VP MD2030 + MS25S stuck in reverse-solution/question!

[vas]

hello all,

helped my neighbour with a Bavaria 32 (iirc) moor last evening as he had some engine issues. Discussing about what happened, turns out that he reversed into his berth (med mooring), then went fwrd for his wife to pick the buoy and slightly overshot it so quickly turned to reverse at which time, engine engaged reversed and promptly died. Ended up with the gear lever stuck in reverse, not moving out, and although hes' got no auto security things to disable starter when in gear, starter struggled and couldn't even turn the engine (which was stuck with the box in reverse...)
I found it rather odd, googled it and found (not in here) a thread with exactly same symptoms (turning swiftly to reverse to avoid a buoy or hitting something) and engine stalling with lever blocked.
Anyway, solution was to remove the end plate of the gbox (4 M8 screws iirc) and then with a 17mm spanner force the shaft ending clockwise. Tried it, initially felt like it wouldn't move then gave it a bit more and loosened up with a small clack sound.
Plate back on, tested, works fine, no issues, guy v.happy that he skipped a large bill.

So that's the facts now for the Q:

Is that normal behaviour or does that imply a worn clutch cone or whatever you call that thing?
No idea on engine hours, boat age i'd say 30+, only thing I know is that's an ex-rental. Having said that, e/r was immaculate and overall condition v.good

cheers

V.

 

[Just_sayin']

You're testing my memory here but I helped a guy out who I think had the same problem.

He had had to do a real emergency turn, forward, reverse, forward, reverse, then the engine died.

Thudded into the pontoon on the other side of us ?.

The engine wouldn't start, locked solid.

We called an engineering company for him and sat him on our boat why they fixed it.

With a mix of Franglais and hands what seems to have happened is the selector fork on top of the gearbox should drop down into a recess when in forward, neutral or reverse. In between it rides over a cam.

His frantic gear changes had parked the fork on top of the cam and locked the engine.

Simple advice was to pause between shifting.

I'm sorry if this is not 100% correct mechanically but the message was clear.

 

[vas]

You're testing my memory here but I helped a guy out who I think had the same problem.

He had had to do a real emergency turn, forward, reverse, forward, reverse, then the engine died.

Thudded into the pontoon on the other side of us ?.

The engine wouldn't start, locked solid.

We called an engineering company for him and sat him on our boat why they fixed it.

With a mix of Franglais and hands what seems to have happened is the selector fork on top of the gearbox should drop down into a recess when in forward, neutral or reverse. In between it rides over a cam.

His frantic gear changes had parked the fork on top of the cam and locked the engine.

Simple advice was to pause between shifting.

I'm sorry if this is not 100% correct mechanically but the message was clear.

well what you're describing is probably not far off, but definitely more expensive than turning a locked shaft...
I'm more worried if that's a normal occurrence or a sign that something else will need attention soon (and that's not going to be cheap I fear!)

cheers

V.

 

[Just_sayin']

definitely more expensive than turning a locked shaft.i

Pretty sure it was €25 beer money for the engineers who luckily were due in port the next day.

Time? On boat guessing 20 minutes, undo plate, free fork, replace plate.

Yep, just remembered they hadn't bought a gasket or sealant with them but the pontoon came to the rescue ?

 

[vas]

OK, so similar then. Will wait and see any similar cases, else I'll consider it a rarity and try to relax the poor guy who's worried it may happen again any time...

V.

 

[VicS]

hello all,
.
.
So that's the facts now for the Q:

Is that normal behaviour or does that imply a worn clutch cone or whatever you call that thing?
No idea on engine hours, boat age i'd say 30+, only thing I know is that's an ex-rental. Having said that, e/r was immaculate and overall condition v.good
cheers
V.

The MS25S has multiple disc clutches, not cone clutches like the older MS2 type

 

[Lucky Duck]

OK, so similar then. Will wait and see any similar cases, else I'll consider it a rarity and try to relax the poor guy who's worried it may happen again any time...

V.

Had something similar on a friend's boat about six years back.

IIRC the engine stalled when reverse was selected when coming into a marina berth and wouldn't turn when re-start was attempted.

Originally we suspected something round the prop but the eventual fix sounds like what you described.

I don't think the problem has ever returned.

Engine was MD2030 but no idea about the type of saildrive. From memory the boat was built in the mid 1990s.

 

[VicS]

Had something similar on a friend's boat about six years back.
'
'
Engine was MD2030 but no idea about the type of saildrive. From memory the boat was built in the mid 1990s.

Mid 1990s i think would have had the older MS2 type gearbox

Perhaps I can understand a cone clutch getting stuck in gear (I wonder if that was in the days when they had ATF in them)
But absolutely no idea how the MS25S gearbox works

 

[vas]

The MS25S has multiple disc clutches, not cone clutches like the older MS2 type

heck, that's a lot of components!
I can confirm that I did turn #33 which is a 17mm clockwise (with above moderate force...) to unlock the thing.

as long as that's not a recurring fault, he should be fine and take it easy on changing from fwd to reverse...

cheers

V.