viewed 4 boats, best layout was the smallest!

S

steve yates

Well-Known Member
Joined
16 Oct 2014
Messages
4,106
Location
Benfleet, Essex/Keswick, Cumbria
Visit site
Looked at a westerly longbow 31, a mystere 26, a centaur and a jaguar 25 the other day, for my partner to see what they were like inside.

Hands down, the Jag wins on useable space, ability to sleep double in the forepeak and design layout inside. Yet it's the smallest! How does that work? :)

It's not neccesarily the boat I will get when the time comes, but it beats those other three in the accom stakes.

My question is, are any of the other three SIGNIFICANTLY better boats to sail or safer at sea than the jag? Enough to make up for the far superior accom?
 
I don't know if it is significantly bteer to sail than the Jag as I have not sailed a Jag but the Beneteau First 26 has a very useable interior space and is a good little sailer. I am somewhat prejudiced as I have one. Hubby and I mostly sleep in the forepeak and find it very comfortable. Mr Shan is 6ft3 in height to give you a sense of the space. We have also on occasion slept in the aft berth when we have friends on board and he stretches out comfortably.

We have also managed to convert the heads into a wet room, so no need to trudge to the shower block. Quite amazing what can be achieved on a small boat. Another helpful addition was refrigerating the cool box - as you don't need to fill it with ice, it is easier to pack more in.
 
The Jaguar 25 was originally a US designed boat - Catalina 25 and majors on space. Greater beam, fuller ends leads to more space inside. At the sort of sizes you were looking at a little bit extra makes a big difference. Longbow is just a stretched Centaur and the Mystere comes from a period when accommodation was an afterthought. Look at a Macwester 26, contemporary of the Centaur to see the difference. However, Mac sails nowhere near as well as a Centaur can. Jaguar 25 is perfectly adequate as a sailing boat.
 
It's not quite correct to say that the Longbow is just a stretched Centaur although I agree it looks like one when afloat. It is actually a fin keel boat and I am told has a very reasonable sailing performance. It was also available with an aft cabin as the Renown, most of which were ketch rigged, and also as bilge keel boats that were called the Berwick and Pentland.
 
"My question is, are any of the other three SIGNIFICANTLY better boats to sail or safer at sea than the jag? Enough to make up for the far superior accom? "

All things considered you will be safer in the bigger boat. Of course this can be hedged about with ifs and buts and it is easy to suggest exceptions but the case is generally accepted. You will often be more comfy as well as you will be less likely to be bashed about. As for accommodation you have clearly found "it all depends" :)
With the fall in prices it is difficult to see a case for buying a smaller used boat unless you have special requirements eg you want to tow it, own a restricted mooring, just require the boat for day trips, or whatever.

Sailing ability is a quite different thing. Some boats, old and new, might be described as dogs by one forum member and be praised to the skies by another. It depends what you are looking for. Dinghy performance is fab but not, perhaps if you want to cross a sea with the family and the dog, sipping tea from a china cup. Flat water upwind speed, much beloved of the racer, is great but not if you could not care less. The old advice is best; sail as much as you can to sort out your own ideas.
Someone warned me that my first boat was wet, would not go upwind and sailed sideways. I bought it anyway, they were right, I liked it a lot.
 
doug748 said:
With the fall in prices it is difficult to see a case for buying a smaller used boat
Click to expand...

Fixed running costs (berthing, liftout, hard, antifoul etc) remain the same irrespective of whether you paid 100k or 1k for your 30fter.

They will be substantially less for a 25fter
 
Great fan of the Jaguar 25.

I sailed a bilge keel version to and from the Azores. Sturdy and well built in my opinion although I did make a few 'enhancents' for the passage.
 
You are looking at similar boats to me. Look at a Jeanneau Fantasia, or Attalia.

A Consort may be top end price wise but worth a try. Even more a Konsort Duo if you fancy that sort of thing.

The Westery 33 is a better boat than one of the 31's ( Longbow, Berwick. Pentland, the other one).

The Moody 31 or 31S is worth looking at too.

There are other French boats too. Benetau 28.5 springs to mind.
 
How are you wasting the sellers time, if you have a shortlist of the boats you fancy, without comparing in the first place. You cannot judge on just what one reads.same as buying cars.
 
aquaplane said:
You are looking at similar boats to me. Look at a Jeanneau Fantasia, or Attalia.

A Consort may be top end price wise but worth a try. Even more a Konsort Duo if you fancy that sort of thing.

The Westery 33 is a better boat than one of the 31's ( Longbow, Berwick. Pentland, the other one).

The Moody 31 or 31S is worth looking at too.

There are other French boats too. Benetau 28.5 springs to mind.
Click to expand...

It is very difficult to generalise but I would agree with your comments re Westerlys, The bigger the boat generally the better the sea keeping. One thing to look for is displacement. a heavier boat will normally be more sea kindly but not necessarily the liveliest performer so you need to decide on your priorities. All of the old westerly boats were "safe" boats at sea and fairly easy to sail with few vices. They were also heavily laid up so longevity is good but many will be a bit sad inside. However there has been a lively interest in restoring older westerlys and if you find a good one they are nice boats to own. I may be biased though as I once rode out a F9 in the bay of Biscay in an Oceanlord and it was awesome.....
 
Daydream believer said:
did you tell the sellers that you were just wasting their time ?
Click to expand...
No need, 'twas in a marina, all on hard standing. Just took the keys and went for a wander on our own. Guy knew what we w ere looking at and new there was no instant sale coming.
Which means when time comes that marina will prob be one of the first places I will start looking.
 
You will not really know want you want until you've got one and sailed it for a while. The upshot of that is that you will almost inevitably find after a year or three you want something roomier, or sportier, or a different keel format or whatever, and want to sell your boat to get that. So bear in mind how re-saleable what you are looking at might be. Avoid thinking you are looking for the ultimate boat that will meet all your needs for ever. (If it turns out that way, great, but it probably won't.)

That also means you can reduce the mental agonising of trying to rationalise all factors to reach the perfect compromise, and let your heart decide to some extent: Eliminate boats that are obviously unsuitable for your relatively immediate needs, and then choose the one that you feel good about.
 
LittleSister said:
The upshot of that is that you will almost inevitably find after a year or three you want something roomier, or sportier, or a different keel format or whatever, and want to sell your boat to get that. So bear in mind how re-saleable what you are looking at might be. Avoid thinking you are looking for the ultimate boat that will meet all your needs for ever. (If it turns out that way, great, but it probably won't.)
Click to expand...
So true. I have said here before that all new entrants to yachting should start with a tradable yacht e.g. a Ford Fiesta of the boating world.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top