to try her out before fixing the myriad of other wee things that seem to be cropping up. :)
 
Could be a number of reasons depending on which make of furler.

Most common is the top of the sail catching on a spinnaker halyard or other line at the mast head.
Another on the cheaper furlers is too much tension on the halyard.
I've known the top halyard deflector come loose and snag.
On some plastimo furlers if you attach the halyard shackle the wrong way round it will lock.
Also the inner plastic sheave can break down inside and jam up on the forestay wire.
Bottom end then its usually a drum issue of some sort.
The furlex 100s for example has four sections that make up the top and bottom of the drum and I've seen these break and jam.
On some furlers there's is little room for the knot on the furler line and whilst it works ok one way on the other the knot moves and jams.

Like I said there's lots of possible reasons.
 
steve yates said:
After it's furled and you try and unroll it with the sheet?

I got the furling drum round to the right side today, put the sail up and voila, it furled beautifully.
Could I get it out gain? Could I heck.

I was hauling on the port sheet, realised on the drive home I never tried the starboard sheet, :o

I'm sure either sheet should be able to unfurl it though?

It rolls out to about a small triangle 3ft x2ft, then jams solid.

Had to get the kids home so left it furled up, but I'm assuming I will have to unclip the sheets and just hand over hand the jib back round the forestry to unfurl it and start again?

Could I have wound the initial line in the furling drum the wrong way?

This is my last problem to sort out so I can actually get the boat out sailing, to try her out before fixing the myriad of other wee things that seem to be cropping up. :)
Click to expand...

Welcome to sailing, where things that work perfectly... suddenly don't. But see, actually that's precisely the point when you're kinda tested as a sailor. Anyone can sail a boat that works perfectly with zero problems Lots harder when they don't. Imagine how godawful with an ancient ole boat that didn't much work even when new. Although i supose they don't have furlers. Hm. Anyway I bet ther furling line is all twisted and hence doesn't go in nicely - it takes a riding turn as others have suggested. On a calm day in the marina, unfurl the foresail, and then go to the start of the line (at the furler) and undo the line (and sail) manually out of the furler, might need a screwdriver to push the rope around so you can undo it... and eventually it will un-jam. THEN... un-twist the furling line all the way through it's length, back to the cockpit. Whilst you're at it, have a close look at the furler mechanism too, noting carefully how it's not perfect like (say) most bits of a Japanese car, but a bit rough here and there, perhaps not big enough etc, perhaps like most bits of a French car of (say) 50 years ago. Cos that's where boats are at the moment. One day they might be japanese and be half the price and have optional whale-harpooning gear, which will all work perfectly. Until then, yer gotta get used to fixing stuff. Next thing the forecast will be wrong - even if you pay for it. Ratbags!
 
Keep light tension on the furling line when unrolling - deploying - the sail, and in reverse slight tension on the leeward sheet when furling; I have seen failure to do that result in wraps on the drum.

Important; tie at least one short line right around the furled sail when leaving the boat, and secure the furling line + sheets well.

Otherwise there is a large risk of the sail unrolling in a strong wind and flogging itself to bits while you're away; remember that line around the whole furled sail.
 
Stork_III said:
Usual causes are riding turn on the drum or halyard wrap.
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If "halyard wrap" is not immediately obvious as a term, I think it means where the swivel at the top of the sail does not rotate freely relative to the foil as the latter turns. The purpose of the swivel is so that the halyard does not wrap around the fore-stay or foil. So lack of freedom, due to binding, can get things all tangled after a few turns.

How much binding friction can be tolerated depends on the geometry of how the halyard leads to the swivel.

HTH, Mike.
 
Agree with all above / few additional comments:

  1. An empty drum with a fully furled sail means sail won't fully furl in a blow!
  2. Have a look up the mast and check for any sign of a halyard wrap. If you see one DO NOT apply hard tension and NEVER put the furling line near a winch! This will likely require a new forestay plus pricey furled repairs.
  3. If it's not a riding turn or wrap, lower the sail, tension system using a short strop between drum and swivel and then manually test swivel plus drum for stiffness. Follow man instructions if any problem found.
  4. Whatever the problem turns out to be it wld be a good idea to take a whiz up mast and inspect forestay for loose strands, etc.
 
Boat on its mooring the reefing line came off the drum, genoa unfurled, mast came down bent and bow roller torn out, sailing finished for 2015! I'm glad I belong to a good yacht club with helpful members.
 
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If it's become prone to jamming then failing to keep a light tension on either the furling line or the sheet as they are wound back in will make jamming more likely.
If not caused by halyard wrap which is easy to see, then the top bearing may either have become unscrewed/ill adjusted ,allowing the balls to wear and then jam in an oversize gap.If they are Torlon even a few broken balls will somehow manage to spoil the work of the other 28 or so.
 
Thanks folks, will have a good look when I next go down, particularly for the halyard wrap, though it looked clear on my initial glance.

As for going up the mast, can you even do that on an 18 ft boat with a wee mast? Don't fancy my chances on mine the way the rigging is going at the moment :)

The backstay attches to 2 wires at the back attached to the outer parts of the stern, one of those has split wires showing, so I'll be replacing that part for sure.

steve
 
steve yates said:
Thanks folks, will have a good look when I next go down, particularly for the halyard wrap, though it looked clear on my initial glance.

As for going up the mast, can you even do that on an 18 ft boat with a wee mast? Don't fancy my chances on mine the way the rigging is going at the moment :)

The backstay attches to 2 wires at the back attached to the outer parts of the stern, one of those has split wires showing, so I'll be replacing that part for sure.

steve
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A nice thing about an 18-footer is that you can easily drop the mast against a convenient quay/harbour wall when the tide goes out.
Just ease off the offside shroud(s) and use a halyard to lower it then manhandle it ashore.
 
Excessive tension on the jib halyard can make a sail hard to furl or unfurl, especially if the bearings haven't been lubricated properly. It's part of our routine to ease the halyard before furling.
 
On my Furlex (200-S) the most common cause of a hard jam is the extruded aluminium luff foil which slips down inside the drum. It's held with a star-socket (instead of Allen) grub-screw either side, but these can loosen unless done up with Loctite - which isn't mentioned in the manual of course. If the foil has slipped (it only takes 1") it stops it turning in either direction, and is quite independent of halyard or line wraps.
 
It's a plastimo, saw the name on the bottom drum the other day.
And yes, halyard wrap seems to be the main problem, it's catching on the topmost plastic swivel thing. If I hold the halyard out to the side as someone hauls on the sheets, it unfurls ok.

The furling line jams sometimes if the turns ride over or a bit gets under the drum and snags on the bolt heads. It's a very thin cord, basically string, 2mm or so? I'm guessing it has to be thin, but do you think a slightly thicker cord might be less likely to ride over? It would certainly be easier to get a grip,on.

I'm guessing I can't add a strop at the top as the sail won't then be hoisted properly. I have a spare dinghy jib, I'm wondering if I should try that on, with a strop?

Actually, scratch that, it's a hank on jib, maybe my spare graduate mainsail will work as a genoa on here? :)
 
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Regarding a strop,You just need to get the halyard swivel below the round donut that should be on top of the foil .Hoist sail up as high as it will go ,measure the gap at the bottom and use that as the strop distance .Try furling with it in the higher position and see weather that cures it .
If not working you will need a diverter fitted to the front of the mast .
Cindy
 
steve yates said:
It's a plastimo, saw the name on the bottom drum the other day.
And yes, halyard wrap seems to be the main problem, it's catching on the topmost plastic swivel thing. If I hold the halyard out to the side as someone hauls on the sheets, it unfurls ok.

The furling line jams sometimes if the turns ride over or a bit gets under the drum and snags on the bolt heads. It's a very thin cord, basically string, 2mm or so? I'm guessing it has to be thin, but do you think a slightly thicker cord might be less likely to ride over? It would certainly be easier to get a grip,on.

I'm guessing I can't add a strop at the top as the sail won't then be hoisted properly. I have a spare dinghy jib, I'm wondering if I should try that on, with a strop?

Actually, scratch that, it's a hank on jib, maybe my spare graduate mainsail will work as a genoa on here? :)
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If it now looks like halyard wrap and if you have previously been tugging very hard on a sheet to try and unfurl it, it is probably necessary to inspect the wire forestay beneath the foil. This is a very good way to damage the strands of the wire. I had a halyard wrap issue shortly after buying my boat and because of it a brand new forestay had to be replaced after only a single season.
 
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