waterproof remote moonitors?

zefender

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I appreciate that some plotters (fitted by the nav table) can manage repteaters to enable the boat's position to be seen from the cockpit. However, I have a PC based nav system. Does anyone know if I'm able to get a water/splashproof VGA monitor and whether the video signal can travel that far, or do I need a signal booster too? Plan B involves taking advantage of the perspex hatch and projecting the image to the saloon bulkhead which I can see from the wheel. This seems a bit daft though....

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salamicollie

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I can't be specific on the availability of water proof LCD screens - they are available for industrial use, the issue may be power supply (and price!). As to the actual video signal if you intend to use a normal computer VGA/SVGA signal this can go at least 50ft providing you use high quality monitor cable - more may need to be boosted. Other video standards and the dreaded USB can be more of a problem.

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zefender

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Thanks for that - so I'm alright on the cable bit then...

I asked this question at the LBS and got lots of puzzled looks from supplier salesmen. I've looked at little 7in LCD TV monitors for cars but these are not VGA. At the risk of getting a bit PBOish, there's not a signal convertor of some sort is there?

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salamicollie

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If you have a PC you can fit a graphics card with TV out, for a Laptop its a little harder -

You can get scan convertors from www.keene.co.uk and others - search for scan convertors on Google. Keene do one for about £130 for XGA to TV- what you probably need, but there may be cheaper alternatives depend on what input standards are accepted by the LCD screen...

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AlanPound

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Main problem with ordinary colour LCDs is that the wash out in sunlight. Take your laptop into the garden to see... you would almost believe that the display had actually failed.

Most good purpose-built units have some kind of high-brightness displays...

Alan

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tome

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We supply a waterproof transflective VGA (640 x 480) colour screen with our navigation systems. These are designed for outdoor use, although they are marginal in direct sunlight. They cost around £1300 each and are supplied with a 5m cable which can be extended to around 15m without appreciable loss of quality. They are housed in a solid aluminium enclosure with o ring seals etc.

Our market is 'internal' ie we don't sell to third parties, but I can put you in touch with the screen manufacturer if this is the route you want to take - PM me for details.

Regards
Tom

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qsiv

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I have found huge difficulty with this. You could use the new B&G screen, - but thats £6,000....

My feeling is to go for a separate 'tablet' and run a remote desktop service via Bluetooth (or indeed USB, or ordinary wireless ethernet). If you did this you could even use a Compaq Ipaq as a window into the nav software - and no scope for damaging the main system. We are also getting/due to get SmartDisplay which is a dedicated solution for remoting into machines - casio do a ruggedised version (see <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=MPC-701&asource=>here</A> for a price).

There just doesnt seem to be a simple, low cost solution - but I feel that the handportable, wireless route is the most versatile - and certainly works well for me.

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philmarks

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I don't understand, what's all this electronics stuff got to do with remote mooning. Come to that, how does one moon remotely?

I'm Welsh and don't undertand these strange unWelsh habits,

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zefender

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Not a cheap solution though! Pleased to learn I'm not alone on this problem and thanks for the advice.

I'm going to get a small 12v LCD TV screen (7" about £60 new on ebay) and use the video out socket from the PC (or maybe a PC-TV interface). If it works, I'll then work out how to rainproof it. It may of course be far too small to see much at all - but we'll see.




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qsiv

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I have a nasty suspicion readability will be an issue - most TV screens of that size have only 234 vertical pixels - assuming you have a minimum of 600, that implies a LOT of squeezing. OTOH, the horizontal resolution is often better than 1000 pixels, so there will be pixel mapping issues in that direction as well. I think there is a good reason why PC aspect ratio screens are more expensive - they have more pixels ... and daylight viewability is very expensive, transflective is the only good way to solve the problem.

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zefender

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Re: waterproof remote monitors?

Suspect you may be right. But if it's smaller, I should be able to give it some 'shade' . In terms of squeezing, I'm hoping it'll have a zoom facility so that I can concentrate only on the middle of the screen (i.e. where the boat is). If it's all rubbush, then I'll just connect it to the DVD and watch movies whilst on night passages (most unseamanlike suggestion!)

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tome

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Raymarine have also just released a very good waterproof XVGA screen which works well in direct sunlight, but it's £3600. They recently brought one round for a demo and it's quite superb, if you can afford it!

I need 40+ to replace our older monochrome screens so am actively looking at many options including tablet PCs. Fujitsu make one with a reflective screen which is outdoor viewable <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.fpc.fujitsu.com/www/products_pentablets.shtml?products/pentablets/pencentra_200>http://www.fpc.fujitsu.com/www/products_pentablets.shtml?products/pentablets/pencentra_200</A>

We've rejected the wireless route for now (security issues).

Good luck with your search!

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qsiv

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It certainly is good - but I feel it's aimed more at the chart table (bizarre) due to it's size. For my purposes I'd also rather have something that is portable - at least to a degree. The number of boats that have space to cockpit mount a screen as big as the Raytheon are few and far between - I know on my 50 footer I havent got the bulkhead space.

That Fujitsu looks nice - but is only really viable as a remote desktop terminal - CE is just too restrictive a platform for me (my software is written in Delphi and cant run on CE/PPC until a .NET version emerges). The remote is fine - at least you can have a big fast machine down below...

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tome

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Agree about the size, otherwise I might have been tempted to buy one to 'evaluate'! There's simply no space on my (37ft) boat.

Our software is also written in Pascal (DOS) or Delphi (Windows) so we have similiar problems with CE. The real time navigation core runs on an embedded PC with the application layer running on various platforms, linked by ethernet and UDP/IP protocols. We have a software group in Houston who will take on the application layer if we go to CE, but it will be ported to C++. Not a trivial task.

There are a number of ruggedised screen/PC options becoming available which may simplify the application development and we're currently evaluating these. If we come up with anything suitable, I'll post details. One option is to buy the OEM display/PC and package it ourselves but qualification and EMC testing will add around £30,000 to the costs of this.

Strikes me there's a market opportunity here!



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Twister_Ken

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At the risk of being branded a luddite...

(who me?) can I suggest you ask yourself why you want to do this? I know there's an easy answer to that question (along the lines of "because technology makes it possible") but do you really need a real time display of your position on a screen in the cockpit, when you have a real time picture of your position visible even in bright sunlight, just by looking outside of the cockpit? And if you really, really do, why not use an iPaq type h/held with a GPS sleeve and a suitable charting programme? The only possible reason I can think of for wanting the set-up you are aiming for is very complex pilotage in very confined spaces, probably happening at high speeds. And in that situation, would you want to be entirely reliant on electronics?



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zefender

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Re: luddites and gizmos

I don't specifically "need" it at all. But when shorthanded, or in iffy weather, I find it reassuring to see where I am from a chart perspective and maybe to compare with the eyeball stuff - without leaving a less-than-confident crew at the helm or switching on the autopilot.. I'm pretty pathetic at making out the right headland for example. If the chart position tells me the where I should be, as well as other stuff like depth and so on, I can compare that to my readings from the sounder etc. I prefer to to be in the cockpit than the nav table so it seems to make sense to have the same or similar resources there, rather than down below. It's not a matter of reliance on electronics. If they fizzle out, I'd have to do it the old laborious way anyway. But until they do, I prefer to exploit their help at all times. I'm a bit of a cautious soul and have two notebooks on board (one backup) and three GPS (2 as backup!). Gosh, do you think I've got Happyitis?

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MainlySteam

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Do you know what they currently use on the no expense spared race boats - IACC for example? I suspect still 'proofed notebooks, but I don't know.

John

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qsiv

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Almost anything - but I'm sure you'll find B&G RaceVision 2 (they are good, and I've got one on order for the new race boat), but at £6,500 they arent cheap

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qsiv

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The new version of Delphi (project : Octane) which will be Delphi 8, and is due out in about October, will be able to generate 'old style' code and also .NET assemblies. Now, the new version of CE/PPC OS due next year are reputed to be .NET, and as the .NET code is pcode, not machine code stuff generated in D8 will in future run on PPC platforms - at least that is what I have been told by 'weel placed sources' at Borland. It has also been said that D8 will represent the bug fixes for D7, as no service packs for D7 are planned.

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