GrahamM376
Well-Known Member
Later ones may look like they have skegged rudder but it isn't, it's just a faring.
Westerly Centaur vs Jeanneau Fantasia 27 (Bilge Keel)
- Thread starter CeesH
- Start date
Later ones may look like they have skegged rudder but it isn't, it's just a faring.
dylanwinter
Well-Known Member
CeesH
New Member
@Dylan, love your website and Harmony. Spent many hours on KTL. Harmony is on focus but its a B-Layout and thats for me the only minus, a new standing rig doesn't cost a fortune, the same counts for a service to her sails but but but "B"
Again thanks a lot for what you and your hummy share with us.
CeesH
Again thanks a lot for what you and your hummy share with us.
CeesH
aquaplane
Well-Known Member
C layout are not common. You may be looking for rocking horse shit.
I think a C layout is about optimal but my B layout is similar in that the table and washboards and other **** that can be pushed gown the Starboard quarter berth would go in the cockpit locker if I had a C layout. But the grandson wouldn't, and all the rest can go in the cockpit for the odd occasion the grandson is aboard with his parents.
I think a C layout is about optimal but my B layout is similar in that the table and washboards and other **** that can be pushed gown the Starboard quarter berth would go in the cockpit locker if I had a C layout. But the grandson wouldn't, and all the rest can go in the cockpit for the odd occasion the grandson is aboard with his parents.
dylanwinter
Well-Known Member
I also wanted a C layout - but they are very rare. The stern locker is massive - and for most of the trip we kept the dinghy, the bike, two outboards and the bedding down the quarter berth. When there were five aboard then the outboards went on the stern and the dinghy on roof.
well pleased with her
aquaplane
Well-Known Member
The Jeanneau Fantasia is a modern looking boat, I looked at them as an upgrade from my Centaur.
Going for the "French Layout" with the aft bog and aft cabin may be attractive.
I don't know how I would like the open plan saloon, you need to go for the 29' version to get a separate forecabin.
Going for a later version Centaur is a good plan, many of the faults had been addressed.
Droppy headlinings on boats of this vintage are not restricted to Westerlys despite he condition being named Westerly droop.
Buy a Konsort if you can afford one.
Going for the "French Layout" with the aft bog and aft cabin may be attractive.
I don't know how I would like the open plan saloon, you need to go for the 29' version to get a separate forecabin.
Going for a later version Centaur is a good plan, many of the faults had been addressed.
Droppy headlinings on boats of this vintage are not restricted to Westerlys despite he condition being named Westerly droop.
Buy a Konsort if you can afford one.
aquaplane
Well-Known Member
That's what I do too but you can't get round the fact that the C layout is 4 berth and the B layout is 5 berth, something has to give and it's flexibility. For the two of us a C layout would be good, but for visitors the B layout works better.
Well pleased with our B layout too.
Grumpybear
Well-Known Member
I think the Jeanneau Sundream was the successor to the Fantasia. We had one for two years before trading up. Well worth a look - I think they did a lifting keel version, though ours had a fin. They are quick - I believe there is an active racing fleet in Cork.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
The usual comments : it's French so it must be Sh one T.
Here are some comments (in French) of those who actually know the boat:
http://hisse-et-oh.com/forums/forum...675771-fantasia-est-ce-vraiment-un-bon-bateau
http://www.annoncesbateau.com/voilier/annonces-modele-jeanneau-fantasia.html
http://www.voilesetvoiliers.com/fiche-technique/ship_id=26946/
http://www.annoncesbateau.com/fiche-technique-bateau/fiche-technique-bateau-JEANNEAU-FANTASIA/
http://www.sailboat-data.com/fr/voilier/44-jeanneau-fantasia-27
https://www.hisse-et-oh.com/bateaux/fantasia
CeesH
New Member
Thanks Sybarite, your second link is much appreciated. In the area from Brest to Bordeaux I located at least 6 swing keel versions (Quille Dérive) and well within my budget. I must start planning my visit to France and the UK. I want to try to cross the pond at the end of this year, spending early next year quality time with my wife in Suriname.
CeesH
CeesH
Seajet
...
FWIW,
the Fantasia I looked over in 1989, ashore at Hamble Point brokerage and seriously falling apart, was a lift keeler.
the Fantasia I looked over in 1989, ashore at Hamble Point brokerage and seriously falling apart, was a lift keeler.
White Angel
Active Member
I've sailed a Westerly Pembroke (fin keel version of a centaur I believe) and a Fantasia, both on charter in Greece. As many have suggested, very different boats. The westerly much more solid, the Fantasia lighter, but for me more fun to sail, though I wouldn't want to out in one in rough weather. I found the Fantasia interior lighter, roomier and more pleasant to spend time in. I'd choose the westerly if a solid safe boat was the main criteria, but if it was to sail in sheltered waters where rough weather could be avoided I'd choose the Fantasia. Eg. For Portsmouth to Cowes, the Fantasia. Portsmouth to Cherbourg, the Centaur. Portsmouth to Brazil, neither!
Iliade
Well-Known Member
IMHO the A layout Centaur is the best: One can dine while looking out of the (toughened glass) windows, the quarter berths are ideal for use at sea and make very large dry lockers when moored.
The companionway hatch arrangement is, however, dreadful on these early boats. Mine leaks like an open hatch in a seaway! Aftermarket hatch garages are available.
Finally no layout of Centaur has an aft mounted galley nor room to swing an oven. I keep considering modifying the dead space forward of the starboard quarter berth for that purpose, though I currently have a top loading 'fridge mounted there and it will not fit where the existing hob is without cutting into the cupboard below.
As previously mentioned, these boats are built like brick outhouses. The downside of which is not so much performance limitations, since the good seakeeping allows me to drive Sevenem harder, especially in rougher seas, than my previous lightweight racer, but that they are normally just too heavy to tow behind any car under European regulations.
I would trust mine to get to Brazil leaving on the next high tide, but as I'm not Shane Acton I'd probably be stir crazy by the time I got there. Would be easy to carry as deck cargo though. Very solid when sat on her keels, maybe just add a prop at the bows if not possible to lash down. Fuel tank is a bit small so I'd want several plastic jerrycans of diesel stashed somewhere.
The companionway hatch arrangement is, however, dreadful on these early boats. Mine leaks like an open hatch in a seaway! Aftermarket hatch garages are available.
Finally no layout of Centaur has an aft mounted galley nor room to swing an oven. I keep considering modifying the dead space forward of the starboard quarter berth for that purpose, though I currently have a top loading 'fridge mounted there and it will not fit where the existing hob is without cutting into the cupboard below.
As previously mentioned, these boats are built like brick outhouses. The downside of which is not so much performance limitations, since the good seakeeping allows me to drive Sevenem harder, especially in rougher seas, than my previous lightweight racer, but that they are normally just too heavy to tow behind any car under European regulations.
I would trust mine to get to Brazil leaving on the next high tide, but as I'm not Shane Acton I'd probably be stir crazy by the time I got there. Would be easy to carry as deck cargo though. Very solid when sat on her keels, maybe just add a prop at the bows if not possible to lash down. Fuel tank is a bit small so I'd want several plastic jerrycans of diesel stashed somewhere.
benjenbav
Well-Known Member
I owned a Fantasia 27 with a fin keel for 4 years. The surveyor who surveyed her (in 2002) was very disparaging about the light build compared to similar vintage moody and westerly offerings but this did not immensely concern me as she was intended to be used for day sailing in the Solent. I had no problems beyond routine maintenance.
dave_gibsea
Well-Known Member
I had a Jeanneau Eolia for some years, 2 ft shorter than the Fantasia and almostt he same layout/build etc. Sailed the boat cross channel in some big winds, got caught in 35kts+ coming home once and was almost knocked flat coming in to Poole entrance in a big sea, sailied the boat to Finland and back with all sorts of weather and even raced a few times. The boat was superb and never let us down, no structual problems. I woudl say the rig was a bit over engineeered with a large section mast. Interior was nice with a mix of wood and fabric, maybe the fabric was not a great idea and would need changing every five or six years but not a big or expensive job. Head-lining in pannels screwed to the cabin roof so no problems with the dreaded "droop" Westerlies are famous for. Engine on ours was Yanmar 1GM10, very reliable, easy to service but expensive on parts.
The problem with any boat once its more than say 5 years old is that it's conditoon depends on how well it has been maintained and looked after. You can't say one thype of boat is better than another once they are 20 or 30 (or more) years old as you will find good and bad examples of anything.
One thing I will say (having sailed both and many other boats) is that the Jeanneau wll sail rings round the Westerly in pretty much all conditions - if that's important to you or not (I don't know). These are all personal preferences but sailing boats by their very nature aren't fast. An hour on a 14 hour crossing doesn't sound much until you are cold and tired and ready for that beer and some hot food!
Good luck and use your own judgement, don't be swayed by prejeduice!
The problem with any boat once its more than say 5 years old is that it's conditoon depends on how well it has been maintained and looked after. You can't say one thype of boat is better than another once they are 20 or 30 (or more) years old as you will find good and bad examples of anything.
One thing I will say (having sailed both and many other boats) is that the Jeanneau wll sail rings round the Westerly in pretty much all conditions - if that's important to you or not (I don't know). These are all personal preferences but sailing boats by their very nature aren't fast. An hour on a 14 hour crossing doesn't sound much until you are cold and tired and ready for that beer and some hot food!
Good luck and use your own judgement, don't be swayed by prejeduice!
davidpbo
Well-Known Member
There are a couple of Fantasias on Windermere and to me they look like a larger version of my Jeanneau Tonic 23.5.
My concern would be, how are the shrouds attached?
The layup is probably light for a boat of this size.
We like the open plan layout with a separate heads. Privacy on a boat of this size is at best an illusion.
It cost me about £1000 for materials (Vinyl, Glue Etc.) to replace the headlining on the 23.5. As I had about 3m of material left over, I doubt a Fantasia would cost significantly more. I bought 3m over and above what I thought I needed in case I cocked a panel up but didn't, or at least not in a way that I couldn't get around it.
My concern would be, how are the shrouds attached?
The layup is probably light for a boat of this size.
We like the open plan layout with a separate heads. Privacy on a boat of this size is at best an illusion.
It cost me about £1000 for materials (Vinyl, Glue Etc.) to replace the headlining on the 23.5. As I had about 3m of material left over, I doubt a Fantasia would cost significantly more. I bought 3m over and above what I thought I needed in case I cocked a panel up but didn't, or at least not in a way that I couldn't get around it.
Laurie
Well-Known Member
I'm trying to remember...someone circumnavigated in a TK Fantasia....... and yes it is in essence a bigger Tonic
CeesH
New Member
After reading a lot about the French sailboats in the less then 30' class I came to the conclusion to forget them. In the UK there are numerous yards that has build nice to very nice bilge keeler's. My list now looks as follows;
#1. Sarum 28' Cruising XT, an aluminum Bilge Keeler. I have never heard from Sarum but I like a lot what I see and read.
#2. Seamaster 815, Polyester Bilge Keeler. I like the more modern looks and what I found about this boat fits.
#3. Prospect 900, a Van de Stadt design. Polyester Bilge Keeler with a Center Keel. Never heard of and I know nothing about this 3 Keel boat, but again I like what I see.
#4. Westerly Centaur, Still on the list but it has to be a C-Layout.
Any input about the fore mentioned sailboats is more as welcome, as I explained I know nothing about the boats #1., #2. and #3.
Thanks, CeesH
#1. Sarum 28' Cruising XT, an aluminum Bilge Keeler. I have never heard from Sarum but I like a lot what I see and read.
#2. Seamaster 815, Polyester Bilge Keeler. I like the more modern looks and what I found about this boat fits.
#3. Prospect 900, a Van de Stadt design. Polyester Bilge Keeler with a Center Keel. Never heard of and I know nothing about this 3 Keel boat, but again I like what I see.
#4. Westerly Centaur, Still on the list but it has to be a C-Layout.
Any input about the fore mentioned sailboats is more as welcome, as I explained I know nothing about the boats #1., #2. and #3.
Thanks, CeesH
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Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
Won't it come unscrewed & fall apart if you do that
White Angel
Active Member
I sailed a prospect 900 for about 5 yrs. Built by an East Coast yard called Ridgeway Marine, later Pegasus yachts which were better known for the lively Pegasus 700 and 800. The prospect was more cruising than performance oriented, though faster than a centaur in my experience. The interior felt more modern and spacious than a centaur, though the only double is had by converting the table. The centaur is more strongly built. The Prospect came with 3 keel options: a fin, a lifting keel, or triple keel. The latter having a heavy centre stub (the same as the lifting keel), and two bilge plates made of a composite material. Mine was originally the triple keel, but when struck by another boat when both were ashore in a storm, one if the bilge plates shattered. It was heavily criticised by the surveyor who argued the keels were of an inappropriate material and represented a latent defect. During the repair, I had the boat changed to the fin keel version by the original builders. I sailed mine from the Solent to Normandy, channel Isles and Brittany, sometimes in decidedly rough weather, and the boat always got me through.